The only women I judge.... with deadbeat dads

[MsMarch]

As a rule, I'm one of those "irritating" women who generally takes the woman's side, every time. If there's even a sliver of doubt.... I'm on her side. I can't stand it when you see a thread about a man behaving like shit and there's loads of posts saying, "have you tried writing him a list" or whatever.

But.... I'm really finding the one exception to this rule is women who are with men who don't see and/or pay for their children. The ones who accept the stories about the "crazy ex", or "I can't go to court as she'll just make it worse for me and the DC" or "she turned them against me". How on earth can you be even slightly attracted to a man who is is so completely unable and unwiling to taker esponsibility for his chidlren? How?

SIL has just discovered that exBIL is back living with an ex (from after him and SIL broke up, but we can only assume they're back together). He has been MIA for 6 weeks (including over Christmas), having blocked her and their DC because he got kicked out of (another) shared accomodation and she refused to let him move back in with her and their DC. I KNOW what a wanker exBIL is (there's a reason he keeps getting kicked out of places he lives), but what does this woman see in him? Does she not think to herself, "Wow, he hasn't called, or made an effort to see his DC a single time in 6 weeks, not even over Christmas"

[To be very very clear - I'm NOT talking about the women who are supporting their partners as they do everything they can to maintain relationships with their children. Just the ones that have 10000 excuses and do nothing.]

I'm also astounded at some of the women who choose losers to be dads . As if this deadbeat has suddenly morphed into a bad person over night . Some women through a variety of reasons make very bad choices

100%

Women who get into relationships and have children with men who've got a track record - then act shocked the same happens to them?!

If you had a dog that had bitten all of its previous owners, you wouldn't hand feed it ham and then act shocked when you lost a finger.

Yep and also women who move random cocklodgers into their children’s home and prioritise dick over their kids wellbeing usually bleating ‘but I love him’

Sadly, it's a lot more complicated than this. You say they don't morph into a bad person over night but sometimes they do. Also sometimes the signs were there but easily ignored becase eeryone told the woman that it wasnt that bad or that SHE was the problem or because the woman has been socialisd to believe behaviours were normal or not that big a deal (see also SIL and exBIL - me and Dh were the only ones on her side for a long time, PIL in particular spent a lot of time telling her that she was "hard to live with" and "she should cut him some slack" and that "she's ended every relationship and she'll be alone forever at this rate").

But in the case of a woman who gets with a man who doesn't see hischildren - she KNOWS what he's like right up front. Why does she believe his bollocks?

Agreed, ex DH doesn't see our DC and is living with another woman. I imagine he spins her the old 'she's a crazy jealous ex who won't let me see my kids' line and that whole 'I'm such a great dad...my ex is soooo bitter.. she stops me seeing them!' Blah blah blah
Part of me would quite like to know exactly what story he has cooked up, but overall I'm glad I dont... not my circus and all that.
But yes i do wonder why she's seemingly so happy to be with such an absolute deadbeat

I don't think this is quite true. You don't always know who will and won't end up being a deadbeat. For some men, becoming fathers can be the absolute making of them. For others like my exDH, they can become resentful of the responsibility, angry at the changes motherhood can cause in their wives.

100% agree. Which is why I plan on being single for a very long time. Yes its lonely sometimes, and yes I would like a loving partner. But id never risk moving a man into my child's home.

Yeah, you sound like SIL. I was very impressed with how when she found out, she just went, "oh, okay, at least I know where he is" and didn't ask any further questions. Admittedly, she has been known to say that while she feels sorry for any woman who lands up with him, she selfishly would also love him to get another serious relationship because they'd he'd stop trying to inveigle his way into her life (not in a relationship way - he just always seems to think she's his back up plan for accomodation, money, social life etc. It's weird as it's been YEARS now so you'd think he'd have got the message? He was outraged when a young relative visited from another country last year and he wasn't invited for the family BBQ. He's never even MET this young man as far as I know!)

I had a colleaguewho finished a relationship as her partner was taking into account his children's feelings on meeting and didn't want to go on holidays over Christmas and not see them. She felt she should have been his priority and openly told us all this. So those women exist. I did exclaim at the time that I would be ending the relationship if he wasn't putting his children's needs first.

Argh, awful.

I think you're potentially being a little harsh. Many of these women will not be under the impression that the man has deliberately chosen not to see his children and won't pay for them. They'll have fallen hook, line and sinker for the lies about crazy, manipulative exes. They'll believe that the costs and biases in the court system means the poor man will never win so there's no point trying. They'll believe that he does pay maintenance (if he lies outright) and that the ex is lying or that he would pay maintenance but she'd only spend it on handbags and nails so he doesn't... etc.

It's often naive or wilfully ignorant, but IME it's rarely callous. It's often the case that women like this often carry their own emotional baggage that means they fall for the lies. Many will see themselves as the one person who can see this man's potential and fix him, or that he's just misunderstood. Some will get (false) validation that she's special because he's so good with her in comparison to the ex (not realising the pattern), some will carry lessons from childhood events and predisposed to bad judgment. Even wider society shores this up by having completely different expectations of mothers and fathers when it comes to parents separating.

Do I think such women are making bad judgments? Yes, absolutely. They're almost certainly walking headlong into a world of pain for themselves at some point down the line. Do I think they do so deliberately, from a place of emotional security and being well informed about the patterns of behaviour of abuse and/or deadbeat dads? Far less so. So I reserve my judgment for the men who walk away.

People put their short term selfish needs first then tailor the truth into a narrative that confirms their status.

Crazy ex story will help deadbeat dad and the foolish woman who sees the surface stuff will believe what she wants to believe.

They'll keep attacking "crazy ex" until new woman sees through it. Which she may not as she'd then have to face up to her own role in the story. And realise she's the new "crazy ex".

You do see it on here all the time, women who get into a relationship with a man who has young children (usually very quickly after his split with ex) and then make excuse after excuse as to why he’s a complete deadbeat dead who hasn’t seen his kids in years - always involving a ‘crazy ex’ who is ‘bitter and jealous’.
Then they have kids with him, he’s father of the year to his new family and forgets his older kids exist and the woman purrs about what a perfect t life they have like the cat that’s got the cream - until he then disappears to start family number 3

I know exactly why my ex's gf is with him..

She grew up in a country with less options than the UK, and is willing to accept less as a sad result of that. She works a min wage job, his is better paid. She has low self esteem. He's cleverer than her and has an answer for everything, as well as being horribly overbearing, so it's probably easier and safer in her view to just push everything under the rug and exist under his coercive control. She's also older than him, so rightly or wrongly that may play a part.

He DEFINITELY paints me as the "crazy ex". Nothing could be further from the truth, but how would she know that? He is a superb liar. I don't judge her for not seeing that. It took me years.

He also seems to accept HER child who's a bit older, so she is presumably happy with the crumbs he gives. I feel sorry for her. I'm so thoroughly relieved they aren't in our lives.

@resilience yes I mostly agree with your points. I think its mostly naivety rather than them being deliberately callous or enabling. I know nothing about exs new gf but I imagine she is probably blinded by love/ lust, as hes very handsome and charming. He's also incredibly good at lying and comes across as sincere. I do feel sorry for her in some ways and i really hope to goodness she isn't planning on having children with him. Or the cycle will just continue.

Was with my ex for 18yrs. He was a very hands on dad. He was even a stay at home dad while I worked for a couple of years. We broke up 2 years ago and he hasn't seen the kids since. People change.

These are the ones that frustrate me the most. Sometimes, the new partner is treating the children truly awfully and it just makes me so furious. And they attempt to
justify it with ‘but I’m scared to be alone’ bollocks.

Does she not think to herself, "Wow, he hasn't called, or made an effort to see his DC a single time in 6 weeks, not even over Christmas"

Someone who wouldn’t think that is someone just as bad as him, they obviously want him all to themselves but equally how do you know what he’s telling her? He can many any story up he likes that paints him the great hard done by dad

Poor self esteem, desperate for a man or and people don’t like this as it is very unkind they are thick as shit.

I presume she didn't have children? I'd say that she is entitled to set her boundaries as work for her, but that any man that put a new partner before children would be a huge red flag and just let that sit.

This! My DD's 'Dad' has been MIA for 9 years next month, no maintenance and no contact. Told the girlfriend he had just after he left, that I was a crazy ex and she lapped every drip of it up like a thirsty puppy! Apparently I don't let him see DD........... I have genuinely had zero means to contact him since a few weeks after he left in 2016. I don't even know what town/city he lives in! He changed his number, stopped using social media and seemingly changed his email address. But yeah, apparently I stop him seeing her and I'm a psycho...! 🤨

Totally agree. There is a bloke I know of with no home (as such) no job, no money, kids from previous relationship who are all but feral and yet some other woman has had a kid with him. The bar is set so low for herself and her child. Oh and they’re no longer together so all he does is pick up the random kids who have no manners, respect or boundaries and dump them at a relatives so they can scream and shout in the street. Classy

@hattie43 When I met DD's Dad he was the sweetest, gentlest guy I'd ever met. Had a nervous laugh, a twitch and could be described as 'meek & mild' by those who met him.
After we had the baby he changed completely. It was all an incredibly clever act which he executed to perfection.

But sure, blame the woman and assume she knew just what he was like 🙄🤦🏼‍♀️

Even the cock-lodger scenario is more complicated than it looks to the outside. In most cases the cock-lodger is abusive (financial manipulation of this kind is abusive) and even if no physical abuse is present, there will be a whole range of psychologically abusive behaviours going on. It rarely happens overnight either. It's a slow build up and has an awful lot in common with grooming. By the time the mother is 'choosing' the man over her DC, in most cases she'll genuinely believe that her own viewpoint, or that of her DC, is unreasonable and that she's acting in the long-term best interests of the whole family. Or she'll be so browbeaten by him/life in general, prioritising him is a survival mechanism as she's no energy left to do anything else.

It's also a mistake to think that women like this present as the victims they are (and they are, just not ones society considers 'deserving'). Many come across as utterly selfish, immature and aggressive - all of which can be a sign of emotionally stunted development/trauma from childhood, then compounded by bad adult experiences.It's incredibly sad really, and I've met several women who are devastated by the damage they've done to their relationship with their DC, and blame themselves, knowing they played an active part in it, and yet were completely unable to see that at the time.

There's no easy answer. However much sympathy I have for the women, I have more for the children. However, it would help if governments held fathers to greater account, beginning with zero tolerance for non-payment of maintenance.

I think a lot of women want to believe that they are different and Dick Head will no longer be Dick Head now he is with the right woman - They are wrong.
Its like women who want to believe that they are capable of spotting a wolf in sheeps clothing because if you can then you are safe from getting bitten aren't you?