The smell..

[sarah0106]

So I've been with current partner 4 years... he had a terrible upbringing, his mums narcissistic and his dads controlling and very arrogant, there's been abuse in his childhood although he said he can't remember it happening.

Now to the point! He lets off wind and it's rotten now I'm not smelling of roses when I let off but this is like blocked drains, raw sewage smell, I've said to him I think he needs to go to the doctors and see about IBS or IBD but he's not taking me on at all, I say in a jokingly way "aw your rotten somethings crawled up your butt and died" but this is what it is like. I've tried doing the nice approach, I've tried the"your rank rotten" I've got air fresheners everywhere because it's that bad.

There's clearly an issue inside it doesn't matter what he eats, drinks, he can have salads to eat and water to drink and it's still as bad as when he has fizzy juice and a donner kebab.
Help because my nose can't take anymore

I’ve read this book and broadly agreed with it’s premise - however a couple of times on MN I’ve seen people say there are issues with his work etc… I’ve always been interested and would like to know the arguments against his theories. However that article is not it. Are the issue around him become a figure who is beyond reproach in some circles or with his research?

Very disappointing to read he has been accused of bullying and misconduct. Is he a quack though? That doesn’t follow on from these articles. I know a lot of psychology is just theories so I’m interested in what particular points of his work there people in the field don’t take seriously.

Of central importance, van der Kolk and Levine promote a number of ideas about trauma, PTSD, and trauma treatment that are deeply problematic for a range of reasons; ideas that ignore large aspects of the scientific knowledge base, or misrepresent the state of the science, or are perilously close to or crossover into pseudoscience. We believe their influence and authority, and that of figures like them, is a key part of why more individuals do not get the highest quality treatment for PTSD:

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/10497315231206754

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.1177/070674370505001302

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/01/03/the-case-against-the-trauma-plot#:~:text=Trauma%20came%20to%20be%20accepted,studies%20(even%20his%20own).

@casapenguin this is an interesting video on the kind of BS it’s generated https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=urq3GT2coDw

@Calliopespa
No! She’s mentioning the sexual abuse because he won’t want to be examined by the doc I’m guessing.

@Jaehee thanks for links, I find all this interesting as an an ongoing debate about trauma. I suppose I don’t see those articles as effectively critiquing BVDK, I get the objection to the social media angle of it all, but BVDK is essentially a guy with a theory; that theory has proved to be very popular, and I’m not sure criticising the popularity of the theory and it’s’ proliferation is enough to say it’s pseudoscience. As one of those articles says, this is essentially a marketing issue in which one school of thought is currently dominating the discourse. I was interested because pretty much all the trauma literature I came across (when this was linked to my line of work - although only rarely in the context of someone with a diagnosis of PTSD) was ‘holistic’ in the style of BVDK so I wondered if there was an alternative school of thought. A lot of this seems to be based on discrediting this ‘holistic’ view rather than studying it appropriately. I totally agree we should have more evidence but actually stating a plan to discredit someone cos they wrote a popular book rather than analysing their clinical outcomes does come across rather as professional sour grapes. IDK. I suppose I just think of these all as theories, and we need evidence for all angles.

My husband used to pass wind frequently, always always smelt bad.
He cut out bread and diary for 2.5 weeks and the change is unbelievable
He can tolerate it now in small doses as long as there is no build up.
Must take 2-3 weeks to leave our systems

I wouldn’t be so certain (also a PhD here). I would refer you to Dr Gabor Mate; it’s increasingly becoming clear that early trauma can cause physiological conditions.

What?

If you're incapable of holding one in, even for a few moments to get somewhere 'safe' like you would for other toilet functions, my condolences but don't assume that's the case for everyone.

It’s worth getting checked for bowel cancer. My husband had awful foul smelling farts for months. We did joke about it too Sadly had stage 3 bowel cancer A large tumour low down in the large descending bowel. I don’t want to unnecessarily panic you but definitely worth seeing the GP. ( Other symptoms were odd shaped poohs , blood and lower back discomfort , for information). Hopefully it’s nothing sinister xx

What the fuck did his childhood have to do with the facts his farts stink?

I'm aware of Gabor Mate. He is, er, not uncontroversial, e.g. https://dawsonross.wordpress.com/2023/04/17/who-ya-gonna-believe-the-problem-with-medical-misinformation/ and https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/gabor-mate-is-worse-than-wrong-on-adhd.1490081/

One of the things you learn as you get more and more into psychology is how little anyone knows with certainty. And neither Bessel van der Kolk nor Gabor Mate are even psychologists.

With the fact that they stink: unlikely to be related.

With not being able to keep the gas in until he can get to the loo: it is more likely to hurt him than someone who wasn't abused because of how trauma can turn our pain receptors up to 11.

What??!

Farts don’t hurt… not even traumatised people I’m sure.

You never hear someone let rip followed by “ Ouuch!”

🤣🤣🤣🤣

He's another one who forms an opinion and then writes about it like fact with very little to back it up.

I'm not sure attributing so much stuff to childhood trauma is really that helpful. I think it's appealing because it's an easy concept to understand and can feel immensely validating. But at the same time, there's an element of it absolving people of responsibility and encouraging a victim mentality, which I think can be equally appealing albeit not always on a conscious level. I also think there's a risk it can lead to more anxiety.

I knew somebody who was a big fan of TBKTS and Mate. After she read the books, she started attributing every ache and pain to trauma and became fixated on autoimmune diseases. It got to the point where she was so anxious about trauma leading to some kind of physiological disease that she more or less stopped leaving the house in case anything caused her to feel stressed.

Even if we were able to say, with absolute certainty (which will almost certainly never be the case) that x amount of trauma will lead to x, what use would this knowledge be to a patient? To my mind it would only create further suffering.

It's not farting that hurts. Part of what makes IBS a problem is pain receptors turned up to 11 so that normal gut functions hurt. There's more aspects as well, but that's one of them.

very little to back it up.

So I hallucinated the multiple pages of cited journal articles? OK...

I knew somebody who was a big fan of TBKTS and Mate. After she read the books, she started attributing every ache and pain to trauma

Your friend misunderstood the books. Not everything is autoimmune, in fsct most illnesses aren't. IBS and migraine, two illnesses with very clear stress causality for attacks, aren't.

Even if we were able to say, with absolute certainty (which will almost certainly never be the case) that x amount of trauma will lead to x, what use would this knowledge be to a patient? To my mind it would only create further suffering.

Given the choice between the physician who will research and write a book to explain the relationship between psychological stress and physical illness, and one who paternalistically decides that I don't need to know that information because "it would only create further suffering", I know who I trust more.

Just because one rather silly person attributes everything to childhood trauma doesn't mean that you can dismiss it all, if you're anything like sensible.

Anyone with any sense at all knows that if you heavily mistreat a child, it tends to have effects, sometimes very badly (there are always some who weather it all).

It's been known for centuries that children need love, stability and good boundaries. Anyone who thinks that severe childhood trauma only has mental effects is either inexperienced or has an agenda.

Not that that necessarily has anything to do with the OP's partners wind.

How you handle childhood trauma as an adult is a different question and one worth asking.

So I hallucinated the multiple pages of cited journal articles? OK...

Just because someone cites studies doesn’t mean they’re representing them accurately, or that the cited study is of high quality (or even credible).

I don’t doubt that experiencing childhood trauma can lead to changes in the body. This has already been established. We know that it can lead to changes in cortisol levels and gene expression, for example, which increase the risk of developing certain diseases.

What I do doubt is the credibility of someone who is not a psychologist, psychiatrist or neuroscientist asserting that ADHD, among other things, is a manifestation of emotional pain caused by childhood trauma and writing a whole book about it.

Well I definitely do get migraines from stress. Thankfully no painful farts … But yes, things like migraines and also stomach ache can be definite stress induced pain.

What I do doubt is the credibility of someone who is not a psychologist, psychiatrist or neuroscientist asserting that ADHD, among other things, is a manifestation of emotional pain caused by childhood trauma and writing a whole book about it.

That would be bollocks. I mean, ADHD makes trauma harder to deal with and neurodivergence can make someone more vulnerable to the kind of person who likes hurting children, but the trauma does not cause ADHD.

What I do doubt is the credibility of someone who is not a psychologist, psychiatrist or neuroscientist asserting that ADHD, among other things, is a manifestation of emotional pain caused by childhood trauma

I have heard a very experienced psychiatrist assert that in some cases it is; in one particular individual's case there had been a traumatic adoption.

However he made it clear that that's in an undetermined minority of cases.