Worried about partner playing poker..

[yellowstone94]

Hello,

I would be very grateful for any feedback on this, and I will try to be as fair and honest as possible so that it is not one sided.

To set the scene..I recently got engaged to a man, I am 30 and he is 11 years older than me. I am pregnant with our first child and we have been together a year. Granted things moved quickly, however we worked together and spent a lot of time with each other which meant we sped up that process of connection.

He has always been a very passionate poker player, he absolutely adores it, he could talk about it for hours, he watches poker videos in his spare time, he has spent periods of his life playing for hours online making enough to keep himself afloat, played tournaments and one some larger amounts and lost some. If he could he would be in the casino playing every single day and night, he's totally obsessed.

I see Poker involves a lot of skill and I understand why his mind is good at it and he enjoys it, but the gambling aspect, the highs and the lows, the late hours all of this gives me a slight uneasy feeling and raises a few red flags.
When we first started dating, I was very clear and said that I really liked him but that having come from an unstable relationship in the past, where by I dealt with 3 years of severe addiction, that I was really a bit worried about this part fo his life. (This I think also feeds into why I feel so uneasy now)

Eventually further along, we together set some ground rules, this was to protect him and also myself - the highs would not be so high but the lows would not be so low.
I felt he did a lot better with structure and in a weird way he seemed sort of relieved to have someone who loved him and cared enough to help him set some boundries.
The boundries were that he would bring £200 in cash, to play the 1:2 game and that he would play in a way that meant he built up this stack, however if after a few hours he had lost the £200 then he called it a night and came home. He also stopped drinking so much and began playing really sensible and he said he was having a better time, no more arguments at the table and he felt more balanced - amazing news!

I always listen to his tales of the game (which can last a LONG time) despite really having little interest, I listen because I care about him and feel it's another way of being loving, taking time to engage and listen.

Over time he has loosened himself from these boundries and started playing a higher game, he would start talking about how he needed one good night, angry when he would lose, moping after certain nights. He would come home at 4am, this would wake me up and often I struggled to get back to sleep. The broken sleep was affecting me, especially due to the pregnancy. When I went to stay at my mums for a night, despite thinking he may still be sensible, he stayed out all night and at midday the next day was heading home, totally wired. This really unsettled me.
He would start betting way more than what we had agreed, as his bank statements would show, which I saw when we were applying for our mortgage and it seemed he had totally gone against his word. We thought we would lose the mortgage (we didn't luckily) and he was spiralling. I thought this would be a wake up call, he promised to not take his bank card, he left it here in the drawer, but then he realised he could use apple pay and again the rules seemed to bend.

A few weeks ago he lost £800, a week ago £700..and as I said his bank statements show him spending way more than he said he would. It makes me feel sick because I am 6 months pregnant and not working, plus we have so many important things we need to buy for the baby, for moving house, to live off.

He is paying for the purchase of the house, he has a rich parent who is helping him and money from another property his parent bought for him, so he is blessed in having funds available. This is noted though in how he wants the pre-nup to look and although he would end up giving me £60k or so if we end up divorcing, he has made it clear that he wants his other inheritance protected. Again, I understand and I have been the one sorting this (along with everything house related) but since finding out that he has broken his word and trust towards me again I feel lost, resentful and as if I am not really protected moving foreward in the relationship and marriage.

He is generous towards me, he pays for our meals out, since finding out I was pregnant I moved into his flat (his mum no longer charges him rent) but he cover the bills and has never asked me for any money towards it. I pay for groceries, I cook all the meals, I do all the laundry and am very giving with how I care for him and support him. He has been great most of the time in relation to the pregnancy and he is a sweet heart and we get on really well.

I had an anxiety attack recently because I suddenly felt terrified that our future would be overshadowed by his obsession with poker, I have tried to be understanding, learn the rules, show interest, I have respected his skills, however his ability to bend the truth and lack of remorse, until we've had a big row and I am crying about it, when he then 'gets my point' just feels gut wrenching. He tells me I am being dramatic, and explains he has never not payed a bill and never got himself into any debt. I guess I just feel that money he wastes on poker could be put into our babies saving account, go towards future nursery fees, pay for a family holiday..I mean I get he loves his hobby but it feels as though it takes up a lot of space in our relationship and that he is selfish to think that he deserves this special right to his hobby as and when he wants. I can't even imagine taking out a Yoga membership for £300 a month, let alone 3-4 times a week...granted the whole point is he can win some back, but it just it all feels a bit much.

I guess I feel resentful towards him and I just wonder if it's possible to have a balanced life with Poker as part of it. He has sworn now that he will never lie again, that he will go back to £200 a session and on a slower game.

I just feel exhausted by it, am I over-reacting? Should I just trust him and let him prove himself and then go from there? I don't know what the other option is really, we will have a baby soon and I don't want to end the relationship now.

Sorry this is a very long post, and thank you if anyone actually reads and responds.
x

If you stay with him, I don't think you should marry him - you should stay financially separate as much as possible. You need to go back to work after maternity leave and not become dependent on him financially. A gambler may drag you down with him if you're married.

He already made you these promises about keeping to limits and so forth, so I wouldn't expect his new promises to stick.

So you need to be sensible about keeping yourself financially secure.

I think you'd probably benefit from talking with Gam-Anon or similar.

do NOT take out a mortgage with someone with a gambling problem. Totally NO

Sorry, I somehow skipped over a load of your post - you need to become financially independent of him once the baby's born.

As somebody who is in a relationship with an ex-gambler and self-described ‘degenerate’ when it came to it, your partner is spending more and more for the buzz. It’s not about the winning at this point, it’s about the losing and the thrill he gets when he’s losing. Yes it’s nice to win but he’d happily continue on and blow all he’s won for that thrill, think if it a bit like when people run from the police but leave breadcrumbs so they can find them, it’s the thrill of it all.
Oh and he was a compulsive liar when it came to gambling, all degenerates are, they will soften the blows to make you think it’s not that bad, they’ll pretend they spent less than they have, they’ll also beg, borrow and steal to fund their habit if needs be. I can confirm this is true as I’ve also worked in a casino and seen whole lives ruined right there and then.
He won’t stop until he realises he needs help, nobody will be able to force his hand no matter how much he loves you, he loves the thrill more.

Do NOT combine finances, he sends you money for bills or pays the ones in his own name and you pay ones on yours. Whatever you do, do not bail him out when he’s in a sticky situation, he’ll become accustomed to it and continue to blow large amounts of what is essentially your money.

It’s really, really hard to love an addict of any sort, I hope you can come to a conclusion about what is best for you and your baby.

Just NO

I would echo what the others are saying...make a plan to become financially independent after your mat leave. Keep your finances separate.

This was me, except my ex was a student at the time. He would spend hours talking about/ playing/studying poker with late nights followed by groggy mornings. He had convinced himself this would stop him needing to get a job. In all my years with him, he never won big. He would prioritise poker over spending time with me and the kids. He then swapped from playing poker to day trading and the cycle continues. He is currently not working and on benefits (not contributing a penny towards his kids) but still trading / playing poker. I have no regrets about my beautiful kids, but I do have many regrets about being a doormat for years. I was lucky that we never merged our finances....I think from early on I knew subconsciously not to merge our finances.

Good luck op. Can you speak to his mum about the gambling?

He's a gambler, OP.

It can be dressed up in the glamour of poker and potential wins and rules all you both like. But he is a gambler.

He is obsessed and I can pretty much guarantee you that, once you throw a baby into the mix, you will find poker games and lengthy stories of said games dull at best.

He won't change. He's addicted to poker and the boundaries won't stick.

Get ready to go it alone with the baby, because at some point you will be.

He's not addicted to poker, he's a gambler. I'm in a poker club, it costs £10pw and nothing more, the people enjoy poker and aren't gamblers.

>> that

He's a gambling addict.

I'm sad OP as you're pregnant with his child and I'm not surprised that you feel resentful of the money he is basically wasting. He is lying to you, and lying to himself, when he says the sessions will be £200 only.

£200 in my book is a lot of money... how often will the sessions be??

If he can go cold turkey and stop all together, then maybe you could move forward.
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He's an addict and unless he completely stops gambling he will just need to do it more and more and more. Addicts cannot do the behaviour they are addicted to in moderation, it's just not possible

He has sworn now that he will never lie again, that he will go back to £200 a session and on a slower game.

You are trying to negotiate with an addiction. It doesn't work.

Why do so many women only start considering the character of the man they're with AFTER they get pregnant? You can get rid of this man if you decide you don't like the gambling habit you know he's always had; but your child is now stuck with this father and all his flaws. Is it not worth just taking a moment to contemplate this stuff before conceiving with somebody?

I’ll be honest, I came on to say that I love poker. I find it really stress relieving and play with a lot of people who play for fun, and money involved tends to be low. It’s social, stimulating, fun. Your reduction of 1:2 games is a bit unreasonable because most poker games step up automatically and he’d be pretty unpopular if he left when that happened; and probably not able to play after a while if the habit was stopped.

But almost all the games I’ve played in have had a £10/20 buy in, and then an option to rebuy once at a set point with 50% of that. You’re not paying for masses of money, a couple of hundred, usually. It’s fun but low stakes. It does often go on until late - 2am finishes were not uncommon before I was a mum, I only play in earlier games now that tend to be done by 10:30/11, when I can play at all…

He's not playing poker, from what you’ve said. Hes gambling. He may as well be playing the slots.

What did you learn about relationships when you were growing up?.

You’ve got yourself a gambling addict for a partner and I do not like the ways in which he is treating you at all.

I would fully prepare myself for going it alone going forward. I would also give your child your surname on the birth certificate, not his.

Your ex was an addict too?. What is the attraction to such types of men?. Are you a rescuer or saviour when it comes to relationships?. What did you learn about relationships when you were growing up?.

This man is also prepared to shaft you in a divorce settlement as well by offering you only 60k. You minimised the many red flags here re this man at your emotional peril.

Did you go to any sort of support groups like al-anon or nar-anon when you were dealing with addiction before, OP? Sounds like you need to break the cycle. This is another form of addiction.

This! Money doesn't matter, it's the thrill and if you win you want to spend more and end up chasing losses. X

Thank you all for taking the time to read and respond, and there have been some interesting points made. Yes I have drawn the comparison between the addictions, and have had to reflect on that. The pregnancy was a surprise so there's that too.

I think in regards to the pre-nup situation, I felt really upset by this, but thought perhaps I was being unreasonable seeing as it is his/his parent money but I think the fact that is being put in place has made me feel un-easy in regards to the future, especially as i'm a pretty chill nice person to be with and wont be the cause of a potential break up (in the sense I have no addictions or anything causing issues)

The comments on financial independence are helpful, and although my line of work doesn't bode well with being a parent as it's very long hours, I am going to get myself an admin job / something that can keep me ticking over. I am going to get a temp job now too that I can do from home.

I made myself very clear to him in our last conversation and he knows i'm not a push over and that if he messes this up it will be on him. It's nuanced when you know the person deeply, but I also agree with all you've said and it is the reason I feel anxious, as that doesn't arise from thin air.

Thank you again, much appreciated and helpful to know i'm not over-reacting

Sorry you're going through a rough time OP. Does your partner work? How come you aren't working?

In terms of the pre-nup, I don't think it's unreasonable to ring fence inheritance. I wouldn't suggest one personally, but I can understand why others do.

My husband is a professional poker player. It's taken him all over the world, and he's spent years studying it. He is "staked" so the money he plays with isn't his own, and he takes 50% of what he wins. If he loses, he goes into "make up" where he forfeits his 50% until they are square again. This is more comfortable for me because it means that we aren't going to wake up one day with no money in the bank. It's also very very different to what I do!

I say all that to mean that playing a lot of poker isn't in itself a bad thing, plenty of people make a career out of it. I work in law, and he earns more than me!

The fact he's never missed a bill, never run up debt etc I'd think is encouraging. But if you genuinely think he's an addict, he'll need to stop completely. I am regularly told about new people starting to play, losing 30k or so in a month and then slipping away never to be seen again. It's quite sad really.

Sorry OP, but he’s a gambling addict. Have you considered therapy? It might be worth digging into why you’ve gone from a relationship with an addict into a relationship with another addict.

Just wanted to add another “this is a gambling addiction” message here. He’s got red flags for it all over the place.

Would he seek support for it? Even if he won’t (or will, but won’t engage with it), you can get support for yourself.

But you’re absolutely not overreacting. This is big stuff.

My partner began gambling shortly before our first was born and, looking back, I think it cast a shadow over those early baby times, despite me not knowing about the gambling until later on.

He stopped, but relapsed and things are now far worse. Ironically, it’s a gamble deciding whether to stay with/leave a gambler when you have children together. Not a fun one. I’m so sorry you have to make these decisions and I hope you end up in a situation where you and your baby have what you need, physically and emotionally. You deserve it.

I agree that he is an addict. Does he have an actual job too? He may have a rich parent but how long do you think it will be before the gamlbing escalates and, before you know it your house is being repossessed and half his debts then become half your debts!! Rich parents may get to a point where they no longer want to help. This has disaster written all over it.

Thanks again for all of your replies.

I am not working because we are contract based self employed workers and as it's in events I would usually go from job to job, my last job ended a month or so ago and i've had lots to sort out with the purchase of our home. Now i'm 6 months it doesn't seem right to take on a stressful project as it's long hours and usually 3 months minimum. So looking into temp work in the meantime.

My partner is on a job which is great and it's a pretty long contract.

I feel as though Poker playing / gambling is addictive as it affects your brain chemistry and creates this real pull towards doing it. So I think he needs to be very careful, he doesn't see it this way, he's been playing for 10 years or so and its become part of his life and identity.

His main points are that he is able to bring an income in from it, he can usually maintain his bank roll when not working, yes it can mean losing chunks but then he does usually climb back up and make a profit. So it does have this up and down nature, but overall he says it means when he is not working he doesn't eat into savings and is able to take us out for dinner and pay the bills

I've come to a place now, where he has to re-build that trust and he knows what is on the line. He is older and wont want to lose his chance at a beautiful family, so for now I am choosing to allow him space to grow and prove himself.

With regards to the pre-nup situation, I thought about if we can make it very specific and that part of that agreement will be if he gambles in the future in a way that causes harm to our family and as a result there is a divorce that the inheritance money that he wants to protect is re-considered in terms of how it is shared. He actually agreed to this and that also gives me confidence that he is taking it seriously.

My fear is being 5-10 years down the line, 3 children lets say, and we end up getting a divorce and because of the pre-nup I suddenly find myself in a vulnerable position, especially as my career will have been on hold due to the type of work and role I want to play in my kids life.
He wants to protect his assets, I am fully comitting to him as my partner for life and in turn taking a gamble on him in relation to the Poker, then I also want protection in place (more so for our future children)...this is how I see it?