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Original poster

What are the risks of having children without getting married?

115 replies

Meadow48 · 15/10/2023 10:59

My fiancé and I have lived together for 3 years, we have been engaged for 2. He has recently informed me that he would want a religious marriage but no legal ceremony. So we will be married in the eyes of god however not the law.
I believe this comes following his uncles divorce, who sadly ended his own life 5 years ago following a messy divorce that left him broke and unable to see his children.
I would not mind this, however I am unaware of the risks in this. We plan on having children soon, and I plan to always work (I am a teacher).
What are the risks of essentially cohabiting with children?

OP posts:
Karma2023 · 15/10/2023 12:09

Are you prepared to raise a child(ren), for 18 years on your single income plus less than 10% of his monthly salary? Could you house them adequately on your salary?

That's what your financial future would be should he decide to ask you and any children you have to leave his property.

Look up childcare costs...a man's contribution doesn't come close to covering the costs. Look hard at the finances, get on the calculator for child maintenance and see what you would get. Then check your entitlement to additional benefits, such as childcare.

Interesting he wants a religious marriage so I assume you and any children would have his name. Without a legal marriage you would be mad to take his name and give children his name. Do you realise he could stop you travelling with your children?

Btw, his uncle didn't see his children because he was married...he would have had parental rights.

AnSolas · 15/10/2023 12:12

drspouse · 15/10/2023 11:51

Followup question: I assume he's Muslim, because AIUI all religious Jewish and Christian marriages in the UK are also legal marriages?
If so, it is highly likely that many overseas countries would see you as married and some would see your children as his property.

In theory any UK wedding with a religious celebrant could be a problem eg failing to register intent or failure to have the wedding take place in a recognised venu or not recording in the register with witnesses etc could lead to an invalid "legal marrige". But if the OP was to get "remarried" to a different person she would have to ensure that the first service did not put her into a legal limbo.

But as you point out having a service could result in that being legaly recognised in other countries and if the OP's partner is a citizen of the other country costody issues could become complex if their children were removed from the UK.

SaracensMavericks · 15/10/2023 12:18

If you're not married then everything relating to the kids needs to be completely evenly split. The reason why women can suffer in this situation is because they've typically spent more time doing unpaid housework and childcare while the man has put that additional time and effort into his career with the corresponding financial benefits.

So - shared parental care - he takes off the same amount of time that you take. Completely shared drop offs and pick ups once you're back at work. Shared household chores. If you do split up, then a 50/50 contact.

If anything in this is inconvenient to him or not what he had envisaged, then explain to him that marriage is the other option.

jsku · 15/10/2023 12:23

OP - the risks of proceeding without marriage is that your plans may not work out the way you plan them.
I also had the same plans as you - continue working, maintaining earnings, etc.
And of course - did not plan to divorce.

Life turned out differently. And had I not been married - i’d have been totally screwed. Choices made together as a family - in the course of the marriage - would have severely damaged me.

So - DO NOT enter into long term anything with a person who is not all in from the start.
If its a matter if protecting pre-marital assets - sign a pre-nap. Fair enough.

Also - call his bluff. His story makes no sense. If you aren’t married - and separate - there is no greater chance of having access to his kids.

Dizzybelle · 15/10/2023 12:49

Please DO NOT have children with this man. Any kind of religious wedding - without a legally binding, registrar office wedding, will offer you zero rights and zero protection in the future, if anything does goes wrong. And by cohabiting in this way, with children, you essentially risk the possibility of him sponging off of you in a million and one ways, with all the benefits but with out any of the responsibilities. And there are so many other dodgy scenarios in this set up, but to your potential detriment.

Being only “married in the eyes of god” is not a legally binding contract. Don’t do it.

CatamaranViper · 15/10/2023 12:55

Everything else aside, why would you want to be with someone who doesn't want to commit to you properly?
You're engaged so presumably one of you (him?) asked the other to marry them. Why agree if you have no intention of actually marrying them?

Spacecowboys · 15/10/2023 12:57

Potentially none. As long as you both own the home on a 50/50 basis and continue to have your own career. If you have the much better private pension / more assets/ savings etc it actually benefits you not to be married.

Parker231 · 15/10/2023 13:00

Make sure you jointly own your home, on the deeds. Have a will in place and that you are the sole beneficiary of his life assurance and pension. Stay working full time including after any children.

JIMMI85 · 15/10/2023 13:05

Strange that most are saying not to get married if she is the higher earner/has more equity and to marry if it’s the other way around…🤔

Noicant · 15/10/2023 13:22

When he proposed is this what he said? I’ll only half ass marry you? Honestly just don’t have kids, if you want them I would strongly recommend not having them with someone who doesn’t want to get married. It’s probably old fashioned of me but I would never have had kids with DH if I thought he wasn’t actually all in (thats regardless of who had more money).

Mumsnet is full of women who thought marriage was only a piece of paper and only realise when it’s too late that it’s a legal contract.

Unithorn · 15/10/2023 13:24

JIMMI85 · 15/10/2023 13:05

Strange that most are saying not to get married if she is the higher earner/has more equity and to marry if it’s the other way around…🤔

Well yes of course! I'd say to anyone male or female though that marriage is risky if you have more assets and to consider it fully and the implications of. OP asked the benefits of marriage and its true that if you have less and earn less its a huge benefit to marry.

pikkumyy77 · 15/10/2023 13:33

The uncle story is so absurd I think you have to leave this guy—was he dropped on his head recently or does he think you were? His uncle “lost assets “ in other words divided shared assets with former partner and had to support his children. As for the suicide—perhaps it was this instability that led to his losing contact with the children rather than the other way around?

At any rate why should you pay the price for some other person’s experience. I would never have children with someone who would not legally marry me anymore than I would share assets with a stranger. If he can’t make s commitment to the relationship then there is no relationship.

As for religiously but not civilly: he is straight up telling you he wants the sexual availability and the social status of marriage with no rights or protections for you at all.

Spacecowboys · 15/10/2023 13:34

JIMMI85 · 15/10/2023 13:05

Strange that most are saying not to get married if she is the higher earner/has more equity and to marry if it’s the other way around…🤔

Id never say to anyone to get married tbh 🤣but even more so when you’re the higher earner. Male or female.

ZoeCM · 15/10/2023 13:42

I wouldn't feel very flattered by a man saying he'd only be happy to "marry" me if it didn't involve any legal commitment, frankly!

CatusFlatus · 15/10/2023 14:02

JIMMI85 · 15/10/2023 13:05

Strange that most are saying not to get married if she is the higher earner/has more equity and to marry if it’s the other way around…🤔

This is because of the much, much higher burden women carry when they become mothers than men do if they become fathers. The fact that many men don't even appreciate and/or acknowledge this illustrates the problem perfectly.

(In this case the couple plan to have children.)

CurlewKate · 15/10/2023 14:03

Talk to a solicitor before you do anything else. It is possible to protect yourself and your children if you're unmarried but it's not automatic, the way it is if you're married. It's not difficult, but you have to do it.

TarantinoIsAMisogynist · 15/10/2023 14:06

He has literally told you that he doesn't see himself being part of the same financial team as you. He may as well be waving a placard saying "I'm likely to be financially abusive!"

If you have children - who will fund your maternity leave? Who will pay for childcare? Who will give up their job or go part-time, if needed (e.g. if you have a child with additional needs)? Who will take the impact of the above on their pension?

He doesn't see the two of you as a financial team, so you can bet it won't be him taking the hit for any of these things.

TarantinoIsAMisogynist · 15/10/2023 14:08

Noicant · 15/10/2023 13:22

When he proposed is this what he said? I’ll only half ass marry you? Honestly just don’t have kids, if you want them I would strongly recommend not having them with someone who doesn’t want to get married. It’s probably old fashioned of me but I would never have had kids with DH if I thought he wasn’t actually all in (thats regardless of who had more money).

Mumsnet is full of women who thought marriage was only a piece of paper and only realise when it’s too late that it’s a legal contract.

Mumsnet is full of women who thought marriage was only a piece of paper and only realise when it’s too late that it’s a legal contract.

Ain't that the truth

Mari9999 · 15/10/2023 14:20

@Meadow48
You may be married "in God's eyes", but God's eyes won't provide any legal protections in case of separation or end of the relationship.

Given that the suicide was 5 years ago and you have only been engaged for 2 years, it doesn't seem likely that the suicide was the cause of his change of mind about marriage. Is he a particularly religious man? Is he given to living his life consistent with what matters in" God's eyes?"

Only you can decide what is best for you, but I would probably leave him and let him find another woman to live with him "in God's eyes.

wildwestpioneer · 15/10/2023 14:54

I wouldn't have an issue having dc with a partner and not being married, but there's no way I'd be a sahp and give up my career to become a stay at home parent. You will need to protect your own financial independence, and your dp will have to fully understand that when it comes to taking time off for sickness, collection and drop off at school, parents evenings, sports day, clubs etc he's as much responsible as your, so he'll need to have a job that's flexible. Regardless of who earns what.

pikkumyy77 · 15/10/2023 15:02

This is in response to wildwest upthread. Yeah: good luck enforcing that through maternity leave and everything else. Life is what happens while you are making other plans.

muddyford · 15/10/2023 15:12

AnSolas · 15/10/2023 12:12

In theory any UK wedding with a religious celebrant could be a problem eg failing to register intent or failure to have the wedding take place in a recognised venu or not recording in the register with witnesses etc could lead to an invalid "legal marrige". But if the OP was to get "remarried" to a different person she would have to ensure that the first service did not put her into a legal limbo.

But as you point out having a service could result in that being legaly recognised in other countries and if the OP's partner is a citizen of the other country costody issues could become complex if their children were removed from the UK.

Show quote history

Not all Christian marriages are legal. Ones celebrated by a Church of England minister in a C of E church usually are, though some chapels of ease require a special licence from the Archbishop of Canterbury . Most other denominations require the presence of a registrar in the church or you have the civil process at the registry office followed by the religious bit (like most of Europe).

But I wouldn't marry someone that didn't want his 'marriage ' to commit him to anything in the future.

Horticulturehere · 15/10/2023 15:22

@Meadow48 any thoughts about the comments and advice given?

Maxiedog123 · 15/10/2023 15:28

It's all very well to plan to work full-time after children, so did I, but then my second child was born severely disabled.....

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