Narcissist.

[Fingeronthebutton]

I have every reason to believe that my adult child is a narcissist. It’s been a rocky relationship over the years. After the last blow up, I don’t know why, the word narcissist dropped into my head.
So of course I started to read up on the condition/trait? It was staring me in the face.
My question to members ( obviously the older ones) is, have you ever confronted a narcissist.

Actually it might be helpful to know Narcissism is caused by severe neglect or total over indulgence during childhood - early years (not in a good way) It is untreatable, and the person afflicted usually spends a life time searching for real connection.

I believe my younger brother to be one. Our father died (suicide) when I was 4 and he six months. I was sent away to other family and he stayed with my mother. I developed independence while he did not as viewed as ‘fragile’ by my mother and (later) stepfather. Unlike me, his behaviour was never challenged lest he do what my father did. He is now a monster - huge ego, nasty, few friends, wife recently left him etc etc. He didn’t speak to me for 15 years, gave me the big sob story when wife left, which I went with for my parents’ sake. Stopped speaking to me after 6 months. Again, no explanation. My parents will continue to let him do as he pleases as the are scared of and for him. Good luck to them all. I am the one with the happy and normal family.

Or trauma. As with most PDs, it's often trauma - which may not even seem majorly traumatic from an adult point of view, but affected the child deeply. Emotional development gets 'stuck' at the age when it happened.

NOBODY actually really knows what causes narcissism.

The “arrested” or child development theory is not proven - lots of young children are naturally empathetic! So being “stuck” at a certain age is an unproven and questionable theory.

OP, all you can do is protect yourself 💐.

I mean actual NPD is apparently rare but from my experience at least it aligns perfectly to NPD to the point professional third parties are seeing it too. Difference between narcissistic tendencies than NPD.

Again in my experience, may not be all but by no means someone to feel sorry for. Highly manipulative, abusive and cruel, verging on insane, hurting everyone around them even their own children. While simultaneously portraying themselves as saints and a victim.

OP - thank you for posting . I am reading your story and feeling like it's my own.
My son has definite narcissistic tendencies. It's so hard to manage as I feel like I'm constantly walking on eggshells around him. It was a close friend who suggested he might be narcissistic and as soon as I started reading about it lots of things became much clearer.

Thank you for making me feel like I'm not the only parent going through this

I have only met four narcissists in my whole life. Two from neglect in childhood, two from over indulgence. None from trauma. One was a covert narcissist.

I wish I could tell you any would care about our empathy or trying to understand their plight. It would only be helpful if it can be weaponised or used as currency in some way.

As a parent there is little you can do. Strong boundaries. Zero expectations of their interest in your feelings or life.
Recognise manipulation and game playing and don’t respond to either.

Childhood neglect is typically included in a range of childhood experiences which cause trauma. “Over indulgence” or self-medicating behaviour is often a symptom of NPD, so not sure how this could be causal- could you elaborate?
Arguably, parents may be best placed to help someone to address a wound from childhood, if only by acknowledging it. I think there is a tendency for people to attribute people’s poor behaviour to a flaw in their character, while attributing our own shortcomings to a bad situation or negative external stimuli. In social psychology this is known as the “fundamental attribution error”. It’s probably why a few of the comments here are cautioning against diagnosing someone else if unqualified.

I think the PP meant overly indulgent parenting, @Openocean. I've certainly read case studies of NPD subjects who were treated like little gods as children. That is also, arguably, traumatic for a child who may be in need of boundaries & guidance.

"Narcissist" gets bandied around a lot, and ime it is helpful to have labels for extreme personality traits. Indeed, people have always used them: when I was younger, phrases like "really into herself", "power complex" or "god complex" and so forth were common parlance.

People with actual personality disorders are what we used to call "mad" (still a useful term in my view!) The label gives a clue as the ways in which that person is "mad". It's really not that uncommon.

The “arrested” or child development theory is not proven - lots of young children are naturally empathetic! So being “stuck” at a certain age is an unproven and questionable theory.

You might be mistaking popular shorthand for a clinical evaluation.

Perhaps you'd more easily understand it if we use current clinical parlance: "emotionally dysregulated" is favoured over "disordered". You'd presumably agree that emotional dysregulation is developmentally normal in children.

I also think my adult child living at home may be a narcissist. They have no empathy and only think about themselves are rude and there's no point saying anything as they turn it back on you. I don't bother talking to them anymore as they are so rude and hurtful.
They are waiting assessment for autism and ADHD but surely this is not the reason? I have other children who are totally different.

Yes sorry! I am travelling and rushed my last post.

I have read many case studies that suggest parents that over indulge their children continually ( I imagine in a misguided attempt to build self esteem and confidence) have found narcissistic traits in this group. There are significant studies that suggest this is common.

It is also prevalent amongst children that were severely emotionally neglected in the very early years.

I am not suggesting op is at fault, merely highlighting the studies available.

I can’t imagine how difficult it can be, I think as parents we should accept our children as they are - even the most challenging aspects and by doing so we remain unconditionally by their side. Recognising they are not choosing to be this way.

Sorry yes I see what you mean, I misinterpreted it. I’d be interested to see some of those studies if you have them.
It’s been a while since I’ve looked at any of this literature but I thought there had been a lot of skepticism about the direct causal link with “being spoilt” as we used to call it. As in it definitely correlates with narcissism personality disorder but often when you dig down, over indulgent parents may have other deeper parenting flaws. I.E. they may be trying to compensate for an emotionally negligent or abusive coparent, they may be trying to compensate for an abusive dynamic in the home where for example the child and one of the parents are expected to be treated as superior to the coparent and/or other family members; or they may be overindulged in part because they have a narcissistic parent who sees them as an extension of themselves and treats them accordingly.
In short, I think it’s quite difficult to over indulge a child with love, unconditional support, affection and even praise; but overindulgence especially of a shallow kind probably often masks more serious issues. I could be wrong though obviously or opinion may have shifted in the meantime so would love to read a bit more about it.