Friendship issues.. hot and cold friend

[Muggins79]

Hi, I’ve been in Mumsnet for a while but have signed up under a new name.

I could really do with some support and advice about an ongoing friendship issue I have. Please be gentle with me as I’m feeling quite vulnerable.

Background, my closest friend (best friend) of 20+ years have always had a close friendship. Our kids are all friends and we’ve spent a lot of time together over the years.

In recent months she’s become distant with me at times, barely replied/sent texts, didn’t want to meet up, ignoring stuff on social media etc. I asked on a number of occasions if all was ok and either got ignored or very brief one line answers, even when I said I was worried I’d unintentionally upset her there was no real response. Then all of a sudden things seem normal again?

I appreciate I sound like a teenager. I have extremely low self esteem and am a people pleaser by nature. I am trying really hard to stop this but I just can’t. I am so scared that she doesn’t want to be my friend anymore and won’t tell me. My fear of rejection just makes me fawn all over her even more. I hate myself for my pathetic weak behaviour and constantly tell myself to just distance myself, but I can’t take the silence and always cave in.

I get so upset with her blowing hot and cold with me but never tell her because I would just get ignored/shut down. Our friendship can be a bit one sided at times which isn’t helping how I feel.

Part of me wants to ‘confront’ the issue and ask her what on earth is going on. I thought we were so close but it’s like she’s holding me at arms length but I have no idea why? It is driving me insane and is really affecting me mentally, I feel like I can’t trust her anymore as I never know where I stand, I feel like a yo-yo!

I would be grateful for any advice as I’m really torn as to just leave things and try really hard to back off. Or to try to address the issue and find out why?

Thank you for reading this I know it’s a long post and I feel embarrassed that I’ve let this impact me so much.

@Muggins79 thank you, yes it took a while sadly for me to realise that I was being used. The friendship got more and more distant the better things became for me and when my DH proposed rather than congratulate me made comments about marriage ruining relationships and we should just live together, I was shocked tbh. By the time my wedding came along I don't think I even bothered telling her where or when it was or even the new dates as it had to be rescheduled due to COVID. I was deeply hurt by her behaviour but I've moved on now and i have some other great friends and we are all happy for and supportive of each other, just as it should be.

I think if you truly matter to someone they take the time to stay in contact even if it's a quick text or call it takes seconds. Don't let the way this friend has treated you dent your confidence there are people out there that will value your friendship

Have you read much about self validation? It might help.

I had the same. Friends for 17 years.

I eventually decided to just stop initiating contact with her due to her constantly cancelling. We met up December 2022. I stopped arranging catch ups as she would always cancel. We then met up in February 2024, she tried cancelling and I just said ok and the next thing I know she was at my door.

We work in the same industry. I was in the role that she has now been promoted too at a different company. I only hear from her now with questions she needs help with regarding work and I tend to not respond. It very much feels like I'm being used.

My best friend is doing the same gone from chatting every other day to once every two weeks maybe never meet up she said she knows she is being a shitty friend but it’s the menopause

@Watchkeys no I’ve not heard of self validation. I will look it up.

@Tara336 you're right it takes two seconds to reply to a text. I can’t believe your ex friend responded like that to you getting married, that must have been so hurtful.

@whenthelightsgoout123456 im sorry you’ve been through this too. It does sound like she is using you. Do you feel better for distancing yourself?

@Nicetobenice7 that sounds sad. Genuine question but why would the menopause cause your friend to reduce contact with you? Has she other stuff going on? How are you dealing with it?

I think after reading all the replies on here and spending all day thinking about things, it’s reinforced that I just need to accept things are different for whatever unknown reason and back right off. I am worth more than begging someone for the crumbs of friendship. I hope that somehow things turn out ok and my friend comes back but I think I’m kidding myself tbh so need to work on building myself up mentally to cope with the loss.

I agree that it definitely feels like a bad relationship rather than a friendship it’s extremely destructive.

@Mary46 totally agree! Feels like people are easily replaceable and people aren’t loyal or reliable!

To give some insight from the other side, I am naturally quite avoidant in many relationships. I find it triggers anger in me and a sense of being put upon when friends have expectations of me.

Most of my friends are very loving and close and I am with them, and we would help each other if asked and would offer support and would try to regularly meet up. But among probably six "best" or closest friends there isn't a one who would ever come and guilt trip me about not having been in touch, or lean in too hard into asking for more contact, sending flowers etc. There can be gaps of weeks between contact. And these are my best and oldest friends, the friends for life.

People I have met more recently, even say 10 years ago, I see as having no demand on my time. It's brilliant to see them and I value and cherish it. But there is no sense that it sets an expectation of any further intimacy. Sometimes they become close, sometimes drift. I feel very claustrophobic at the thought of being obligated to nurture the friendships. If it's worth it to both of you, you nurture it automatically by being interested in each other.

A friend once had not much time to meet up, so I ended up not meeting her very often, as I had a busy schedule and our schedules sort of clashed, often. She sent me a pass-ag Christmas card saying "I hope some day we meet again". I found that really rude - you have to take a hint if someone isn't changing their schedule for you, it's because they don't want to. Have some pride and don't chase anyone!

@Immemorialelms thank you for your reply and a different perspective on things.

just to clarify I do have other close friendships that are more like the ones you describe. We are there for each other, confide in each other are support etc but the friendships are very relaxed and natural. I can be honest about my feelings and they are honest in return.

It’s only this particular friendship that I am having issues with.

I totally take your point that it can be overwhelming to have someone demand attention, want more from you and this could cause you to become avoidant with them because it’s just too much pressure.

I think in my situation we’ve had what I thought was a two way friendship where both parties were equally invested. I’m always conscious of not coming across as needy, but when someone who you’ve spent many hours each week with suddenly backs off with lame (likely untrue) excuses it is very hard to understand, let alone accept.

What you've described, OP, with you and this person lately and previously....isn't a friendship

You've said there's been a few red flags over the years, and now this

Why would you want a friend like this?

Friendships aren't about stress and worry and noticing red flags and lies and gaslighting etc

Honestly.....if I were you I would pull right away. Go no contact for 3 months

See what happens

What normally happens with manipulative gaslighters is they sense the others' withdrawal and come rushing back

THEN you will know who this person is AND it will help you learn how to look after yourself

@Bestyearever2024 thank you for your reply. I agree with everything you’ve said, why on earth I’m continuing to put up with this I truly don’t know!

Im not sure I’m strong enough to go no contact but I am definitely going to pull myself away from the situation. I need to focus on myself and my own wellbeing and not someone who doesn’t actually care.

Exactly I'm so upset it hurts so bad ...its not only me her best friend ...she is doing it to others too xx

Yes.....you're right. She doesn't care. I think your self confidence will gradually grow if you surround yourself with people who DO care 🥰

Op I learnt a hard lesson what could I do for them. Cousin only got in touch to find out my daughter college place.!! Im done being used. My neighbour said she lost her confidence in menopause. Feel Im disheartened in friends since this.

@Mary46 why are people so self centred, manipulative and horrible?!!
It totally feels like being used and picked up and put down like a play thing!

@Bestyearever2024 i think you’re right that my confidence/self esteem will increase once I’m out of this toxic situation.

I feel so angry too!!!

@Nicetobenice7 sending you a hug 💐

Yes muggins not nice. This girl is an only daughter so its all about me me. Lol. I dont know found it all quite hurtful. No loyalty now in people😐

Read up on attachment styles—learned behaviors and “character strategies” that we learn quite early. I think you will find yourself under “anxious” as in “anxious attachment.” Its not meant to be perjorative: but once you see it you can start to look at the people in your life snd determine who is good for you and who is not. Someone who is good for you has a secure attachment style. They are honest, direct, loyal, and reassuring. They don’t play games. They don’t use you to fill a void and drop you for a better offer.

Meanwhile you can work on yourself. It is counterintuitive but you can have better friends—fewer but better—(its the same with boyfriends). Set good boundaries. Invite people to do things with you (take control of your time and activities). If they say no don’t change your plans look for someone else. Stop being a people pleaser—instinctively you believe that if you say yes to everything then they will be your friend snd care about you. That can be true but it can also mean you are taken for granted and when you are a little bit inconvenient they get angry and freeze you out. Don’t be overly accommodating or always do all the work in the relationship. Friendship is like any other muscle in the body: if one arm does all the work the other arm loses strength.

OP, you're not the only anxious people pleaser in town by a long way!

Some good advice given to me, take a bar of chocolate / glass of wine then plot your friendship circle like a dartboard. The closest in the centre are the most important to you right now, but you can have friends all over & on the periphery. Also, know that people move closer to the centre, then at other times further away.

I guess just see that friendships are always in flux. You don't need to keep stressing with your friend, with talks etc etc. Just see her as a friend that has drifted out of your centre for the time being and concentrate on your more responsive friends. Things will change up again.

😘

Oh my goodness I’ve just looked at attachment styles and ‘anxious attachment’ describes me perfectly. I have never even heard of that before, your post and what I have just been reading is truly enlightening to me.

I honestly could cry from reading your post as it just sums everything up. I’m going to do some more research now, but so much is making more sense to me, my upbringing has definitely had an impact on how I am today.

the description of someone with a secure attachment style describes one of my other close friends perfectly. I always feel good after I’ve spoken to her/spent time with her.. that’s how I should be!

wow!!

I love this idea. I’m going to sit down tonight and take a good long look at the people in my life and where they fit…
Such good advice, thank you so much.

This is interesting. I had a close friend who would periodically become very negative around me. She would subtly, but obviously, put me down, and do things like arrange to meet me only to let me down at the last minute (including on my birthday!). It felt like she was doing it on purpose. Eventually I would get fed up and disengage, then weeks or even months later she would contact me to sort of talk things through and then the whole cycle would start again.

She once told me that she felt like she was always the one to have to do the chasing and apologising, which I didn't understand as why would I chase somebody who is being so bloody moody and flaky with me? I also didn't know what I was supposed to be apologising for. God knows I'm not perfect, but... Err, I'm sorry I prepared for you to come to stay for the week only not to show up, and not tell me you weren't showing up? I'm sorry you cancelled on me 30 minutes before we were supposed to meet for dinner?

A couple of months ago she started to become very negative around me again and didn't respond to my last message, so I left it. I've wondered if it's a test to see if I'll chase her (which I won't). She has said she has an anxious attachment so what you've said really resonates.

@Muggins79 I think you're right that it would really help to work on your self-worth and self-esteem, which is what I've been trying to do over the past couple of years in order to try to avoid those horrible feelings of rejection/there must be something wrong with me/if people let me down I must be worthless. It's really hard, but establishing that I'm an ok person (can't quite bring myself to say I'm 'good', so ok is a compromise) and really believing that has helped a lot. And also coming to terms with the fact it's better to be alone and have no one than people who treat you badly. It took a long time for me to figure that one out, much to my detriment! It's much easier for me to say 'bye' to the people who make me feel like shit now. You sound really lovely and you deserve better than to be treated like this.

@TwelveAngryWhiskers your friend sounds awful… but I can relate so much to this! You feel like you end up saying sorry for stuff and you don’t even really know what you’re apologising for.

With regards to not responding to messages, do you think it’s so she can get your attention and see if you chase her to make her feel wanted and special?

My friend will never tell me what the issue is though and hates confrontation. She would rather just ignore everything than have an uncomfortable conversation. Whereas although I lack confidence I would always rather address the issue and talk things through/apologise if necessary and move on.

What have you done to work on your self esteem and to realise you’re a good person? (I’m sure you’re lovely!) it feels like I have a mountain to climb at the moment to enable me to get to the point where I can be strong for myself.

I am so glad I was brave lol and made this thread. I couldn’t have asked for kinder people to respond. The advice and observations I’ve read on this thread have been so very helpful and insightful.

How do I physically stop myself from chasing her? I feel like an addict ffs.

On a more positive note I’ve spent some time today looking for a new therapist as I feel that it would be beneficial to help me work on my own self esteem/people pleasing issues so hopefully I don’t have to deal with this crap again!

Life's too short, sack her off. Why would you want to stay friends with a liar anyway?