Have finally admitted both to myself and DH that I absolutely hate his mother, am now wondering how I really feel about DH

[oneplusone]

Because it seems to me slightly illogical that I should genuinely like/love DH if I totally, completely and utterly hate his mother for surely DH has been brought up largely by his mother and must take after her to a greater or lesser degree?

There is a whole long story behind all this which i couldn't go into now as it would run into pages and pages and take all night. But to try and give a bit of brief background, after having been married for 7 years, earlier this year i told DH that I absolutely hated his mother and that I thought she was a nasty peice of work. Until then I had been pretending to like her and trying to get along and basically bite my tongue and not respond to her constant criticsm, spiteful bitchy remarks and general nastiness (all camouflaged under a false veneer of friendliness and amiability).

DH to my surprise didn't react as i expected to my admission and actually spoke to his mum and made her apologise to me for some nasty remarks she made at christmas. However he knows I still hate and despise her and have no respect for her and am only willing to tolerate her company for the sake of DD.

The trouble is now that I am wondering how i truly feel about DH as unfortunately i can see his mother in him in so many ways. Luckily he has a wonderful dad for whom i have genuine respect and affection and so DH also has some good qualities from him. But I fear DH definately has learnt/inherited his mother's critical and harsh nature, her lack of empathy and compassion and I just don't know what to do.

I don't hate Dh but do i like him? I just don't know. He's a good dad and husband in lots of ways but his bad qualities seem so much worse as i can see now they are directly from his mum.

I'm very confused, Is anyone else in a similar position or is it just me as i suspect?

is worth challenging your dh's behaviour, if he is over critical, state - "that was a critical thing to say" if it is a learned habit it is hard to unlearn it because you don't realise that you do it!

So, when your DD gets older, it will be OK for someone to dislike her, because thay don't like you?

Your DH is a different person, he is not his mother. Also the dynamics of the relationship between him and you are so totally different from those beween you and MIL, it is ridiculous to project the way you feel about her, onto dh.

Personally I think if your dh has told his mother that her treatment of you is wrong, he deserves your respect and affection, not dislike.

clumsy, i don't think you read my post properly. The reason i dislike DH is because he has the same traits that i dislike in his mother ie he is very/overly critical, is quite a harsh/hard person under his amenable exterior. It's not unheard of for children to take after their parents you know!

Cargirl, i think you're right, i do need to start challenging DH's behaviour and pointing out when he's been critical. Coupled with the over critical trait he has a lack of praise trait, again just like his mum, so he has, over the years made me feel very low by his constant criticism and put downs and complete lack of praise/acknowledgement of the things i am good at (surely there must be something he thinks i'm good at?)

agree very much with clumsymum, that it is really tough for a DH to tell your MIL that your treatment of you is wrong. Him doing that shows that he loves and respects you, and will stand up for you. That's pretty bloody good!

I think my DH is an example of a good man who became that way despite some incredibly crap parenting (there's hope for us all, then...)

So, in response to the OP, if you hate your MIL, PLEASE don't feel you have to hate your DP.

Absolutely agree with cargirl, challenge specific behaviours in terms that he can specifically understand eg "when you did/said x, it made me feel y"

sorry for long post, have been living this for 14 years of marriage now, so hope this helps...

I can't stand my MOL and have always kept her at arm's length.

However, I absolutely adore my partner and think he is the most wonderful man who ever walked the earth

I have a saying... (that my partner agrees with, btw

When a woman looks for a partner, she should select him on the basis of great raw material and never, ever expect to find a finished product. The woman makes the man

Or, if you like - discount his upbringing and re-educate him

Hi keepcalm and anna, thank you for your comments. It's very hard as generally I think DH is a great guy and he does have a lot of good qualities.

Anna, i would LOVE to retrain DH but i fear he has been utterly brainwashed by his mum. He can't see it but i know at times there are things that he says and does and beleives which are simply her views regurgitated. But he thinks these are his own thoughts. I can see it all like an outsider (which i am in relation to his family) so i feel i can see things he can't.

I am interested in how you keep your MIL at arms length? That is what i intend to do but am not sure how it works in practice?

Apparently she has agreed to 'guard her tongue' in future but i don't expect a leopard to change it's spots. DH on the other hand seems to think she can change her whole personality overnight and that she will suddenly stop being bitchy, nasty and spiteful. We will wait and see.

I do respect DH for standing up to his mum, but i think it was because he was genuinely shocked at some of the things his mother has said to me and he agreed she was totally out of order. I hope his eyes has been opened to her just a little bit by all of this, perhaps then he might be more amenable to me suggesting some changes in his own behaviour. .

Surely, if you fell in love with and married this man then you have seen aspects of his character beyond his mother's traits?

Perhaps you are over-thinking all this? Try and keep your distance from MIL and focus on the parts of him which so appeal to you rather than obsessing over the ones which don't...

Don't want to sound harsh, but there is a mindset thing at work here.

unfortunately i realise i didn't really know him that well when we got married, we got married within a year of meeting. And i hardly met his mum before we got married as they were abroad a lot of the time.

I do try and focus on his good traits, but the not so good traits just remind me so much of his mum that my blood starts boiling just at the thought of her. I wish we never had to see her again but that will never happen.

I know where you're coming from oneplus. Have a similar thing, although my PIL are just odd and irksome, I don't actually hate them. But things they do wind me up and I sometimes see it in DP. I try to ignore it and focus on his good points...which can be hard when he's being a miserable get like his mother...

I'm coming from the point of view that I'm the critical, negative one (thanks parents!) and it is very painful when dh points out to me how it's making him feel but I'm working on it!

oneplusone

I keep my MOL at arm's length by never, ever asking her for favours (occasionally my partner asks her for a favour, like babysitting, but it is only ever for a good cause that has an impact on her eg we have a joint meeting with our daughter's headmistress, we are going to the bank or lawyer's for a meeting etc) and being very polite but quite distant - I make sure I always have the upper hand.

I also discuss her behaviour at length with my partner, and have discussed with him the aspects of his behaviour that he picked up from her. He is pretty open to the idea that we pick up behaviours (good or bad) from our parents/environment and is keen to change poor patterns.

Maybe you could have some counselling? TBH I think your problem is pretty common and I am sure there are some good counsellors out there. IF, of course, you think the raw material is worth having still

I didnt realise how common this was.

I am in pretty much the same situation only I cant keep MIL at arms length because for the time being she is living with us

I would like to ask though, how do you all manage to talk to your DP/DH about their mothers behaviour? He always says hes stuck in the middle. So i bite my tongue all day whilst hes at work, then I have to keep biting my tongue when he gets home, I dont ever get to let it out!

Your partner/DH actually has to come to the realisation that the woman he has chosen to spend his life with is you, not his mother. He can't "go along" with her if you and he don't agree with her just for the sake of keeping the peace.

Try not to compare your DH and MIL too much as he can't be that bad if you have been OK together for 7 years? The same trait does not have to be the same thing in both people. I have similar probs with DH and FIL, I get on fine with FIL but I would def not want to be married to him so it does not help me to think how similar DH is to him. I think it is only natural these thoughts are going through your head as you have buried your criticisms of your MIL for so long.

Maybe you could try a bit of refresher relationship counselling, or just some counselling for you on your own if you think you just need to get a few rants out of your system?

oneplusone - I can identify with how you feel about MIL being projected onto DH. The lack of compassion you describe etc is exactly the attitude my MIL instilled into my DH. For example, she taught him:

-you should not give money to charity, you should keep it for yourself
-you should not share anything that belongs to you with anyone else
-the most important thing is to look after yourself (number 1) and it doesn't matter about anyone else as it isn't your concern
-you (ie DH) are the most clever & good looking etc human being in the world and arrogance is a trait you should be extremely proud of

I could write pages of it, but she is truly proud of these things that she taught him and will admit it even now, totally barefaced. Anyway, point is, he now spends more time with me than with her and I have tried to help him understand that these are not good things! He does understand this and he has changed his ways to a certain extent. Try not to take it out on your DH, he has just been brought up by her, he isn't a clone and he can be reasoned with. I have 3 younger siblings and since I have been with DH, I have involved him in giving them help that they need, whether this is with job applications/practical help or whatever. He has willingly (although not at first) helped them and I think helping them has helped him.

crokky.

My MOL taught my partner that:

• no-one can be trusted, ever
• he should tell his mother everything

and other horrors in the same vein...

However, very recently, my partner admitted that while his mother had always said of his previous girlfriends, and ex-wife, that they were not good enough for him, she has not said that of me... so I'm feeling a little bit warmer towards her

I love the way you described your MIL, for she is also mine !! THe snidey comments only meant for your ears, but then if you break them down and try to explain them to someone, its you who ends up looking unreasonable because her snidiness is so subtle.
Anyway, I got so stressed that I very nearly divorced DH just to get away from her! DH wouldnt take the situation seriously at first. But when youre dealing with the constant drip drip drip of nastiness, it really does wear away your self-esteem and confidence. My MIL even had me doubting my sense of self! These people are bullies through and through.
So how to deal? Well you must get your husband on your side, otherwise its a losing batle- this is make or break (well it was for us). It is so hard for people (especially men) to stand up to their mothers when it really counts. But hell have to take your side. I told my husband "Do you really think that if I leave, that your problems will all be over? Because they wont! Your mother will treat the next woman like this, and the next and the next and itll carry on until you <span class="italic">tell</span> her to start respecting the person you have chosen to spend your life with!" Tell him that at the end of the day if she doesnt respect you, then ultimately she doesnt respect him, because you are his choice. I dont see this as your problem as much as it is his.
Ignore the "youll be a mother in law one day" comments. Becoming a MIL does not automatically give us tickets to allow us to become a <span class="italic">bully</span>. And being a daughter in law does not mean we should suddenly have to put up with nastiness! <span class="italic">youll be a MIL one day, so then you can bully your DIL . NO thanks. What warped thinking. If I was an irritating PITA or worse, wouldn`t it be better to have someone tell me so then I can take stock of my life and re-consider how I treat people!

i have no advice but i know how you feel it was like this with ex mil... she was truley awfull.. i thought it was becuse she didnt like the fact i had a child and was even awful to my daughter again very clever in what she did, all behind my partners back... and very subtle but very very hurtful.. when my partner wasnt around she would challenge me about things, and he wouldnt belive me when i told him about stuff...

he once saw it first had when she blew up about my daughters dad not spending time with my daughter but mil precious son was spending lots of time with my dd> she couldnt handle this almost like she was jelious...anyway she ended up headbutting me - i was pregnant at the time...

she used to sit on her sons lap and say who do you love more me or -- (my dd) this is a grown women but partner said she was just messing around > but it was not like that to me it was cruel malipulative behaviur....

it broke us in the end now i am single parent with 2 kids

Hi, thanks for all your comments, I'm glad, but sad to see I'm not alone

I am seeing a counsellor, not about this specific issue but about another family related one which is intertwined with this one.

I have thought overnight and realise my DH did stand up to his mother for me which i know must have been quite hard for him and he has proven that he does not take after her in every way as she would never do the right thing in a that sort of way. (This is one of the reasons why i married him, I felt he was a decent guy and would do the right thing if called upon)

But one of the ways in which he takes after her is in having a real lack of empathy for other people especially when they are going through a difficult time in their life. All MIL does in this situation is think about the impact it has on her and feel sorry for herself rather than having empathy and compassion and sympathy for the other person (i think you can probably tell that the 'other person' I am talking about is me!). I have found DH to be the same on occasion, he thinks he's having a hard time when it's true my problems do of course affect him but I'm the one actually going through the nightmare and it's much much worse for me. It's hard to explain fully without going into all the details but I do feel sad that I have a DH with such a hard/harsh side to him. I think I have to accept it as I don't think he will ever change, he was brought up by a harsh mother and so he has learnt to be harsh himself, although they both hide it with a very pleasant, at times even charming exterior. A bit like wolves in sheeps clothing .

But, I have to keep reminding myself that DH has a lot of good qualities as well, whilst MIL is nothing but a harsh, nasty, critical woman who I will endeavour to see as little as possible in future.

In response to Anna, I never ask her for any sort of favours, but unfortunately DH does and I inevitably get involved as well. I have tried to suggest to him he should be more independent of his parents, I think it's something i will have to work on and help him 'break free' of them, emotionally and mentally at least.

Thank god for this thread, Oneplusone. Now i have the balls to admit that I too actually hate my MIL. I don't just dislike her, i actually can't stand to be around her. i'll try and explain why:

again, she's SO critical and amen to the subtle nasty comments that make you look ridiculous if you get upset by them. Is there a school where they teach MILs to do this?

Tried to bribe dp into leaving me when i was 2 months pregnant. Didn't speak to either of us for the next 6 months when he refused to obey her, then turned up when i was 8 mths pg and announced she was buying us a cot. and he just went along with it, and i was too knackered to argue.

Interrupts me, talks over me, makes decisions on dd's behalf without consulting me, pushes my hands away when i am attending to my dd and tries to dress her/ help her with her food/ etc.

Leaned over 18 mth dd in her highchair and demanded that she say 'Thank you for my lovely dinner and afters' before lifting her out. Got all po-faced when i laughed my arse off at her and told her she was being ridiculous.

Has actual tantrums because 'I'm rejecting her, just like her own mother rejected her.' this aint the Sopranos, love, and i aint Dr Melfi. Feck off!!!

Faked an angina attack because i wouldn't aquiesce to her every whim. Dp bought it hook line and sinker and went apesh*t at me, and i actually started to question whether they're just too alike for me to actually like him at all...

Taught dp to worship money and status, that being fat equals being bad, to be obsessed with food, to lie if you can get away with it. Half the time i feel i'm trying to educate a grown man about right and wrong because his mother screwed him up so much. [anger]

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"I have tried to suggest to him he should be more independent of his parents, I think it's something i will have to work on and help him 'break free' of them, emotionally and mentally at least."

I think that's right. I have done a lot of that, and it has worked pretty well. He is actually much less frustrated by them than he was - but it's taken a long time.

Your MIL sounds even worse than mine! Mine has an inferiority complex and is very defensive, in the style of a Jack Russell, but luckily DH is confident and laid-back!

Your MIL sounds very insecure and unhappy. Did she have an awful upbringing / previous life experiences? Does she see you as a threat (I think my MIL did, but now seems to have accepted that DH is no longer just her son, but a grown man who has his own family....) We have had a few fallings out along the way, but then she falls out with everyone sooner or later!
Everybody is offering good advice - keep your DH aware of when he is behaving badly and hopefully he'll try to change.