How do I make OLD work for me?

[Oldfailed]

I am a divorced mother of 2 in my mid 40s. Name changed since I post frequently on MN. I work in a fairly high pressure corporate job. After years of living separately from my ex husband, and with the divorce finally done, I registered on Hinge and Bumble, since i haven't managed to meet anyone IRL. I am looking for ideally a long-term relationship, or casual dates (not ONS) and have specified this on my profile

I have been on a few dates with people and, apart from 1 (who I see very infrequently and there is no real progress), I have drawn a blank on people I was interested in and who also wanted a second date. I'm not sure what the competition out there is - perhaps much better looking than me? I feel im quite presentable but a size 14 - so perhaps that is something that is a deal-breaker when they meet me - but then, why even bother with a first date?

I have met about 7 or 8 people in the past 3 months and it's the same everywhere.
I am clear about the fact that I have children, I'm not looking to remarry at all. I don't usually get reasons why not from these men - most will just ghost me, or offer something vague like "we are looking for different things" without any clarity on what it is they are looking for (this is one of the first question I ask when chatting online in any case). I am ruthless about filtering before i meet, and also don't have a lot of time.

I'm at my wits' end and this is really getting me down, battering my already fragile self-confidence. Is there a trick I am missing? From other MN threads it seems like men are falling over each other to date most other women posting on mumsnet. Definitely not the case with me. What would you do short of going off online dating and resigning myself to a lonely and sexless life?

I think many more men settle too. Whereas women keep their standards high after a few heartbreaks.

The best filter I had was for messages to reach a minimum word count, sure got rid of a tonne of messages that just said "Hi, how's you" etc. It's amazing how so many men can't write, or have nothing to say of any interest.
What strikes me is that you make it clear what you are after, then you say you sometimes get told you are not what they are after, without you knowing what they are after. Maybe you expose too much of what your ideal goal is from the start, that could come across as intimidating. I suspect people generally prefer to go with the flow initially, and take their time to decide if someone is right, rather than having a rigid plan from the start. If on a first date you give up your entire plan, without having asked how they see their future, that can come across as desperate for the plan to be successful, rather than an interest in the person before you.
I'd say avoid discussion of long term goals, keep it light, find out what they like to do, how their lifestyle goes, what DC's they have. You can gauge what a person is looking for by what their situation is and stage in life, without asking directly. Getting straight to the point feels like a grilling and being put on the spot like being interviewed for the role. There's going to be plenty of time and opportunity to fathom out the rest.
I note you say you are short on time, also if you make a point of this, they will assume you won't have the time to make for them.

@Opentooffers point taken. Although it's never as detailed as that. I just ask what they are hoping to find on Bumble- clarify their definition of casual/ long term etc. This definitely helps me since it weeds out the "I need someone to sleep with once a month" crew, of which there seem to be many. I would have hoped that by this life stage, most people would respect both my time and theirs. We are so far away from uni days when time was a more flexible concept, at least for some, which gave us more space to freewheel. Sadly, not anymore. Also, with pre teen children, it isn't always easy for me to step out. I would rather do my filtering at the first stage of the funnel! Looks like I'm being filtered our at the second stage though lol 😂

Totally agree but you need to write a proper profile with a few things about yourself so they can bounce off those topics. Can't just put "ask me".

I also think you need to be clear as to the sort of relationship you’re looking for - there’s no point going in a couple of dates with someone who is looking for a FWB if you’re looking for a LTR. You’ll just be wasting each others time

Agree if you want a meaningful first contact you’ve got to give something to work with.
But I don’t mind so much being grilled (lightly): feels like I’m being taken seriously, as long as they’re happy to share about themselves too.

I agree about the numbers game. It’s been a while but I used to regularly arrange quick coffee dates. It also helped with my confidence and I didn’t get invested in the date beforehand and so didn’t feel nervous or have any pressure etc

Rant alert. Is the percentage of men on OLD apps looking to satisfy some kink or other really high or do I seem to get most of them responding to me? Since when has it been ok to open a conversation discussing kinks? So many chats seem to start with this. I might just be too dated for OLD - the world has moved on.

It's a good way to weed out the creeps. I'll never understand why they think it's a good idea to open a conversation like that.

“What are you looking for?”

Everyone will say long-term relationship. Well, almost everyone. Hardly anyone will be honest about wanting some attention, ego boost, flirting, sex, and if it becomes something serious then great. So the question doesn’t necessarily serve a purpose because you’re assuming honesty.

What are those initial dates like? Where do you go, what do you talk about?

Some of the opening messages are breathtaking. I recently had one tell me I had hips that he was fantasising grabbing hold of - as an opening message ffs! And then got told ‘what’s wrong with you it’s a compliment’

Er no thanks mate

If you live or work in a city, perhaps try a singles social (MeetUp has listings) or even speed dating. Like PP have said, it's a numbers game, so meeting multiple men F2F in one evening is a much better use of time than arranging multiple dates only to find there isn't any attraction or they can't gold a conversation!

@ElleintheWoods if left to me it's usually somewhere in The City (I'm in London) after work. But on occasion elsewhere (their choice) for a coffee/ drink as well. I can talk the hide off a horse so I don't think there are uncomfortable silences. But there will be instances where I'm trying to steer the conversion along rather than getting equal participation. Conversations will cover the usual stuff - work, kids, leisure.

@AltitudeCheck yes- Meet ups has come up previously. I'll give that a shot next year.

What apps are you guys on? 🥴 I find it so strange, it seems like every woman on the internet has had some weird pervy comments directed at them, and I absolutely never have… Maybe cos I’ve only ever used bumble where ransoms can’t message you?

I’m sorry this happened to you.

@Oldfailed ah you’re in central London. I feel like that changes things! No offence, I’ve lived that life myself, but I find that corporate London attracts the sort of men that want the next shiny thing, they need constant validation, variety, extremely critical of absolutely everything, bordering superficial. And there are actually millions of people to potentially date. Again, I’m sure there are exceptions, but personally I find such a vast difference between these guys and less high-performance guys elsewhere in the country.

What sort of backgrounds have these guys come from? I’ve found that it can be difficult to date more normal guys as a woman who is quite successful, experienced and has a bit of money.

I’m in a similar boat as in, on OLD people that would get me are far and few. I met a guy this year who is very similar to me, career-driven etc, and he said that locally I’m the first person he’s met that gets him.

I get the feeling that in your role you’re used to leading and you find it frustrating if the other person is passive. I’d say perhaps step back a bit in early conversations and force them to lead by doing that. Don’t tell them everything right away, put them on the spot more. You don’t need to sell yourself, let them make a sales pitch to you instead.

London is a wonderful place to meet people IRL though. I get chatting to people pretty much everytime I’m down even for the day. Say yes to more of the invites, go to events you enjoy, look fabulous and you should have absolutely no trouble meeting people away from OLD.

I read one that women only swipe right on about 4% of the profiles they view. Those men are therefore going to be in high demand and will literally have their pick. Men swipe right on 40%.

Yup, I saw loads of this when I spent a few months on apps this year. It's definitely increased compared to when I was dating five years ago. It's depressing! I wish apps were more focused on what people are looking for.

@ElleintheWoods my weird opening messages have mostly been on Bumble, post my accepting a match. It's an education of sorts, I suppose. I found out about 'female-led relationships' in a recent conversation. Bizarrely, these people spend no words on any other aspect of what they like / don't. It's solely what they want to do in bed.

What are female-led relationships in that context ha?

It probably won't pass MN's filter! Google.

I got the impression that when women say they want to get married, the guys think oh no and run away. When the women say they don't want to get married the men think oh no I'll be living on my own then forever and run away. I think you would be far better off trying to meet people naturally but god knows how nowadays.

Question for the 40+ Londoners here- has anyone tried one of the over 40s speed dating events that seem to happen sporadically? Any recommendations? There seem to be a few on. Thanks.

SIL said they’re great for meeting IT consultants