February 2025 Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

A new thread indeed!.

Well done, that's a huge thing to do. You da bomb 💣

Would it be possible to have your niece to stay with you on go with you for a little holiday?

Twatalert you asked how it made a difference.

One instance that springs to mind. I was about 6 and mother and I had gone to visit a friend of hers, we never saw her before or after, i don't know who she was.

She was lovely to me and brought me a glass of squash with a crazy straw in. I don't know if they're still around but it was a curly plastic straw made of hard plastic that you reused.

I thought it was wonderful and asked her if i could keep it, because I thought it was a throwaway straw. She said very gently 'no I'm sorry because then my little girl will miss it'.

I was devastated with embarrassment and whispered 'I'm sorry I thought it was to throw away, I didn't know' she whispered back 'I know you didn't know, I understand'.

I nearly cried at how kind she was and how she understood to whisper back so Mum didn't find out I'd asked for something.

I don't know who she was but in that moment I realised I wasn't horrific for asking for something and also that some Mums were kind.

I don't know that it ultimately did me any good but at least I didn't have to withstand some terrifying public meltdown over it. I wished I could be her little girl.

I don’t think these instances really mean something until afterwards. It may be years, decades before you realise that you have had a brushing with a safe person. Like me and mine you may never know how important you are, they may never tell you. When I left my ex husband and I met my IDVA who supported me she was one of those people who just instantly make you feel safe. They are very special people. My daughter’s head teacher is one of those people, a wonderful person who makes your nervous system back down. Ive met a few other ladies lately who are like water, flowing easily, no jealousy judgment or any fire just mellow and peaceful. They are rare.

I agree, i think they're earth angels

@Dogaredabomb not yet, as she's 11 and doesn't want to yet. This is what I am hoping though. That she can spend some school holidays at mine or we travel somewhere.

I can imagine how you felt about that straw. What a kind woman to whisper to you. She probably knew you'd be safer that way. I can see how you cherish that memory.

Why do toxic family members always have to stamp all over special occasions even when you are NC?

Easter is around the corner and the feet stamping has started from the in-laws. We are extremely LC with them to the point of being NC with them. The only contact is if they contact us, we never initiate any contact. The phone calls have started (which we are ignoring) with the “the children will be missing us, they must wonder where we have gone” messages (they don’t. We haven’t seen them for 5 years in person and the children actually don’t remember them). There is such a sense of self-importance with these people. They’ve spent over 2 decades delighting in making me feel excluded and left out because I’m “not blood” and throwing continuous insults and being generally as spiteful as they could. They’ve spent a lifetime making my DH feel worthless and excluded purely for being male, but they think they are important and we must miss them.

The children must simply have their Easter eggs off them apparently. The Easter eggs they’ve given them in the past have been the cheapest they can find in the shop, and just one each, with my son usually receiving a smashed up one or a battered box (because he’s male and they treat boys like second class citizens in the family). But to be honest, even if they were given eggs made of Gold we wouldn’t want them. The strings attached of having to see the bastards wouldn’t be worth it.

It irritates me when they say (mainly MIL) things like “why won’t you see ME, the children must miss ME” (Me and I are her favourite words) because the answer that sits in my head is “because we have SEEN you and we don’t fucking well like YOU”.

Thankfully we have a security camera now so at least we won’t have a doorstep tantrum from them, because funnily enough the doorstep tantrums that they tried to gaslight us into believing were reasonable all stopped once they knew they would be recorded. It’s sad the lengths we all have to go to on this thread just to try and have some peace in our lives.

lol to the “we don’t fucking like you”. It’s a great reason and often we do it because we just should but why when we don’t like these people. It must be the lack of self awareness, they can’t see any issues with themselves and the issue is with you just stopping contact for no reason whatsoever. I have the same with my ex, it’s all my fault, there’s not a single thing he’s done that could have possibly made me react the way I have because he is such a darling. Special occasions are just a good way in because it’s a normal thing to share this with loved ones (only they don’t get the memo they aren’t loved). It also puts a lot of blame onto us because we have to be the boundary enforcer and be the bad guy and they get to tell people just how bad we are to stop them. I still get talked about by my ex for not passing on a £50 Easter egg to our 3 year old (bloody ridiculous size egg) because he wasn’t allowed contact or to come onto my drive. He left it on my door step so I donated it to my solicitors office at the time. They use the occasion as an excuse to step the boundaries.

Yes, I think it is the opportunity for a way in that they take, plus I think they enjoy the stress that it causes, it gives them that little hit. And yes, they use it as an opportunity to throw more blame our way. It annoys me and stresses me out so much, I shouldn’t let it annoy me really, but it’s hard to stop that annoyed feeling. I’m NC with my own family of origin too, so I think it feels too much that the in-laws are toxic too. Life sometimes feels like we are playing whack-a-mole with the toxic members of both of our families, because they keep popping up to cause a bit of chaos. Actually my son has a whack-a-mole game, maybe I should stick photos of the toxic relatives on it and have a game of it, it might make me feel better!

My DH finds it really easy to compartmentalise things, he has no reaction to it at all beyond an eye roll at them. I wish I could be more like that. But I get an anticipatory worry before special occasions as well as a reaction when they do contact.

What I struggle with is the version of me that is spread to people in order to make me the villain. It is something I find hard to come to terms with. The worst is to my own child. I am very soft naturally, the hardness is difficult but is necessary. In families like this there is always toxic versions of people being spread, it does feel never ending. I have it both sides also, there’s never much simply peace.

I agree, the same has happened to me. The lies they make up are so far from reality too. Do you have a strong sense of justice? I do, and so I struggle with the unfairness of the lies being told, and then the unfairness of them being believed.
NC/LC doesn’t stop the toxicity infecting our lives.

I am ND so I have an incredibly high sense of fairness.

This reminds me of when my kids were little and my parents would visit, my mother would bring one bag of sweets bought at the airport. Dear god the fuss. You'd think she'd bought them each a horse.

I sometimes wonder if this performance is actually so they can tell other people they did it and tell themselves they're generous. It actually has nothing to do with us or our kids, it's all about the narrative.

DH says it's not that deep and the kids were literally an afterthought, and she bought 1 bag because she's mean (this is definitely true).

It’s got to be the biggest lie will tell ourselves….but they love me really. They bought a gift, they must love us really. It’s a horrid truth, one no one wants to admit to themselves. I feel awful for my daughter who is going to learn someday her dad doesn’t really love her. My partner who repeats his mum loves us really. She just doesn’t visit or buy gifts or call or visit….but that just my mum, she loves us really. Stone cold truth is no they are mean and they don’t love us. It’s not just your mum being your mum, people make the effort when then love you.

@Happyfarm 100%

I think 'love' as a label gets slapped on things that don't fit the definition. People feel that it's supposed to be there and so they kid themselves that it is. I often think it when people start with 'i love them but' and then describe utterly horrendous behaviour. I always say do you love them? And when they say yes I ask 'why?' sometimes you can see the wheels start to turn inside their head.

I know now my dad didn't love me. I don't think he was capable of it. I don't think my mother does either, though I'm not sure she can admit it to herself. But it's not there in how she behaves.

I don't think my parents love me either. It was one of the hardest realisations. And I don't love them. Love could never develop with the way they treated me. So they are just people my nervous system has a strong reaction to.

Narcs see you as an object they use to cover their insecurities and meet their needs. They don't see you as your own person with your own needs and belief system. That's why they get so offended if you disagree with anything. They see it as a personal attack.

@TrainTicket I agree even though I am nc with dsis I am still effected by the lies she has obviously told about me

I have no idea what she has told dm and family friends about me or what I have supposedly done. As she won't of told the truth that i caught her pinching dm money and she wanted me out the way so she could continue doing it so she can pretend to her friends she's well off and successful as apparently success to her is how many holidays and home improvements you do. She has actually said she is the most successful out of her friends as she has travelled the most ha ha dm always ended up footing the bill as she would book it then couldn't afford it

It will probably be that I am jealous us of her or I am the one after dm money when I've never had a penny from her as I am an adult and dont live beyond my means

What is hurtful is that none of them have asked for my side of the story or if I am ok etc.

@Spendysis I don't think other people don't want to hear your side, they probably know what a nightmare your sister is and just don't want to get involved. I don't think people want to challenge stuff or deal with the aggro.
I do it myself sometimes if someone is rude about someone I know in passing, I just roll my eyes and think they are wankers but I can't be arsed to get into it. Unless it's a close friend being maligned, then I'm likely to get right in the person's face.

I think it also depends on how well established the narcs image is. When they get themselves into positions of power and influence people tend to think they must be right because they are so believable and influential. They can taint you without any issues at all. They also don’t allow other people to know you so they don’t have firm opinions of you from one on one experience. We are not invited so it’s easy to talk bad about us. Therefore there must be something up with us. We play into their hands all the time whatever we do or don’t do.

@Spendysis Yes, a common tactic with people like this is to project what they have done onto you or to claim jealousy. In fact so many of them are convinced everyone is jealous of them.

It is very frustrating when people so willingly believe the lies and don’t hear your side. I try and view it as they’ve done me a favour, because the one gift narcissists give you is revealing who can be trusted and not trusted in your circle. The really hard part is when you realise there aren’t many people left who are loyal.

@Happyfarm Yes, I agree that it depends on how well established the Narcs image is. One of my relatives is that type of Narc - has put herself in a position of power and has a lot of influence, everyone believes every word she says. The weird thing is that they all seem to ignore the fact that she speaks badly about EVERYONE (I’ve never heard her say a good word about anyone unless she’s giving a patronising back-handed compliment) and is forever bigging herself up and making herself the hero of everyone’s story. They never think she can’t be trusted because she’s constantly gossiping and bad-mouthing people.

Yep unfortunately when I came into the family I’m guessing I was seen as a threat so have been given the title of scapegoat. There is no chance of a relationship with my partners parents and his Bro and SIL have ignored all my attempts to get together with the kids from the very beginning. Sad but it is what it is. I’ll take the title if it means I get to decide what’s normal and not in my own life. It’s a massive shame that both our sets of kids won’t have a relationship because I’ve been othered. It’s pathetic that the mum has sewed this seed to cause a rift because she is worried that she won’t get all the attention. It’s worked tho unfortunately. They always seem to “win” hate that word but they do seem to just get what they want one way or another.

Sorry, this is a bit of a brain dump, I don’t know why it came into my head, I’d been feeling pretty good.

For some reason I’ve just remembered some stuff from my childhood that has upset me

When I was 16 or so, maybe 17, I had a brain scan, after blacking out while on a horse. I went to see the consultant to get the results on my own. I was a child, hearing if there was something wrong with my brain, on my own. There is absolutely no way I could consider letting my daughter go through that on her own. I go with her to everything she wants me to. My mother didn’t work and there was grandparents to babysit so there was no excuse other than not giving a dam

My father drove me to the hospital, I don’t know where my mother was, obviously my brother had something more important going on. It was a joke for years, me walking out and saying my brain was normal……..

@tinaabbot urgh no that's not right at all. Thankfully all was good but no, a parent should have been there and talked to the doctor. I'm guessing though that this was just one of many instances during which you were left to your own devices when you shouldn't have been.

I was in hospital alone for a week when I was five. It was extremely traumatic. I had nightly flashbacks until not long ago. When I came out I didn't speak for a week. I couldn't comprehend what happened.

I tried to speak to my parents about it as an adult, telling them I didn't know what was happening. According to them it is BS as they explained to me beforehand that I was to go into hospital and I was all excited about it. Doesn't occur to them that I still didn't have a clue. And then they all laugh about how I sulked for a week by not speaking. I was fucking traumatised. They kept bringing it up every few years, laughing about it.

Oh wow @Twatalert, that’s horrific! Poor little you.

For me it does explain my absolute extreme independence

Funny how now my mother wants someone to come with her to doctors appointments…….