How to cope with hating yourself?

[hatemyself1234]

I want to preface this by saying I understand that I have deep issues and I need professional help to overcome this, so I don't really want comments on that. I just want to understand if other people feel a similar way to me and how they manage to cope.

I am relatively young, well educated, had a professional career before kids, generally am well liked, have friends, I'm in good shape and I believe I'm attractive. Nobody in my life has ever told me otherwise on these things and everybody I've met/been in relationships with have treated me/made me feel as though I was a 'good'/attractive/smart member of society.

But when I was a child my father would compare me to my friends/neighbours kids etc, belittle me for getting upset about anything, always tell me he was ashamed/embarrassed of me etc and I have lived with this feeling for all my life.

I've now been with my DP for around 5 years and have 2 kids together. Since my daughter was born 2 years ago I have had what I can only really describe as a kind of breakdown in terms of my self esteem. I am convinced that my DP is looking at every other woman around us and thinking to himself they are better than me, he wishes he was with them etc and looking at me in comparison thinking how ugly I am. It has got to the point where I am not leaving my home, not going to my daughter's toddler classes anymore and cutting off my friends. I cannot watch anything on tv with him as in the past he has made comments about women being beautiful and I feel he is looking at every woman on tv and comparing me unfavourably. I cannot go out in public at all with him as he genuinely does look at other women and, as I mentioned above, it makes me feel like he's comparing me. We have not had sex properly in maybe 1 year now because I resent him for thinking badly of me.

This issue was triggered by an infidelity on his part around the time my daughter was born and the genuine fact (not my imagination) that he does look at other women in the street/restaurants etc and not glances but really ogling them. Other than this, he is very nice to me and I know he cares for me.

I believe that my feelings are somewhat reasonable given what he did but I know that the way I have reacted and internalised it is not normal. I am trying to get help for my own deep rooted issues.

But do other women feel this way? That their DP/DH is looking at other women and comparing them unfavourably? Not to the extreme that I do but is this in any way normal? How do women deal with the fact we're told that men will look at and lust after others and we should accept this? How do you keep your self esteem intact if your partner thinks other women are attractive?

These questions are truly not to validate my extreme reaction to myself but to understand how other women feel and how I can begin to see it from a more 'normal' perspective. I also don't really care about fixing the relationship with him, I just want to learn to deal with my feelings about myself.

I think lots and lots and lots of people are beautiful. So what? I'm not going to fuck any of them, even in the unlikely event that I have the opportunity to, because I choose not to. I've made commitments and I choose to keep them.

I would ask you if you genuinely don't find a single man other than your DP in the world attractive, which I strongly doubt, but I don't think you can logic your way out of this. This is trauma-related and you will need to unpick it slowly and with support. But in short, no, most people of both sexes don't think like this. There's more to human relationships and human attraction than looks, and everyone finds people other than their partner visually attractive. Your thoughts are your own business - what matters is whether you act on them. Which your partner has, which is clearly part of the problem.

This sounds very difficult. It seems as if your husband’s infidelity hasn’t been properly addressed? No wonder you feel insecure and distressed.

I do hope you will unpick this with a professional.

And no, my DH doesn’t do any of this.

Thank you for replying! Yes, I do think other men are attractive but for me it's kind of like noticing something smells nice or is a nice colour if that makes sense? I can see an 'attractive' man and know that he is attractive but I never feel any lust or excitement or feel the need any need to keep looking at him. And I never found any man more attractive than my DP, even when they are objectively more attractive, because I loved him and he was who my interests were with.

Can I ask (I'm assuming you're a man?), when you find a woman attractive or when you see an attractive woman in the street when you're with your DP/DW, do you then look at your wife in comparison and notice she is less attractive? This is what I can't get past. That he is looking at women and then at me and having horrible thoughts about me. Or the fact that if he found me to be beautiful, why is he looking at other women so much?

As they are not simple glances. For 2 examples, once we went for dinner in a restaurant and there was a woman sat on the table behind us. He spent most of the dinner glancing at her and only looking back at me when I spoke to him. Second example, we were in a pharmacy waiting for medication for our baby when he was a few weeks old and there was a woman looking at something in the aisle behind us. He was leaning around the aisle to stare at her. I am confident that it's not my paranoia and he is genuinely looking at other women a lot. I haven't seen this behaviour with other men I've dated or men I've been friends with/dated my friends, so surely it is because he isn't satisfied with the way I look?

This isn't about how you look OP, this is about your DH having a wandering eye. The most beautiful women in the world get cheated on (Beyonce for example), it doesn't mean their husbands don't consider them to be beautiful. Many (most heterosexual) men notice attractive women, that doesn't devalue the woman they're in a relationship with but it can show disrespect, particularly if the man is openly oogling other women. I'm so sorry OP but this relationship is really not healthy for you.

Can I ask (I'm assuming you're a man?), when you find a woman attractive or when you see an attractive woman in the street when you're with your DP/DW, do you then look at your wife in comparison and notice she is less attractive?

I'm a woman, bisexual.

When I see an attractive man, or indeed woman, on the street, it's a separate thing to my thoughts about DH. It's just... an attractive person, at which I might enjoy looking. There's no comparison to DH, in any sense. He might be objectively less attractive than a man I see, just as I'm objectively less attractive than many, many women he might be looking at in the course of his life, but the other person doesn't have his loyalty or his heart or his smarts or his nerdiness or his excellence in bed or any of the years of our shared history and DC. I never do a comparison. There's no need. It's just... an attractive person, a very brief visual enjoyment, no more no less.

I think the main issue here is your unreliable husband and not your self esteem.
My self esteem has gone through the roof since being single. I validate myself, no need for outside approval and it's so liberating. Who wants to be with a man who leers.at other women, it's really off putting as well as embarrassing, and disrespectful towards you.
If you found a man who didn't eye up women all the time you would feel totally different. His behaviour is making you feel insecure.

Thank you for your reply. Deep down I know this to be true but somehow my rationality can't get through to my emotions! Strangely, I find infidelity more understandable and easier to rationalise than him simply looking at women when we're together. It's almost as if being with another woman has a purpose (sex, companionship, ego boost etc) whereas looking at women so much whilst I'm next to him feels just like a personal insult. And also humiliating as the women can see him staring at must pity me. I suppose this is what I'm questioning, is it normal to be upset that he stares at women or I am supposed to just accept this because he's a man?

Obviously and appreciatively staring at someone else is not tolerable behaviour. It's disrespectful to you, if you're there, and just as importantly, it's aggressive and unpleasant to the person/woman looked at. I hate being obviously looked up and down by dickwad men. It makes me feel violated and unsafe.

Noticing someone else is attractive and giving them a low-key appreciative glance is OK IMO. It just shows you have a pulse. There is definitely a line though. I guess the question is which camp he falls into.

Your husband has cheated on you and he openly gawps at other women while with you - any self respecting woman would struggle to accept such behaviour. You took him back after he cheated - he should count his lucky stars and be doing all he can to make you feel loved and secure, instead he's openly leering at other women, and I would say he's highly likely to cheat again at some point. You deserve better OP.

"And also humiliating as the women can see him staring at must pity me. I suppose this is what I'm questioning, is it normal to be upset that he stares at women or I am supposed to just accept this because he's a man?"

If they do pity you, it's because they see you are with a guy who's disrespecting you. They are probably wondering why you are accepting that.

It's normal to be upset if your DH is staring at other women.

Your boundaries for what's acceptable from a man were laid down by your relationship with your Dad and what you saw your mother accepting from him.

Your Dad emotionally abused you with insults and comments, therefore your bar for yourself was set very low.

Your mother did nothing to help nor did she challenge him, so by her silence she 'accepted' your Dad's view of you.

But this is a 'learned' viewpoint and you can unlearn it.

A part of you is furious I'd imagine. But it's safer to turn the anger against ourselves. That's why you keep trying to make it your fault so that you won't need to 'upset' DH.

You did nothing wrong. You did not invite this behaviour by DH. You didn't ask for it or choose it.

Your issue is that you are alone in this, and the only place you are bouncing it off is your own thoughts.

If you can afford therapy it might be a great help.

It's not your fault he cheated. It's not your fault he has a wandering eye. Those are choices he has made and him alone, and I don't think there is anything you could have done to change it. Like a PP said, some of the most beautiful women in the world have still been cheated on.

Try and focus on yourself, get some therapy, put yourself first.

Yes it's normal to be upset, and no, you're not supposed to just accept behaviour you're not comfortable with or which crosses your boundaries. That said you can't control someone else's behaviour, you can only choose not to have that person in your life, which incidentally is exactly what I would do in your shoes.

It's not the noticing of attractive women that's the problem, it's the disrespectful ogling/leering that pushes this beyond what you (and indeed any self respecting woman) are willing to accept. And that's before we even get to his cheating, that's an absolute dealbreaker for me and is probably what's at the root of the way you're feeling.

I suspect your self esteem would improve massively if you left him, and also that maybe you do value yourself more than you realise already, otherwise his behaviour wouldn't cause you as much anguish as it does. I think it's time you really looked into what leaving would look like for you, before he does so much damage to your confidence that you end up feeling trapped

i'm saying this (half) in jest...but you should have an affair to raise your self-confidence

I don’t think this is so much about your unaddressed past as your unaddressed present.

You’re married to a cheat and an ogler to boot. (Rubber necking blokes are grim and I always feel pity for the women they’re with).

The reality is you cannot now trust your partner and you do not feel happy with him so the marriage is effectively over.

Once you’ve ended your rotten marriage then you will have the headspace to deep dive into your childhood and address the effect it has had on you.

I think you will be surprised how much better you feel once you’re out of this relationship, rather than trying to cling on squashing all self confidence and self worth in the process.

And also humiliating as the women can see him staring at must pity me. I suppose this is what I'm questioning, is it normal to be upset that he stares at women or I am supposed to just accept this because he's a man?"

They do. But that’s not because you are not amazing, but because most women dislike oglers and they feel sorry for you having to put up with it.

It’s normal to be upset that you’re with an cheating ogler. Most women would be, indeed a significant number would have left already on those grounds.

My deep seeded self loathing is something I have struggled with my entire life (and I am old). Mine does not manifest in my relationships as far as feeling my partner fancied others, but it is very apparent in other ways. I have had professional help regularly throughout the years. What I want to say to you is that you need to try so very hard to get over this. Not only will it ruin your relationship (although he doesn't sound like much a of a catch) but it will ruin your life. Please seek help. I don't want you to end up my age and having lived with that burden your whole life.

Get rid of the fucker

I also had someone in my childhood who would belittle me.

I didn’t feel my self esteem/confidence was too bad in my twenties but after a very long marriage my self esteem is zero.

I now realise this is due to a life time of slights and digs about my character and body, disguised as banter, sarcasm and ‘he only wants what’s best for me’. Because of my childhood I didn’t recognise this and didn’t have healthy boundaries.

There was infidelity early in the relationship too, and a few other lesser incidents I ignored. I’m not sure about the letching at women as, as standards have changed so much, but he would make comments while watching TV. ‘She’s mutton dressed as lamb/I bets she’s dirty”

I think if your DP is outright ogling and leering at other women then he is showing neither respect for you or these other women. This is behaviour that used to be accepted, but thankfully no longer is by more and more people.

A decent partner who knows about your childhood and who is guilty of infidelity should be doing everything in his power to make you feel better about yourself not worse.

Most men these days who see an attractive women don’t make a performance of it. He’s either being very dense or it is actually deliberate behaviour to make himself feel good by making you feel bad.

Luckily society is going forward in such a way that women are calling out this behaviour when it happens to them.

I think you should just tell him to stop it and that he’s a sexist arse.

Whilst you make plans to leave this cheating a-hole, please take every opportunity going to tell your husband how gorgeous you find various men and ogling intensely at them while you are out and about, especially if he is trying to talk to you. Put up some calendars of hot men on the fridge for good measure.

Thank you so much to everybody that's replied! You're all so kind and have made me feel quite emotional. I've been feeling very alone recently as nobody in my life knows of any issues as I've been too ashamed to tell anybody and have been avoiding most friends/family.

I wanted to add that I have made it very clear to him how I feel about him looking at women. His responses have been variations of 'all men do it', 'my ex's didn't mind', 'I don't look at women you're paranoid', 'your issues are because of your father and nothing to do with me looking at women'. So I did begin to wonder if it was my childhood issues causing me to overreact but your replies have brought me back to my senses.

My rational mind understands that he probably does it as an ego boost for himself. He's actually 23 years older than me and, without sounding conceited, there is quite an obvious difference between our levels of objective attractiveness/age. I believe he had a fair amount of rejection from women when he was younger until he became quite successful with his business and he now has almost a compulsion to look at/be with women? I do understand that it isn't because of anything wrong with me, deep down, but I think the amount of gaslighting and sheer disrespect he's put me through have warped my reality and made me believe I must be truly ugly? He has also made many small, seemingly innocuous comments about his ex's, other women and about me that I've felt must be on purpose to make me feel bad (although he's often actually told me he never said those things despite saying the exact comment word for word minutes earlier...)

I think my childhood issues are almost a red herring in these surface issues as he is truly being disrespectful to me. But I think I need therapy to look at the reason why I ended up with such an older man who behaves this way. Why don't I value myself as the beautiful, smart, young woman others have told me I am? Why have I let his actions define the way I think of myself? Why have I let a man like him take my self esteem and years of my life? Why did I have 2 children with him? Much to think about!

This.

It may be because of your Dad's treatment that you don't feel you deserve any better than a man who disrespects you like this. But you do.

I was going to write that his behaviour is disrespectful and you’ve identified this in your recent post. That’s no reflection on you but tells us loads about him.

You sound absolutely lovely OP

Glad you are going to get help with this OP and I look forward to the moment you tell him you are leaving him. Ha! He deserves every moment of misery when he realises what he has lost by being such a monumental c*nt. You deserve a partner your age who is your match in looks and attractiveness who is respectful and loving towards you (if you want one) not this sorry tragic excuse of a human being. I would also reach out to friends and family to tell them about his infidelity so you are not so isolated. The shame is all his not yours.

Wow, the sheer unbridled shittiness of men never ceases to amaze me!

and he now has almost a compulsion to look at/be with women?

Look, he doesn’t have a compulsion. Because if he did he would regularly be coming home with black eyes from furious husbands. The women he letches at are mostly alone. And even if they’re not you are there as a barrier to any confrontation. He is doing this on purpose to upset you.

This nasty old bloke has done a real number on you getting you to believe he’s some sort of prize. And he’s done that because the minute you see your value you’ll get rid of this dirty old letch.

Yep exactly what above poster (Frogger 8395) said. Probably couldn't believe he'd snagged a catch like you so thought he'd better go about undermining you as much as possible so you wouldn't leave him. Also classic insecurity, having an affair because probably your attention was on the baby (exactly where it should be) and not 100% on him and his fragile little ego couldn't handle it. Tragic individual. On the plus side he sounds like he has some money and will hopefully support his children, and of course you have two lovely children from this relationship, and he has shown you his true colours fairly early on so you can get rid asap before he does any more damage.