You don't have be right - is this gaslighting

[Flyhigher]

My DD16 always says that You don't have to be right all the time. Directed at me. This is gaslighting surely. Or it's a manipulation. To get her own way.

People are always saying this. It actually means that they want to be always right. It's a killer put down. What's the comeback? Or the right way to diffuse it?

"But the freedom to make mistakes is core to discovering your identity."
Quote from The New York Times today.

The world would be a better place if we all heeded that

I think when people say you have to be right all the time it's manipulation, projection.

They have to be right all the time.

They get in early say that and you have to back down or appear difficult.

She has a toxic friend that manipulates her. Does this to her all day long.

She picks very chatty / mean friends always on. And they dominate you.

Do you think that when people refuse to engage with other viewpoints and just repeat what they’ve previously said, that might be dismissal and evasion?

Do you think that when people describe “what other people think”, that might be projection?

Do you think when people engage in triangulation and blame-shifting to third parties instead of addressing the core issue, that might also be projection?

🙄

Seems like you were seeking validation of your view on here (ie to be right?!) rather than be willing to accept any constructive criticism or helpful suggestions. Perhaps you and your daughter are just too similar and clash as a result. Obviously that is very common with teens but as the adult in the relationship unfortunately it’s down to you to take the high road, no matter how much you butt heads. As others have suggested, let her develop some independence and make mistakes as a result, set clear boundaries and always be consistent in approach.

She has made mistakes. Then asks for help. Then gets angry with any solution that's not hers. I do let her make mistakes, you can't actually stop teens determined to make mistakes!

There seems to be an idea here that I'm actually trying to not let her make any mistakes. That's not possible. And yes I'd like some support.

I have tried to set boundaries and be consistent. That involves some repetition. Whenever I do, she then says things like you always have to be right. And boundary setting involves her saying you have to be right. So ... it's very hard.

Shw just wants cintrol over her own life and to make hwr own decisions even if they arent alwaya right.which is fair enough

She has control. Too much probably. Whenever I try to set boundaries or offer a different view. I get accused of always being right.

So if she only wants to go with her solution for whatever the problem is, just let her, and let her fall on her arse if you think she's wrong? If she's badgering you into something that isn't convenient for you, just tell her no? If she says "you don't always have to be right" just say "OK" and walk away and let her do her thing?

Meant to quote this originally. Just don't offer a different view (unless it's something serious that absolutely needs your involvement).

What do you mean exactly when you say you set boundaries? Give us an example.

Is she asking for a different view? Or are you just giving her your opinion whether she wants it or not?

She asks for help. Or just demands something. If it's not exactly what she wants and I say something different it's .. you're always right. Whenever I try to give reasons for what I'm saying. Then I'm wrong.

can you take feedback without getting defensive? do you need your narrative to prevail? do you get angry with people if they interpret the same situation differently?

Or does that discribe her? tbh, my mother is a very good gaslighter and it's the kind of thing she might say when she has refused to have a conversation. There is no reciprocity, but if i try to have a conversation she'll skip to the end like we had the conversation and say something like ''why do you have to be right?'' even though it was never discussed at all (in fact i got the silent treatment for trying to raise it) so, it was her way or the high way, always but she book ends the whole betrayal with something just like ''do you have to be right''.

so i can't vote!

That's not an example. It's a generalisation.

An example is like...

She wanted to go to the movies at 3pm with a friend. She asked me to give her a lift. I said I couldn't because I had to pick up some things from a shop in the opposite direction. She said, 'You can do that another time, can't you?' I said no, because I needed some of the things for tomorrow. I suggested she could get the bus. She said there was no bus. I said yes, there's one at 2pm that will get her there for 2.45. She said, "Oh it's impossible to ask you anything, you're always right, aren't you? All I want is a lift!"

Perhaps when you give her a solution to a problem, make it clear that it’s just a suggestion.

Your solution may not be what she wants - fine, she can come up with something else.

And perhaps, if she accuses you of always having to be right just tell her no one is right all the time, we are all just bumbling along doing the best we can under the circumstances.

Don't get into this fight in the first place.

You need to stop giving her solutions and just keep going back with questions about how she can resolve it herself.

She moans about a lift, get her a bus timetable. She moans about a car park, stop the car and let her get out and make her own way there. She wants help with a piercing, she sorts out a doctor or whatever solution she needs.

She says 'You are always right', say 'Good thinking, I'll leave you to sort it' and walk away and make a cup of tea or something.

Is this the new excuse 'I don't agree so it's gaslighting'

So you negotiate or order?

Ok. Whatever it is. It doesn't feel very comfortable. I feel upset by it. It doesn't sound like an argument or a point. It's a shut down.

She's going to say this sort of stuff OP, she's a teenager. You don't have to agonise over it or read into it just because it comes out of her mouth. If you're sure you're not being controlling/not listening to her, just let her experience the consequences of whatever it is that she's determined to do (unless of course it's actually dangerous) and shrug inwardly is my advice. She's not going to like it and she's going to complain. That doesn't mean that you have to hop to it and get involved again- you've already given your advice, and she can accept it or not.

But from the tone of your posts, it might be better to try and talk to her about it at a time when you're not feeling totally wound up by each other. Perhaps say you've noticed that she says this a lot and wonder why, because you're giving advice that she seems to be asking for. I'd be prepared to at least explore the possibility that there's something in the way you're communicating with her that makes her feel not heard. In return, she needs to try not to respond to you with put-downs. Working together to find a healthier way of communicating with each other is probably the best solution.

If she is using it to shut down the conversation then that's a fair enough assessment.

That is accurately not at all gaslighting mind you. Gaslighting is taking a fact like 'i locked the house when we left' removing the proof that it was so (unlocking it when you aren't looking), and stating to your face you are wrong to have thought that, mistaken in fact and it was not locked at all, you must be mistaken, or are you crazy? Gaslighting is a twisted deliberate strategy to make you question your own judgement/sanity.

It sounds to me as though there is plenty of clashing going on. No fun for anyone is it!?
If she's a stroppy teenager fighting for her space/independence (reasonably or not) with questionable friends adding prickly communication styles into the mix it would be fair to think her approach isn't the best and frustrating for you too.

But, you can't win this by confronting it head on, so you need to take an adult approach and adapt your strategy to diffuse/depersonalise it.
Recognise as a teen you feel you don't need help and rarely recognise, certainly don't want to, how much you still do.

The suggestion above that you only offer advice when she asks, and make clear when you're available - and when you're not - and then just let things wash over you is good.
When she says you're not always right, shrug, yup that's true, oh well it's just an opinion you don't have to take it and if you'd rather I didn't give it, that's fine...

It sounds like as enjoying as she may well be being, there is an element of personality clash in there, if you can adjust to try to change the pattern of your dynamic that could help.
It won't make her grow up over night but it might help you stay sane while you wait.

I find it helpful to read up on teen development and parenting strategies as well, it helps you recognise what's just standard boundary testing, and what most of us are going through, so helps you not feel it's personal and, honestly, sometimes our natural approach isn't the best and a bit of inspiration on how to tweak it can help stop digging the hole.

@CheekyHobson that's exactly it. Over and over. Sorry I can't remember all the examples. It's all frazzling my brain. But yes. That's if.

I'm definitely not perfect. But her tone and shutdown panics me. Makes me worse.

I do try to get some concrete answers to anchor myself which I think are just logistics. Like. The bus goes at 3. That's not controlling its facts.

However I'm not perfect. Not blaming it all on her at all.

Sounds to me as though you are provoking emotional responses in each other.
Those responses are rooted less in logic/calm reason and more in personality/dynamic/mutual frustration.

In your situation I would seek help in whatever form.
Read books on parenting teenagers
Open a conversation with her in a good well chosen moment, where you observe her point of view, express some understanding and empathy/care and tell her you value your relationship with her and want to talk about what changes you could maybe both make so you can adjust to her new older self. Sometimes our relationships evolve naturally as the child grows, someone's taking stock and thinking about what needs to be left behind and what alternative version could replace it.
With young children we anticipate their beds and intervene in advance, as we transition to adulthood that needs to change to a less anticipatory more responsive assistance. You can tell her that you'd appreciate her help knowing what form of mothering support she would like.
Acknowledge that maybe your personalities might be quite different which may mean that her preferred approach (or yours) doesn't come naturally to you (or her), but you are interested in what a good relationship with you would look like to her...

There's definitely a power struggle going on. She has the element of surprise on her side! I can never be ready. I am not perfect at all. So not blaming her entirely. But it's hard to respond appropriately. I feel bounced into everything.