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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Husband Hoarder

59 replies

user1476041120 · 07/03/2024 12:37

Can you advise me of how to deal with my husband who I suspect has a hoarding disorder. He will not throw anything away - gets really angry if I dispose of old newspapers that he has not read ( but they are weeks old ) and old clothes that do not fit or are worn out. Old tools and garden stuff is packed into a very large shed AND a single garage, that you cannot get in it because of stuff . These are just small examples of his hoarding . The main thing is tools and DIY materials IN our home . He buys tools and DIY materials intending to do a project but he never completes the task . The furthest he gets is to demolish the internal electrics / plumbing of our home and just not put it back. Its not that he can't do it - as soon as everything is ripped out - he procrastinates and will not get on with the renovation at all . I fear that our home will become unsellable if he carries on like this. My mental health is really suffering because of his behaviour but I don't know how to start to get help. Family just say - get someone to finish the work , but I fear that he will just keep starting another 'Project' and it will never end, unless I get help . We are in our 70's and I just want to be finished with DIY of any sort . At the moment we have no hot water , no central heating and only a wood burner for heat at night. I have had to go out ALL DAY this winter as the house is so cold. No heat in the bedrooms all winter! Please can you just give me any advice about what to do

OP posts:
dawdlingtuesday · 09/03/2024 04:52

This is so awful OP. I had a friend who used to do this. She would buy a house and convince herself she was 'doing it up' by ripping out cupboards, half knocking down walls, tearing up floorboards - none of which she had the money or will to fix or replace. Like you she ended up with no heating or hot water, surrounded by piles of plastic and rubbish she'd found in skips for her 'house project'.

She decided to have the house valued and was horrified to discover she'd knocked 40k off the value. That seemed to be the shock that finally got through to her. It was too late to repair it all by then so she sold at a loss to a developer. She now lives in rented accommodation because that's the only way she can stop herself from a strange compulsion to 'deconstruct' her home

Clearly your husband badly needs help and you cannot continue to live this way. I don't have any suggestions but I think you're very right to be concerned.

emmsee · 09/03/2024 06:16

@Elleherd that's such a useful, thoughtful post. I think we've all learnt something.

FindingMeno · 09/03/2024 06:32

I know it's a huge mental health problem but I'm afraid I would still be ruthless.
You deserve a decent quality of life.
I would give an ultimatum. Either he allows the issue to be resolved or you are done.
Do you have children? Could you enlist their help?

RantyAnty · 09/03/2024 06:33

If he's been like this for 50 years, there really isn't that much you can do other than hire people to fix whatever needs to be fixed and tolerate him or work on getting a divorce.

He can bluster and threaten all he wants, but when a judge tells him to do something, he'll have to do it.

I have two relatives who were severe squalor hoarders. I absolutely hate hoarders. They are always abusive, and I see hoarding as abusive.

rwalker · 09/03/2024 06:41

Can you do one room for you then at least you’ll have your own little sanctuary

hot water and heating I would set a deadline and stick to it

user1471538283 · 09/03/2024 06:44

Can you get some free legal advice? If you divorce he would have to sell to give you half.

He is clearly very unwell and nothing will make him stop hoarding or these projects. All you can do is save yourself

With half the house value you could get a lovely little home just for you and have your DGC to stay!

Catopia · 09/03/2024 07:12

You have two issues - him and the state of the house.

Make a GP appointment for him, march him there and request a psychological referral. You will need psychological help to deal with the hoarding behaviours. Take photos to take to the GP with you to explain what you are dealing with.

Would a plumber/heating engineer be able to get to access where they need to get to to do the work? If so, tell him he's had his chance to fix the house now and call in professionals to get it safe and habitable. If he can't cope with that, send him out of the house for the day whilst they come in and do the work. He cannot reasonably expect you to live like that in winter, and more to the point the weather has been so cold and damp that the property will start getting damp/mould if it's not heated properly, and then you have more problems. Point out to him that he's probably spent more on stuff to do the job than it would have cost to get someone to just do it.

Make clear to him that it's non-negotiable that there need to be safe spaces in the house that are not full of tools/dangerous items for your grandson.

I appreciate that throwing stuff out might be traumatic for him at this stage. However, starting to organise what he has into groups which are in set space, so that he can see he already had 50 spanners, 6 electric screwdrivers, 4 drills etc etc might help you to curb the spending on more, and will also help when the big decluttering has to happen as will hopefully be easier to negotiate letting go of stuff. Can do a boot fare or something and use that money to pay for the professional work on the house.

In the process of doing that, hopefully you will be able to identify some stuff that is clearly just rubbish/broken etc, and navigate that out of the door.

Cut off his access to amazon etc.

emmsee · 09/03/2024 07:20

Would your husband agree to sell if you said it was that or divorce? I think your options depend on what support you have. Would you be able to rent somewhere for six months without selling the house? Can you afford a divorce lawyer? Can your family or friends support you with accommodation and going with you to appointments? I wish you the very best of luck it's a horrible situation to be in.

Elleherd · 09/03/2024 09:47

RantyAnty · 09/03/2024 06:33

If he's been like this for 50 years, there really isn't that much you can do other than hire people to fix whatever needs to be fixed and tolerate him or work on getting a divorce.

He can bluster and threaten all he wants, but when a judge tells him to do something, he'll have to do it.

I have two relatives who were severe squalor hoarders. I absolutely hate hoarders. They are always abusive, and I see hoarding as abusive.

You can hate 'till your blue in the face, it may well help stop people like me being prepared to speak up and try and de-mystify the condition for others, but it wont make all of us abusive no matter how you paint it.

My mother was a severe squalor hoarder who ultimately couldn't chose between her children and her mental illness. Yes she was abusive but also very very ill.
I've met hoarders whose behavior amounts to abuse. I've also met plenty of organized and hidden hoarders, often in storage, were no one seeing their homes would have a clue they were suffering this condition.

It is only relatively recently that my home has visibly contained too much for the space we have, even then it is shelved and organized, and clean with normal living space available. (TBH right now we have building work so look like anyone else having to decant several rooms into temporary storage)
Food cupboards are labeled and rotated (a clue- that I need to) fridge clean and normal. Floors clean, friends coming and going. My childhood ensured the need for cleanliness and organization is high. My inbox however, tells it's own story.

Prior to Covid I had a separate workplace which is where my hoarding silently grew. I also have storage because I have worked hard to keep my illness from impacting on my family as best I can. Now I have to work from home the contents of my workshop have to be at home.

Most of us have serious shame and self loathing about not being 'normal.'
Your hatred and claims that all hoarders are abusive is just wasted energy, punching down. It's like claiming all schizophrenics are violent and you hate them. As with all conditions some fit stereotypes and some don't.

There's many very ordinary women on this board fighting this condition, and others living with them. You don't have to like, but you don't have to try and normalize hatred for people with a MH condition either. It helps no-one.

ThePoetsWife · 09/03/2024 10:21

Watch the latest episode of Sort your Life on BBC - and you will see the impact of hoarding on families.

It's so dangerous to have exit routes blocked - what if there's a fire?

Elleherd · 09/03/2024 10:25

user1476041120 Obviously this doesn't solve your real problems, but a plug in oil filled radiator is cheap to run and will give you temporary heat in any room, (Can recommend Screwfix) while you try to move forward.

I would take a 'basic facts' version of this post to the legal boards, and ask about a DIY divorce, and how possible it is to get a fair settlement based on being unable to continue to live with his unreasonable behavior.
I know it feels a terrifying prospect, but if the marriage is too damaged to salvage, and you can only see an unhappy future, then knowing the actual facts of how to do something about it, may help you make decisions, and might empower you to possibly make him view his position differently.

Clearinguptheclutter · 09/03/2024 10:31

Sounds just like my late fil who sadly died and left my mil with
-an entire house full of junk and
-several unfinished house projects

sadly in your case I’d grab the bull by the horns and if possible pay for stuff like heating to be fixed at the earliest possible opportunity

getting rid of the stuff is harder- my dh has some of bis dad’s traits and you can’t really get past it without just chucking it (which would be very hard for them to forgive). Sadly I’d be considering divorce at this point if he won’t engage in trying to sort. You’ll have to help him though and it’s exhausting.

emmsee · 09/03/2024 11:02

Elleherd · 09/03/2024 09:47

You can hate 'till your blue in the face, it may well help stop people like me being prepared to speak up and try and de-mystify the condition for others, but it wont make all of us abusive no matter how you paint it.

My mother was a severe squalor hoarder who ultimately couldn't chose between her children and her mental illness. Yes she was abusive but also very very ill.
I've met hoarders whose behavior amounts to abuse. I've also met plenty of organized and hidden hoarders, often in storage, were no one seeing their homes would have a clue they were suffering this condition.

It is only relatively recently that my home has visibly contained too much for the space we have, even then it is shelved and organized, and clean with normal living space available. (TBH right now we have building work so look like anyone else having to decant several rooms into temporary storage)
Food cupboards are labeled and rotated (a clue- that I need to) fridge clean and normal. Floors clean, friends coming and going. My childhood ensured the need for cleanliness and organization is high. My inbox however, tells it's own story.

Prior to Covid I had a separate workplace which is where my hoarding silently grew. I also have storage because I have worked hard to keep my illness from impacting on my family as best I can. Now I have to work from home the contents of my workshop have to be at home.

Most of us have serious shame and self loathing about not being 'normal.'
Your hatred and claims that all hoarders are abusive is just wasted energy, punching down. It's like claiming all schizophrenics are violent and you hate them. As with all conditions some fit stereotypes and some don't.

There's many very ordinary women on this board fighting this condition, and others living with them. You don't have to like, but you don't have to try and normalize hatred for people with a MH condition either. It helps no-one.

Thanks for turning up here and explaining the condition @Elleherd It's really helpful to the op and to other people like myself who don't have experience of the condition.

MinervatheGreat · 09/03/2024 11:16

Sending a hand hold.
Your husband is abusing you.

A judge will decide about the division of assets so see a solicitor if you think leaving will be helpful. You husband can talk about fighting you in the court as much as he likes. It doesn’t work like that.

Meanwhile, start to take a stand in small ways. Get a small heater for the bedroom for a start! Light the log burner earlier in the day ffs.

You’ve left once, you can do it again. Come on woman, you can do it. The egg timer of life is running out.
Feel the fear and do it anyway!

Elleherd · 09/03/2024 12:01

Your welcome emmsee.
It isn't easy to stand up and say I come from this and suffer from this, but if we allow the continuing of being shamed into silence, the insufficient treatment options and continued damage to those around us will also continue. No one sets out to become a hoarder, or live with someone who is, or discover their child is. Adult conversations are needed.

This is a very good insight into the stresses and often mistakes made in a real family with a classic disorganized major hoarding situation,that isn't squalid, but has made a house unlivable and unsafe, and become abuse with the person causing it, knowing it, but at a loss to change.

The Op is suffering abuse regardless of whether her husband is aware of his hoarding or not. Unless this is the onset of dementia he will have some awareness that the house is cold, he has caused it and he is doing nothing about it. He will be able to see this is causing actual suffering.

Most hoarders are aware at some level of their actual hoarding, but there is a disconnect that allows living amongst it, and many are not aware of it causing actual suffering to others, even when told. It seems impossible that it can be more than irritating or annoying until others leave, because most people don't have an instinctive learnt at the knee idea of what quantity of possessions may or may not cause suffering to others. So it can pass as opinion/lifestyle and a multiplied equivalent of leaving the toilet seat up or not.

Whereas seeing someone shivering is much harder to disconnected from if they care about them, because we all know that it is normal for everyone to suffer through cold or not having a water supply. I hope that makes some sense.

My Hoarder Mum & Me | Britain's Biggest Hoarders E1 | Our Stories

TV presenter Jasmine Harman takes us on an emotional personal journey as she attempts to help her extreme hoarder mother. Subscribe to Our Stories: https://b...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag2v_vN_UCk

Cherrysoup · 09/03/2024 16:19

I echo seeing a solicitor or if you really can’t break up, employ some people to resolve the unfinished projects. He is abusive, you shouldn’t be living like this, it’s awful. So he won’t speak to you? What’s new?

user1476041120 · 11/03/2024 11:18

Hi Thank so much for your post . After reading your suggestions and comments this bit really struck me.

"It is giving him a sense of being in control of things, moving forward, still being ‘vigorous’ and being ‘his own man’, while actually drawing attention to how far out of control, not vigorous or ‘his own man’ he actually is.

I think this all started 35 yrs ago when we lost our 16 yr old only child to cancer. There was nothing my husband or I could do to stop the rapid progression of the cancer, and ultimately our child died after only 6 months of treatment. So at the time my husband felt acutely the loss of control over the situation as any father would. I think maybe now that this was probably the trigger for the hoarding? But I'm sorry for me its not really an answer. He will not entertain the idea that he has a problem and needs help. Me ? - I just want a quiet life with my new grandson to visit, so I am going to try and get the work done by myself. I have a bit of money put by but if it isn't enough I don't know what else - apart from leaving. Its a rock and a hard place, and going round and round in circles. I do really appreciate all the support I have received from everyone on here. Thank you ALL from the bottom of my heart . - Marina

OP posts:
PermanentTemporary · 11/03/2024 12:54

❤️ 💔 Marina what a terrible thing to happen. I hope he can perhaps start to come to terms even just with the idea that this was a cause, that this IS a problem. Best wishes to you both.

Theeyeballsinthesky · 11/03/2024 13:01

Im so sorry @user1476041120 what a very difficult situation. If you want some more support, it might be with contacting your local Age Uk information & advice service. Talking it through with an independent person who could help you explore options you might not have thought of could help

pikkumyy77 · 11/03/2024 13:03

What a deep, compassionate, understanding you have OP!

I would caution you not to spend what little money you have on shoring up the house. He will rip it back out in no time.

Take some time. Re-offer help to him once more? But if he continues to refuse to take your needs into account and to be unable to have insight into his illness then I think the money would be better spent on yourself, by leaving.

TwigletsAndRadishes · 11/03/2024 13:22

Unless he's always been like this I would flag up the possibility that this is a symptom of the onset of dementia.

user1471538283 · 11/03/2024 18:00

I'm so sorry for your loss.

Please don't sink anymore money or time into the house. Any money you have you need to keep if you decide to leave. The house will get worse over time whatever you do to it now unless you can get it all done quite quickly.

Blueskybluesky1 · 11/03/2024 19:54

Coming at this from my own experiences i would second ADHD.

BestZebbie · 11/03/2024 20:03

You cannot sustainably live in a house full of old newspapers with clutter blocking escape routes if your only heating is a wood fire! I'd start by getting the fire brigade in for a chat.

Girliefriendlikespuppies · 11/03/2024 20:04

I echo the posters who suggest getting legal advice. You are entitled to half the house so you can force him to sell.

It's not your job to fix him, only he can do that.

It sounds miserable and I couldn't live like that.

Put yourself and your grandson first and leave him.

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