abusive ex and Christmas self-pity

[thatbigbear]

I don't want to see my abusive ex on Christmas Day but the kids do, fair enough. So my compromise was to invite him for a few hours to see them opening presents. He won't do that as he says it's not fair/too hard for him going home to an empty house afterwards (his family are a couple of hours drive away). So I suggested he had the kids Christmas Eve instead, or Boxing Day, so he can still go to his family on Christmas Day. That's not good enough either as he'll have to cut short his visit and be on the road whilst everyone else is enjoying themselves.

It's all about him. Not even slightly about what the kids might need. I am so sick of him playing the victim when his behaviour is why we're in this situation in the first place. There is no point in pointing that out, I try as hard as I can to grey rock so as not to get dragged back into it all. But god I am sick of it, and of being blamed for what has happened.

Just need to say this to someone as I don't talk to the little ones about this obviously, I know there's no solution but just to keep on as I am. It's just so hard.

Dc can ft him. They need to see you establishing boundaries.. Keep him out of your home.

What is it he actually wants? Sounds like you’ve been fair enough

Why are you trying to fix his problems? They are for him to solve!

Most abusers just want to be able to say ‘I tried’ when really they ‘don’t want to’

So stop bothering and don’t let him in you home. It’s your sanctuary.

DO NOT entertain his nonsense in your home!!!! Please.
Remove the offer.
Tell him he can pick the kids up at a set time and then drop them off. The rest of his plans are his own to sort.

He is still abusing you by making you feel you must accommodate him and he's using the children to do it.

Trying to do the right thing for the kids seems like a good idea OP but it just lines you up for more abuse from him.

"oh well what a shame it won't work. I hope you have a lovely day"

I might entertain a decent ex in my home for a couple of hours. But not this guy. If he comes back and says "oh I suppose I can make it work on xmas day" (as I suspect he will) say back to him "no, i've thought about it and you're right. it is just not fair. do you want them boxing day or xmas eve?"

You've given him option, you've been too accommodating in my eyes, but if he's not happy with what you've offered then tough shit. Stop trying to fix it for him.

You've given him 3 options, including inviting him to your home on Christmas Day. You've been more than reasonable and accommodating. It's not your responsibility to make sure he sees his children. You've offered to make them available on three different days and he's said no to them all. I would get this in writing along with how sorry you are that none of your suggestions are suitable for him etc.
He needs to decide that he needs to put his children first and that he would like to see them whenever. And to communicate this to you to see if this would work.

You gave two options. He declined both.

Your work is done here.

Let him come up with a solution that you can turn down because it is not convenient for you.

You have given him options that suit you.as he has refused them just let him sort. And no he won’t be coming to yours all day.

I agree with everyone else; don’t offer him any more options. If he really wants to see the children, there’s absolutely no reason why he can’t drop them back to you at tea time on Christmas Eve then drive to his family. It’s only two hours so he’d be there early evening & it’s not like he’d be doing anything else if he’s just going to be sat all alone at home, is it?

I would be prepared for him to try and manipulate your DC though. ‘Daddy would love to be with you for Christmas but mummy says I have to leave after you’ve opened your presents’. I think I’d preemptively tell them that you both love them very much, but that you aren’t friends with each other, so you’re happy for them to be with him either before or after, but it would make you sad if he stayed all day.

thank you everyone - I needed to hear what you have said; he is SO good at manipulating people, me and the DC included, and I've slipped once or twice recently and felt sorry for him when usually I am more on my guard. The kids frequently come back from visits talking about how sad he is and that his behaviour wasn't that bad (he has told them this), and because a lot of it was EA towards me, it was largely invisible to them...so I'm being made out to be the villain.

You're right though, I have been more than accommodating, I think I over-compensate to try and stop the kids feeling bad, and then go too far and try and stop him feeling bad, when he's the one that deserves to, not that he recognises that at all, the denial is so strong.

The good thing is I don't have to put up with him on Christmas morning, which I can now look forward to rather than dread!

Definitely be careful of him coming back and saying he does want to come.over on Christmas day since you offered. If he doesn't want to spend the rest of the day alone then he'll make a big thing of 'i wish I could stay for dinner but instead I have to go and be on my own' in front of the kids and you'll find it extremely difficult to get him to leave. You'll be stuck with him for the whole day. Do not let him come to the house.

DO NOT LET HIM INTO YOUR HOME.

This is the number one rule for any abusive ex. You have to assert rock solid boundaries.

Stop listening to his complaints. You are not his therapist or his rehab centre.

It is not your job to facilitate his child contact arrangements.

Find your inner lioness and learn how to completely emotionally detach from him. You might need counselling to help you do this. You are a survivor of domestic abuse. He is a controlling and manipulative individual. Protect yourself and your children at all costs.

You might want to check out The Freedom Programme.

This is all very well and good but what's to stop him from asking to take the kids to his family for the whole Christmas period instead? Presumably OP had them in previous years.

Have to agree with others - Don't let him in, he sounds the type to try a guilt trip of "Mummy says I have to go now ☹️", my ex did this and I absolutely tortured myself for months afterwards for letting it happen (he wasn't abusive, just lazy, only did anything with DD when someone else was there to see it - got out the taxi when we were on the way home from hospital and left me to carry baby in car seat and the bags 3 days after an emergency c section, tells you everything).

You've been MORE than fair, you've offered multiple solutions that you didn't have to, he's taking the piss and trying to play the victim. Please be stronger than I was when I was in that situation, 18 years later my heads still minced by it. Don't let him manipulate you anymore, your life, your rules.

Take back the offer of letting him come over. It's your home. You do not have to and should not invite him over at all.

Yep. Your work is done. Now drop the rope.

Your kids will eventually realise that they are being lied to and manipulated. A cheerful, clear, 'these things are for mummy and daddy to sort out and it would be unkind of us to make you sad and worried by talking to you about them' with a look at the 'big bag of worries' book and the picture of sending worries back to the people who own them have helped me. They can parrot back to daddy that mummy says it's unkind to make them sad and worried about grown up things all they like, hopefully it might stick somewhere.

@GrumpyPanda there is nothing to stop him, but he doesn't, he goes to his family on his own even in school holidays, and the only time he has taken the DC to see them is when I made it happen...but I'm not doing that any more. Much as I would miss them I have always been prepared for an alternate Christmas arrangement, but he's not interested. I suspect he prefers telling people that he's not allowed to have them. And this wasnt "just" a divorce, it was about getting the kids away from him to protect them...so I'm not about to insist he has them more when he just can't be bothered. Like @TinyTyrantsSnackb1tch XH, he's perfect dad when there's an audience, and last time he had them at his parents he left them with his mum for two days out of four whilst he spent time with his friends. Thank you @Froodwithatowel I will look for that book.

Gah more pitiful texts from him, saying how he spent last Christmas crying on his own...I am soft-hearted and really struggling not to get in touch with him, to try and explain why I ended the marriage...and worrying that he didn't realise his behaviour was so awful, but surely he must have? I really, really don't want to get sucked back in, but here I am feeling sorry for him. FFS.

You feel sorry for him because you are a decent person.
He's trying the self pity route because he's not a decent person.
Ignore him totally.
If the DC start up with "poor dad" you need to tell them "mum and dad don't live together anymore, it's grown up stuff that I don't want you to worry about, dad can go to his family at Christmas and you can spend some time with him at his house"
Rinse and repeat.
Don't give in or you'll never get rid of him

Aaah, this is pretty classic actually.

has he said what HE wants to do? Because in my experience, there are two versions of this type of victim dance.

Version 1 is that he wants to just tag along for your entire Christmas, stay over Christmas even possibly, presents, off to your family for Christmas dinner etc. Importantly, note he does not want to contribute to any of these activities or events.

Version 2 is that he does not have a preferred option. But by batting back all your suggestions, he gets to continue to play the victim.

I would go back with "I've offered you multiple options. If you have an option that might be doable, let me know. Otherwise, let me know when you'd like to see the kids over the Christmas period for an alternative Christmas with your family."

As for him telling the kids it "wasn't that bad". This is unfortunately also pretty classic. This one is hard to manage. But I think my top tip is do not lie to them or attempt to cover up his shitty behaviour. That doesn't mean slagging him off and swearing about him every 10 minutes, but it could be, for example, "well, Daddy didn't think it was such a big deal that he was never part of our lives, or did anything around the house [insert as appropriate] but it really was and I couldn't live like that." then, as appropriate, highlight what they should expect from a partner down the line. "I hope one day that you'll meet a man/woman who will treat you like a partner and be always available to you and your children."

You offered options, he doesn't want them so that's a shame for him.. never mind, get on with your day. You don't owe him anything. You had a relationship and now you don't, it's done, he looks after himself and you look after yourself - job done!
STOP FEELING GUILTY. He is an adult and can look after himself and you aren't responsible for him!

he is SO good at manipulating people, me and the DC included

If they could apply these skills to other aspects of their lives, they'd probably rule the world.

I blocked exBIL recently after he sent me a message that was so cleverly manipulative that I knew that if I wasn't so alert to his shit, I might actually have fallen for it and a) felt sorry for him and b) thought SIL was being a bitch. It's better to just not have anything to do with him.

easier for me than for her (or you) though.