Is this a normal M &T group or is it bitchy?

[roseychks]

I need some quick non-judgemental advice. Not sure where to post either. I'm also a first time mothers (although I guess you can tell from my post

There are 8 Mums and babies who meet up once or twice a month. Group was set up by health visitor at local surgery but we now meet up at each others houses. It works ok - useful support. I am not sure how/ why but it feels bitchy but I can't put my finger on it. I think the reason is that some of the others make comments about each others parenting skills behind each others backs and it makes me feel really uncomfortable. I've tried gently saying 'well we all do things differently etc' only to be shot down and I think the others feel that I'm a bit bland.

It's also made me wonder how I am discussed when I am not there, and i feel a bit 'super-sensitive about it when I am normally quite ok with constructive criticism. DD is too young for the other toddler groups around here and I do like many of the other mums although two or three esp take a lead in the comments. When I mentioned it to a friend with an older child she told me that all M&T groups were like that -it comes with the territory.

1. Is this kind of chat in M & T groups normal? I am genuinely curious.
2. Am I being a bit oversensitive? Sorry for length!

Which is why I refused to attend any, that and the really wet one in the group always attaches to me like a limpet and wants to be my mate. We got strong armed into baby massage group, total tedium, never again.

oh dear
I would say answers could be

1. yes and
2. no

I mean it is obviously crap to judge one another behind backs like that

could you say something like "when you say that about X when she is not here, it makes me wonder what you are saying about me at other times"

would probably be the end for you at the group but might be a good note to go out on

ok, i was part of one of these groups with my first born, and no it was not like that all. In fact i still keep in regular contact three of the five now. I would consider them good friends now as well.

When i see the other two we are still pleased to see each other, we just didnt stay in touch as kids went to different schools etc.

Gah. It can happen in large groups of women.

To be honest, if they dont make you feel comfortable, stop meeting up with them. It's not going to be helpful if you are constantly worried about what they may or may not be saying behind your back.

1. often, but not any i go to. if they are, i find another one.
2. no

Ime (I have 2 dds) M&T groups tend to vary a lot. The ones I have found easiest is when I have gone along and already known one or two of the mums.

I used to find them really difficult. Some I never went back to as I found them "cliquey". I went to some Open Houses arranged by my local NCT and found them better, at least there is a host/ess in who has offered to open up her (generally her not his) home and so I felt more welcomed from the start. I only persevered with social groups because I found it very isolating being at home.

I don't know you so can't comment if you are oversensitive. However what I would say is that there are so many different approaches/styles we will never get on with everybody. Also with both of my girls I have found that I feel very vulnerable for the first few months, like I have kind of lost my confidence a bit.

I agree with VVV, thats how groups of women talk, be it in an office, a mother and toddler group or the pub.

We all have our own ways of doing things, and most of us are convinced 'our way' is right.

And yes they probably do discuss how you do things behind your back if they are that type.

Find me a group of women who don't talk about other women and I'll...eat my hat.

Not all M & T groups are like that - only some , so it doesn`t go with the territory.
TBH I think you would be better finding other people to spend your time with that make you feel good at this vulnerable and challenging time , rather than around people who make you feel fretful....

I go to an M&T group. The (endless) discussions are about school choices. I don't think people know each other well enough outside of the group to pass comment on parenting skills, so it's about more neutral stuff.

I don't think you're being over-sensitive, just someone who doesn't like gossip.

Agree with Franny. I think there is a fundamental problem with these sort of friendship groups - that the main thing you have in common is having a kid born at the similar time - rather than you gelling with people due to shared interests/personalities. When DS was little, there was a cosyish group of me and 2 other mums. But then one mum started slagging off the other to me behind their back. Which was the end as far as I was concerned. The slagged off mother is one of my best friends now though, so alls well that ends well.

Have always hated M&T groups as so competitive, and very gossipy.

Have always found it much better to break away from big groups with a smaller group of 2 or 3 other mums. This is easier if you are attending an organised M&T group.

Rest assured as your child grows up you will meet more (and sometimes, less) like minded people you can spend time with. You will not be stuck with this lot forever.

Thanks all of you.
Maidamess- It's interesting I've been in all female environments before -school etc but not come across this, in the same way. It feels more vitriolic in a way poss because as onepieceoflollipop says that i feel a bit vulnerable.

As to the others - just writing this and your responses have made me see logically how I am not comfortable, never will be with this and might be a good time to close the door gently on this group.....

you don't have to spend time in environments you don't like, even if they're the norm.

break the mold, and don't accept it.

I think I have been really lucky in that my NCT group and the M&T group I attend appear to be devoid of bitchiness. I don't think it is that I am blind to it, we all seem to get on very well and be really supportive. All the mums from M&T now meet in the pub once a month so that we can hang out as adults alone. Therefore my experience would say that M&Ts don't have to be bitchy at all.

I don't think you are being over-sensitive though, a group dynamic like you described can be really stressful.

Warthog - yes I know you're right. But (!) I know this sounds a bit crazy I was feeling under this wierd pressure that DD had to go to this group (and it was my duty) otherwise she would not have any friends. Ridiculous I know with hindsight (she's a baby!).

I blame the hormones....

TBH it just sounds any group would that was made up of people who wouldn't normally socialise together. If you don't get on with them & drop the group & find some people you do. Life's too short to put up with being uncomfortable.

Sounds a bit like my ante-natal group. I ditched them and met a really lovely group of people at a baby/toddler group and we're close friends now. I clicked with them so well that I realised that I'd never quite done the same with the other group.

So no, they aren't all like that.

I went to a group like that and 4 of us still meet up regularly (after 6 years!). I think the reason it has worked is that we haven't been bitchy about each other and we have become friends naturally rather than it being forced on us IYSWIM.

You may find, as the babies get older and some of the mums go back to work etc, that you break up into smaller groups which will work better and , also, you may branch out and go to other toddler groups and meet more people that you may be drawn to in a more normal friendship way.

It's a minefield isn't it? Still, you sound like the nice one in the group -you may disagree but the unwritten rule is that you don't mention it.

Message withdrawn

Tommy - Exactly! I do have a voice in my head sometimes screaming - but I try to quell it.

I agree with the other posters- i went to loads of M&T groups, hated everyone of them and felt uncomfortable- the 'friends' I made, well they didn't last long because we had nothing in common.

I made a lovely friend unsuspectingly when I went back to work after DS was born- we went to school together many moons ago (although were not friends at school), and we were very good friends almost straight away. She had 2 kiddies, one similar age to DS. Nearly 3 years down the line and I don't know what I'd do without her.

M&T groups are hellish IMO, and if I ever produce again I won't be pressured (by HV's), to go within 100 miles of one ever again!

Well there's two factors at work here - one is that just because you have kids the same age, doesn't mean you necessarily have anything else in common with these people. M&T groups vary a lot, and if you are in any way different from the majority at the particular group you are going to (much older/younger, much richer/poorer, the only married one, the only single one, the only one who isn't interested in baby-genius flashcarding etc) then it's going to be a PITA: look for another group.
Also, there is this SAHM thing for some people where, because motherhood is now what you do and what you are it can become unreasonably competitive. It does help to try to keep up some sort of non-mummy socialising or interests.

Message withdrawn

TBH, I don't bother with m&b/t groups. To bitchy and to competitive imo anyway.

I went once when dd was weeks old...never went back and never looked back. I do other things with dd and ds. Music group, gym,shopping,feeding the ducks,baking cakes. I have much more fun than sitting with a load of women discussing potty training and how to get my whites whiter tan white .

Oh (Like jane68) I also did a baby massage group and also ended up with a mad stalker woman who wanted to see me everyday all day..Yeah she may have been bored etc BUT she always seemed to shop where I was..found out where I live etc... to friendly imo..