My mum called me crying. What should she do? :(

[Manifestingchocolate]

Chatting with my mum this weekend on the phone only for her to break down in tears telling me she doesn't know what to do anymore.

She moved away 12 years ago after meeting someone new. They had only been dating around 18 months at the time. He lived in Scotland (we were in England) around 3 hours away. They decided she should move to Scotland as she had adult children at the time (mid twenties) and his children were teenagers so it made sense that she could move.

Then, 10 years ago her now husband had a major stroke. He has recovered incredibly well considering but has not worked since and would admittedly find work difficult with his symptoms. However he now has severe anxiety and barely leaves the house. My mum has hardly seen any of Scotland in the 10 years she has been there as a result and he refuses to go on holiday anywhere at all. My mum has always been an explorer before this, loved her holidays. Although he will go on fishing weekends now and then with his neighbour but still doesn't go anywhere with her, preferring to sit at home together.

Also, in the last 12 years, my siblings and I have had children. My mum now has 5 grandchildren which she didn't have before and she has admitted to me that she feels she's missing out on them being in Scotland and only seeing them around once a month. She has asked him to consider moving to England with her now that she has grandchildren and his children are now in their 20s and childfree and he has said no, that he will never move away from his own grown up kids.

Mum is early 60s and still working FT due to her partners stroke and is the sole earner but doesn't really have a life as her husband won't travel and she misses her grandchildren. He never comes to visit with her when she visits us. Her husband also now has 2 cats so we can no longer visit them either as I'm allergic to them.

Mum feels trapped and like life is passing her by and that she's missing out on so much back home. She is missing out on a lot. We can't even go and stay with her. Yet she has a job and life in Scotland now. They are mortgage free. Her husband relies on her, adores her, constantly very affectionate towards her. They get on very well so she feels extremely torn as he doesn't make her unhappy aside from refusing to actually do anything with life!

If she moved back here she would have to rent or move in with my elderly grandfather and she told me she would miss her husband terribly although wants much more from life too. I know she would find it extremely difficult living with my grandfather. His house is also tiny and he's a hoarder so I'm not sure how there would be room for her. Mum has a property here which she owns partly but the sale of the property can only be forced through courts which she says she can not afford. She also thinks that getting a new job in her field at her age would be very difficult and she can't afford to retire yet either.

It was sad hearing how trapped and confused she feels. I'd love for her to come back home to England, but I don't think she would ever leave her husband. Yet, he is holding her back from living an abundant, enjoyable life.

She says she can't keep driving up and down the motorway forever as she's getting older etc.
What should she do?

I do think this sadly. @Manifestingchocolate how did they meet given neither seem to be social unless strict parameters? Re the fishing trips are they camping over nighters or just day ones?

I think the problem is that her world has shrunk and the smaller it seems the harder it is to break out. But break out she must.
So if she's so very unhappy that she is crying on the phone, can you use that as the impetus to make some change. She says she can't apply for a new job but has she tried? Could she book more trips to see DGC? If she is mortgage free does she have enough spending money to book holidays? There's plenty of options but I think she needs to start somewhere, anywhere. Rather than big decisions like moving, start with small ones like going away somewhere for a weekend.

She should look at her options and then choose to take one of them.

That's such a tough situation. My feeling is that you would be best doing a bit of active listening, and let her come to her own conclusions. It would be better still with a trained counsellor.
Watch you don't end up taking it all on yourself to tell her what to do, or letting her vent for hours so she skips off feeling better and you end up carrying the load.
You can't fix this for her. She's living the consequences of her life choices, and it's her that needs to figure out what to do next, not you.
Look after yourself 💐

I think the cats are quite a big issue here . Why on earth did he get the cats ? Did he do that deliberately? If they get rid of the cats you can stay a couple of times a year . You can have a scottish holiday with your mum each year and see different parts . I think your mum should pay for the caravan or air b and b since you will be travelling up there . And she should stay at yours when he's on his fishing trips perhaps with a day either side to make the journey to you worth while . Sorted . If he doesn't accept those terms then she should move back to England. My husband has had a couple of strokes and is similar . He doesn't like any change to his routine likes to stay in the house alot etc so I do Understand the situation probably more than most .

She was prepared to up and leave her own dc 12 years ago for a man

Come on @MonsieurSpade , the "children" were mid 20s. You wouldn't have expected them to feel bad about moving 100s of miles away, nor should she. It's not about loyalty.

I do agree that it sounds like she's struggling to take practical steps.

Unfortunately your Mum has become his carer but at the same time struggles to do things on her own so a difficult situation. I think as pps have said, if she won't or can't move back then she needs more breaks where she can see more of you and the grandchildren.
For now she could definitely travel by train or fly down so the long drive is not so exhausting for her and stay at a hotel or Air B & B near you so she can catch up properly and have quality family time. Also you and your kids can hire a place near to her, have a break in Scotland each year and do some sightseeing together. Long term she will have to think hard about her life choices but that's not your decision to make for her.

How old is your DM ?
Is she still under state pension age ?

He doesn't want to move from his adult children, but feels it is OK for your Mum to be apart from hers .... hmmmm. Doesn't sound very lovely to me.

The problem is that the longer this goes on, the more your Mum will lose the courage and get-up-and-go to deal with it by taking her own decisions and going on enjoyable trips. There are lots of options, but she has to feel motivated and able to grasp them. She is being ground down.

She doesn't want to do anything on her own.

He doesn't want to do anything with her.

Unless she changes her attitude, nothing will change and they will both sit in their chairs until they die.

She sounds very codependent.

He's not stopping her from doing things on her own. She needs to be responsible for her own happiness.

If she's not prepared to do anything alone then she's going to be depressed wherever she lives. You can't babysit her either.

It sounds a bit like his anxiety and agoraphobia has gotten to her snd she experiences it too.

She is really caught in a trap of her own choosing. I know its hard but letting her vent to you is part of her cycle of helplessness. After she cries on you you feel the stress and she feels relieved.

Maybe think about helping her 1) slowly expand her social and hobby circle in scotland, 2) create a safe space for her to visit one week a month after she retires.

He us not going to get better. He has developed a severe mental health condition that he won’t treat and she will wither into his permanent nurse and prisoner.

Encourage her to join a ramblers club. There's loads of them in Scotland and they're very friendly. There's usually different walk lengths to suit abilities. My 80 year old DM regularly goes out on the shorter walks and it gives her the social and physical break from caring for my Dad who is in the early stages of dementia.

What should she do?

It doesn't really matter what all of think she should do because she's so far been clear that she's not actually prepared to do anything.

In the end, the conclusion has to be that this is the life she has chosen. I agree with pp that the crying on the phone to you is likely part of that choosing - it reinforces that she is a victim and cannot do anything to change her circumstance (i.e. I clearly am upset so it can be concluded that if I could change someting, I would).

I think I would say it sounds hard but if she doesn't do anything, this is her life forever and only she can change it. No one can do that for her.

For a marriage to work, it needs to fulfil the needs of BOTH partners.
It seems that this marriage meets some of her needs but not all of them.

I think that where your mum is going wrong is to assume that her marriage should fulfil ALL of her needs. Happy at home, getting in well with her dh but also her need to socialise, see family, discover the world.
Thats unrealistic, esp now that her dh is unfortunately disabled.
So she needs to establish what are essential needs, the non negotiable ones and what are thé ‘would be nice’ needs (something btw her dh is very clear about!)

So I think there are two possible next steps

1- she can manage to find a way to fulfil her needs of discovering the world, visit scotland, see you and your dcs without her dh (assuming he is able to cope on his own fur periods of time - otherwise, there is also a need to organise carer/support whilst she is away)

2- there are too many needs that go unmet (her dh disability will have an impact on other areas on their life too) and she needs to end it.
It would allow her to move back to England, see you + dcs. It won’t solve her issue of ‘discovering’ the world if she is still unhappy to go alone.

Btw by telling you all of that, it’s like she has passed the bucket of sorting things out to you.

please dont fall into that.

At best you can be a listening ear. But you can’t take responsibility for how your mum feels.
You can advise her or tell her in general terms what to look for when making her decision. But you can’t tell her what to do, nor can you know what’s the best decision for her.

A good move might be for her to have counselling so she can discuss all if that with someone who isn’t involved iyswim.

Yes this ! I was about to say something very similar.

Rather than thinking about "big" decisions like moving, changing jobs, can you encourage her to start taking small steps to improve her situation. The more that she starts to do, the more her confidence will grow.

If her husband is unable to / resolutely refuses to do things with her, then she needs to give herself permission to start doing things alone or with other people.

Are there some local groups she can join to start making friends, meet other people - walking, hobby, reading, women's groups? Can she start to take day trips to explore the area and work up to an overnight stay somewhere?

There are so many options - it's about looking for solutions, small things to increase her comfort zone and having things to look foward to.

But it does sound like she is allowing him to have his way on everything - he wants cats, so now they have cats, he won't move from his children, but it's acceptable that she has, he won't go away for the weekend with her, but will go on a fishing trip.

Is he encouraging her to be independant? To go ahead and do things alone if he is unable to/doesn't want to join her? If she is always putting him and his wishes first and he is not encouraging her to go out without him, no matter what you suggest, it's going to be hard for her to start doing that.

He doesn't want to move from his adult children, but feels it is OK for your Mum to be apart from hers .... hmmmm. Doesn't sound very lovely to me.

So what is he supposed to do? He's an elderly disabled man. Should he move hundreds of miles away from his family to somewhere he will know no-one except his wife and her family and have no support network of his own, should the relationship break down and his health become worse?

Why do you assume that he's elderly? He's 12 years younger than my mother.

They are codependent and your mother cannot figure out how to pull away because everything has become a crisis for him. Its very sad but she can’t move because he won’t change.

It sounds like coercive control to me. Especially getting cats when he knows you’re allergic, seems deliberate. This relationship is very one sided. My own mum was in a similar marriage and I persuaded her to leave. Despite the fact he was spending all her disability money on fags and whisky and they couldn’t join the mobility scheme because of it, even after she left and had her own life she constantly said she missed him because he had looked after her. He didn’t, he controlled her. Then she tried to be dependent on me but I had a kid with autism, a part time job and was studying for a law degree. I felt like she expected that I should fill the gap. Sadly if someone is this codependent there is no easy answer.

You can visit your mum and stay in a hotel OP. Why haven't you done that already? Your siblings too?

It does sound tough for your mum she hardly knew the man then, he's had a stroke. Can he not work at all though? What would he do if it wasn't for your mum?

I think your Mum just wants to vent. Waiting around for him H to be different is keeping her stuck. She has options but she isn’t ready/ willing to explore them.

Listen but remember that until she’s ready to move on from her passiveness, things won’t change.

I'm not convinced that he can't work at all @Sweetheart7 . From what my mum describes, he has more mental health issues holding him back than anything else. Understandable but he hasn't reached out for professional help either which is on him.

I'm not confident with motorway driving but have caught the train a few times. With train fayre and hotel costs,it's highly expensive for me to do.

Huh? Are you reading the same thread? In what ways the woman crying about her life better off where she is?