The ultimat nice guy? Hurt and confused.

[GahItsOnlyMonday]

NC for this. Sorry it is quite long!

Have been single for 6 yrs but only started dating / dipping my toes in the water 2 years ago. Joined a few apps and met some men who didn't have partner potential but saw one as a kind of FWB thing and the other one saw slightly more seriously. They lived in a different town to me so nothing could've really happened, they weren't great and eventually it fizzled out with both of them.
Around same time my friend introduced me to her friend T who was also single. We liked the same music and he seemed my 'type' so we started chatting and he seemed cool. Met for a drink and unfortunately there was no spark. We went to a few gigs together but no romance; he was very hung up on 2 women he already knew (1 from school, other was a neighbour). Both had diagnosis of EUPD and had had significant trauma. I got the impression he was so hung up on them, that even if we had had chemistry, it would not have worked out.

I hadn't messaged T in a while so thought I would say hi. His profile pic had gone from WhatsApp. Told my friend and she had T's number from a night out, so she messaged him saying hi. Message went through. She said that I was worried, was he OK?

He sent back this really long screed saying:

• He's feeling down

-That he was there for me when I was feeling down about the 2 "users" but when things were going well I disappeared.

• That he was tired of being an ego-booster
• He doesn't understand why I chase people who treat me like crap

It was worded in a really mean, bitter sort of way and was v long so won't post it here!

My friend sent him back a very nice, measured response saying she's sorry he is down, that I am worried for him, that I would like to help him, if he is feeling down. And fwiw I had not seen the two "users" again (as they'd fizzled out)

He messaged her again saying

"Lol up to her whether she wants to [carry on with FWB]. And I'm in no way jealous or angry or upset with her about them at all.

It's just an awful lot of people have used me to sort out their problems and when I have [helped] they disappear. And similar was happening with GahItsOnlyMonday. Probably unintentionally but I'm a "healer / defender" personality type so will always help and I don't want to be. I can no longer take shit or keep helping others till I get what I need back. I've blocked a lot of people it's not what she's done [emphasis mine!]"

I'm just totally agog at the whole thing! We had been friends for 2 years, and I genuinely considered him to be my friend. We talked about a lot of stuff; I wasn't using him for advice or just as a shoulder to cry on. I liked him a lot, platonically, and will miss him. At the same time I am really angry about the accusations levelled at me. I haven't 'done' anything. I wasn't asking him to be my healer and he spent a helluva a lot of time talking about these 2 women he was a bit obsessed with. We also talked about work, sport, hobbies etc. Just all the normal stuff you'd talk to your friends about.

It all feels extremely juvenile (getting a friend to be a go-between!) but he's still kept me blocked. It's just bizarre. I also feel really sad though, because I liked him a lot as a person and we did co fide in each other as friends do. And now I just think he was a Nice Guy ™️ and it all feels a bit grubby.

Is there any advice from moving on from this kind of situation? It has really upset me.

No advice other than to give it time. He will soon fade in your immediate consciousness and you will eventually remember him as 'that nob'.

Sounds like he has been reading some rubbish online about women wanting bastards and rejecting nice guys.

He sounds phenomenally self absorbed. Who on earth describes themselves as a 'healer' ? - Knobs that's who.

Thanks for the replies. I felt a bit 😮😕😶 when I saw that he thinks he is a "healer". I didn't want to be healed!!

He is very inexperienced (never been in a relationship) so I do wonder if he has fallen down some kind of incel rabbit-hole.

He reminds me of the Offspring song "low self-esteem", which I have always hated as it's so sexist.

I don't know if I should contact him or not (we are still Facebook friends). He vanished last year and I messaged him on there. Or if I should just block and move on. I get more upset about friendships ending than relationships in all honesty! But then again, he is not who I thought he was. Argh. Don't know what to do or how to feel 😕

Don't message. Don't block. Just put him in the "was okay at the time" box and move on.

Thank you @LittleGreenDragons I know it would be daft to message but it's that whole "I thought he was my friend" thing was making me want to. I hold my friends very dear and honestly I feel like I have been duped and love-bombed or something. It's a horrible feeling. I feel wretched!

Feeling a bit better now but also quite angry! I think @AmyDudley you were right in your prediction!

I think he sounds down. When people are depressed they often feel like they do all the giving and others do all the taking. And if he has never been in a relationship he might be hyper sensitive to talking with a woman he likes about the men she sleeps with who don't treat her well. He might also have been talking about these other women just as something to talk about when you discussed relationships and to deflect feelings for you, but not really needed to share as there's nothing to say - he never got anywhere.

I'd get in touch with a brief message to say you are sorry he's feeling down recently and sorry he felt the relationship was so one sided as it means a lot to you and you thought you'd been mutually supportive over doomed relationships and that you enjoyed going out and about with him.

He may be a self-absorbed tosser, but he may have a spell of depression, and a good friend would show some concern if that's the case.

You’ll never be able to give him what he needs/wants.
He's blocked you anyway so why the need to poke this?

Thank you @Autumnweddingguest for your take. I do think he is down. And I am worried about him as he seems so dejected. I don't know him really well; we were friends but he wasn't like some of my good friends I have known since school.
I genuinely didn't think he liked me in that way, there was no indication of this from him at all. So for me it didn't seem like I was being a woman he likes talking / moaning about men I do have feelings for.

He did have a lot to share about the women in his life; we spent literally hours talking about them. One was the on/off girlfriend of a friend, who had a young family. She would be crying on his shoulder then going back to her partner on a repeat cycle. The other was a friend from school who had serious MH issues and basically rinsed him for money then vanished; this happened more than on occasion. He was totally obsessed with them both. Though obviously he did not ever actually have a relationship with either of them.

I guess because it seems like a really weird and cold way to end a friendship which did mean a lot me even though he wasn't my best friend or something I did appreciate his company
Though also the way he spoke about me Was horrible and disparaging.
I could text or send facebook message

It sounds like your friend has gone though some tough times. He might be the type that like to help damsels in distress and when they do not appreciate the help he gets the amp. A lesson I personally learnt the hard way is that you cannot help someone that doesn’t want to be helped.
Your friend has had a bad experience with someone by the looks of it and is now projecting on an entire group of people you are part of.
you can try and drop him a message on Fb, but if he doesn’t respond do not try again. He probably needs time to heal his bruised ego.

So if I've got this right, you met all 3 men around a similar time 2 years ago. 1 was FWB, one you saw as more (did he know about the FWB?) and the other being T.
T was initially a prospect and may have initially thought you might of been, but no spark from your pov ( he may have felt different). You obviously told him a fair bit about the other 2 - more than was necessary perhaps. Did you tell him before he mentioned about the 2 women he said he knew? Is it possible he went on about them just because you had 2 who were on your mind? Like a tit for tat thing, that might explain why he got the hump about the other 2 guys in your life and why he sounds quite bitter about their existence.
Is his assessment about your 2 guys being users accurate, do you see them as such, or is that what he has decided they are?
Then we come to him claiming you disappeared when things were better for you. Is he right in that? You said you hadn't messaged him in a while? How long is a while? Meantime it seems he had blocked you because you stopped contacting him. Ah but it takes any one of 2 to make contact, so had he tried to say hi during your gap of communication?Had you ignored his last text for a good while?
Either you are not acknowledging that you dropped contact ( depending how long a 'while' is) or he's making up and exaggating a lot in his head, or a bit of both. Either way, it sounds messy and he has grown bitter meantime. Probably the upshot is you should not try and force a friendship with a guy who wants more from you, it doesn't work. So leave it now because he's bitter for a reason, and that reason is you had no spark your end whereas he stayed hopeful.

So he was obsessed with two women with EUPD and you were obsessed with two guys from another town (so it couldn’t have gone anywhere, according to you — though this seems a bit mad to me), and you friendzoned each other, and mow he’s cross you friendzoned him and then ghosted him?

Well if you want this kind of pointless drama in your life, carry on, leave him on FB, or wherever he hasn't blocked you, keep on psychoanalysing him and asking mutual friends about him, and ruminating over your own actions and his actions way back to time immemorial.

Or block him in the places you aren't already blocked, forget about the needless drama and crack on with more mutually rewarding friendships.

You say that he seems very dejected but that you also don’t know him that well.
OP this comes from someone who used to take any form of rejection so badly it would make me ill. I mean really poorly.
I got some therapy and learned so much.
Your issue here is actually with yourself - and probably most things on MN are.
This man for whatever reason is not your friend. If he has disappeared and removed himself it’s not a boundary you like, but you must respect it.
He clearly has a lot going on and he’s been very unkind in his words about you.
You don’t need to hear words like that, but by fixating on this guy and fixing your friendship you think that will make you feel better. It won’t, it’s just a short term fix.
You deserve good friends who want to be around you and speak to you, where lines of communication are open. You deserve to spend time with people who value you as a person.
Spending time with people you like doing things you enjoy is the way forward.
Trying to repair a broken bond with someone who isn’t for you will just have you feeling awful about yourself.
You need to build up your confidence and belief in yourself and only you can do that.

@Holotropic pretty much, give or take.

Yes mutually friend-zoned each other.

I would not say I was obsessed with guy 1 or guy 2 to be fair. I met T about 3 months before meeting either of them. (I've got my timings wrong, in my 1st post I've put that I met all 3 at the same time but guy1 and guy2 we were early 2023), T was Sept 2022.

Yes he knew lady1 and lady2 long before I was introduced to him. Lady2 he was especially obsessed with. He spent a lot of time on our first meeting (which I guess was essentially a kind of a blind date) talking about her. She was the on/off partner of his best friend who would literally go round to his to cry about her situation then go back to his friend in a kind of revolving door situation. She had kids with his best friend and some from from a prior relationship as well and he was sort of like an uncle figure to them, till it all fell apart and he blocked her. Now she and his friend have split up and his friend is his lodger!

Lady1 he went to school with and has been in love with her since they were teenagers.

So I assumed that he was not really wanting a relationship with anyone aside from either of the two of them given that 'first date' and he didn't make an attempt to initiate a romance between himself and me in the slightest. We just hung out as friends and I had no idea that he had feelings for me.

Then I met the 2 guys, back to back, one fizzed out then I saw the other one and that also fizzled out. We carried on being friends for a year, guy2 got in touch and I told T that I was thinking of seeing him again, but actually didn't go through with it cos he had some issues of his own. This was in the summer.

Then I had a few horrible months where I had family illness, one of my kids was seriously unwell, one of my closest friends had some serious issues so I was supporting her and my own health was not great either. T didn't contact me during this time but I didn't make contact with him either due to lurching from one crisis to another. When I finally got round to messaging him, that was when I realised I was blocked!

Got my timings wrong; I met T before the other 2 guys (and yeah the 2nd knew of the first in a very vague way).
Our first date he spent a lot of time talking about being eternally single, how he'd given all his energy to these two women who'd "used" him. Our mutual friend did mention how he'd been 'rinsed' by Lady2. He appeared to not be interested at all in me in any romantic way it was more of a 'hey! We are both obsessed with same bands!' way.
I did find the 2 guys to be problematic which is why I stopped seeing them. But it wasn't a tit-for-tat thing cos he told me all about lady1 and lady2 before I had even met either of the guys I started seeing.

What's weird is I absolutely did not disappear when I was seeing either guy. They were just flings I didn't spend that much time with them as it was mostly for sex and they didn't live nearby anyway so logistically it wouldn't have been possible to do the whole 'ditch friends for a new fella' thing. My birthday party was right in the middle of the time I was seeing Guy2, and T came to that (the guy wasn't invited). It's just completely rewriting history to say I ditched him when I was seeing these guys.

My last message to him was about a gig I was going to. He doesn't have blue ticks on WhatsApp so dunno if he read it. My messages before that had been that I had randomly heard from Guy2 and was thinking of going to see him, but that I knew it was probably probably bad idea. He replied saying I would be a fool to do this. I said I wasn't going to in the end as I agreed it would be foolish. We'd been having a long text conversation about all sorts of things (work, travelling, pets) the sort of convo you'd have over a few days. Then I messaged him about a gig.
So it was "his turn" to message.

Then I had a terrible few months as described in previous post . He didn't reply to my gig message in that time and I didn't have the emotional energy to reach out and message anyone but family and the friend who was having a bad time. I kept meaning to message T (and others) but kept not getting round to it. When I finally did message, that was when I realised he'd blocked me. So could have been immediately after my last message to him which was about 2½ months ago, could have been last week.

Yes he is extremely bitter and it's really upset me because the way he phrased things is really nasty and also twisting through truth about what I thought was a solid, albeit relatively new, friendship. But yeah, you're right I should probably leave it. It's just a shame because I thought we were friends 😔

Thanks for this, you seem very wise! Xx

And agree he is not my friend, probably never was, but that is a bitter pill to swallow as I really thought he was.
So it feels like the whole thing was just me hanging out with a Nice Guy ™️ who was secretly bitter/ unhappy with me dating but didn't say anything.
I do lack confidence, and am not especially good at making friends as I am quite awkward, neurodiverse, and very shy. But yeah I realise should spend time with people who actually like me and aren't going to twist facts / rewrite history.
It has made me question everything - it's horrible!!

You're absolutely right it really is pointless drama and that is what I feel so sad about as I realise the whole thing is kind of tainted and we can't go back to how we were (or how I thought we were!).

It did seem very teenage to be asking a friend to contact him but I was so shocked at finding myself blocked and not knowing why, when our last correspondence had seemed so normal and I didn't realise I had done anything to upset him.

The whole thing has totally thrown me and the way he is describing himself as a 'healer / defender type' is just totally deranged; I never saw him in these terms at all and I really wasn't just messaging him when I ran into issues in my dating life or using him as a therapist. We were just like, friends? He had some stuff going on with work; I supported him through that. We talked about pretty much everything and went to see bands together
It's just so weird and unsettling to think of him silently seething or being resentful about me seeing the "two users" when it was a bit of fun and very casual / not all that much of a big deal: a FWB that fizzled out and then a tentative relationship which never really went anywhere because of the distance and I was quite disappinted when it ended but certainly not in bits over.

Urgh. I have attracted men like this my entire life. One of them accused me of using him as a "surrogate boyfriend" and we had an incredibly painful friendship break up.
This is absolutely not about you.

And yes. It really really hurts when you realise they were never really your friend.

Hey OP.

I wouldn't message him at all and you know why?

He was something and nothing, that's why. You say a friend, I say not a very good one. You say a FWB; when a man you love comes along, that is going to go out of the window.

This was a possible friend, but it went nowhere, and his actions now show why it went nowhere. A miss-fire.

He is not boyfriend material nor friend material, and when your potential new love comes along, there will be no place for this chap.

Draw a line under it, offer up a prayer for his safe and happy future and a goodbye to the relationship, and press on looking for your ten out of ten relationship. This is a waste of time xxx

That he was there for me when I was feeling down about the 2 "users" but when things were going well I disappeared

I'm not sure how seriously I'd take this if you really do believe yourself to be a caring person.

Some people will see that about you, and instead of considering a strength that should be treasured, they'll see it as a weakness that can be manipulated. They'll know that if they make unjust accusations, it'll put you in the defensive and make you feel insecure about yourself, when in actual fact, they 're just angry and resentful and want to lash out on you for something.

All that is anxiety invoking for good people are they then spend a lot of time in introspection, chewing over the situation, wondering if / how they were wrong....when in fact they're just dealing with a bit of an immature, nasty wanker.

He doesn't understand why I chase people who treat me like crap

Whilst he may genuinely be referring to these other men.....do you not think that there's a slight chance he slipped this one out and he's actually referring to himself here? The anger might be coming from 'Why does she put up with their shit, but she doesn't put up with MY shit??'

At the very least, he's not that into you and you're not compatible. This is him pushing you away because of it. Things really shouldn't be this hard at the beginning. It's really not a good sign and not something you should try hard to overcome.

He sounds like an utter, utter twat.