Domestic abuse/ autistic meltdown

[Mumtoboys1]

I don't even know if this is the correct topic/thread or whatever and im super nervous about posting this but I really need some answers/advice because seeing a counsellor just takes too long.

So, my partner is diagnosed ASD. Relationship has never been good, there's not been one stable week in probably the whole time. There's been instances throughout where he has gotten physically aggressive.. throwing stuff ect. Doors have been punched through. Family who I've spoken to about this and other professionals a long time ago labelled this as domestic abuse. I have to admit that if it was anyone else I would agree but because my partner is ASD I have a split brain which tells me this is the reason it happens and it is meltdowns. I will admit I do have PTSD symptoms because of this but I mainly blame myself for not being more helpful to him in order to help him be more stable. We have 2 kids and I just find it all so hard. I feel awful on the kids and a terrible mum but at the same time I feel or would feel massively disrespectful on their dad if I were to tell him to leave due to disability.
I have no one to talk to about any of this except family and they're obviously one sided.
Most of the worse stuff has not happened around the kids thankfully. I just can't wrap my head around wether this is abuse and what do I even do. Especially the PTSD symptoms and walking on eggshells because things can be so unstable I feel I have to be on top form to try and manage his moods. But people with ASD struggle with stuff like emotional regulation and outbursts so I'm confused., And that's where I get the idea I'm just not good enough and a crap partner because I can't help.

It sounds awful for you and the kIds, OP. Well done for describing this on this forum. People will have practical suggestions that will help. And I am sure lots of people will also want to offer you moral support.

You deserve a life where you are not walking on egg shells or dealing with trauma symptoms.

He may be autistic, but he is an autistic adult. It is clear he has emotional regulation issues. It is his responsibility to get help with these, to prevent himself causing harm to others. For whatever reason, he has not managed to do this.

Therefore you need to act to safeguard your health and the health of your children. Perhaps take legal advice or talk to your GP or phone the Refuge helpline?

Good luck [flower]

OP, Just a thought, but you might get more replies and support if you ask MN to move this to the relationships board?

Yes, this is domestic abuse and you and your children deserve a lot better.

I'm also autistic and have had some terrible meltdowns in the past but I a 100% responsible for my behaviour and the consequences. Yes, poor emotional regulation can be part of autism but it is not your job to placate your partner, it is your job to give your kids a safe and calm home.

It is possible to be both autistic and an abuser, his autism is not an excuse.

Please speak to womans aid or another support organisation that can work to help you and your children.

This.

Autistic people can still be abusive arses and that's not the autism. That's being abusive. His autism is no excuse.

This post is on the correct board here I think. If you want to stay with your husband and he isn't hurting you or your children....I would suggest you talking calmly with him when he's not overwhelmed or in the middle of a meltdown.
He needs to understand the start of his triggers and what they are so that he can try to de-escalate them by saying to you what's bothering him and removing himself from the trigger or you could maybe help remove the triggers (if practical and possible at all).
I understand this is very difficult and absolutely you must NOT have to walk on eggshells but if you could be aware of his triggers then some things might be avoided.
This is not the same as a NT man being calculated/manipulative/controlling/violent. Having said that, you absolutely do NOT need to witness behaviour that makes you feel scared and or concerned for your safety and I would leave him if he can't/won't discuss triggers and take steps as a minimum with you. then you must leave him OP.

I am so angry with your post. The OP states quite clearly that he has thrown things and she is living with PTSD symptoms.

Stop making excuses for an abuser, autism isn't an excuse for abuse, the priority is keeping the OP and her children physically and emotionally safe. The husband is responsibility for his own mental wellbeing.

Loads of NT men have problems with emotional regulation too, for a variety of reasons. Adult men need to take responsibility for their own behaviour and seek help if they need it.

@Gingerkittykat I'm sorry ny post made you angry, that wasn't my intention at all. Yes she should leave if she wants to. I'm not making excuses for anyone or anything. I've been a victim of domestic violence with a NT man. I know this is upsetting. I just didn't want autistic people to be put in the same category as NT abusers. Just tried to make a distinction between abusive behaviour and meltdowns.

Someone having a meltdown in front of another person could be distressing to the viewer but is not the autsitic person's intention.
I've said what I meant and I hope you now understand that I'm not making excuses for anything.

and yes I was trying to make it clear that he should take steps to take responsibility for his behaviour.

Unfortunately meltdowns can involve throwing things amongst other behaviours that are distressing ....but if you want to extrapolate and say that every autistic person having a meltdown who chucks something is abusive then that is completely wrong. This just perpetuates decades of misunderstandings about what it means to be autistic.

Most autistic people seek to avoid meltdowns and unwanted behaviours that upset other people.

Please stop perpetuating misinformation by choosing to read my posts and misrepresentating what Ive said.

Plenty of NT men have profound impairments to emotional regulation (significant trauma histories etc) which lead to unintentional losses of self control, or outsized needs to control other people in order to reduce overwhelming anxiety, as trauma has resulted in permanently altered brain function. If family members are getting harmed, it is still domestic violence.

I am not perpetuating misinformation as I have never said all autistic people having meltdowns are abusive.

I still stand by what I sais which is the OP needs to protect herself and her children.

The OP specifically asked if this is domestic abuse or meltdown and I said what I said. If you would like to purposefully misunderstand and subsequently get upset about it then that is entirely up to you.

I think @Gingerkittykat has been very clear. She has categorically not said that all autistic meltdowns constitute abuse towards family members.

OP's family situation has led to her developing PTSD symptoms. This is a fear response, triggered by such traumatic events that a person is fearful for their life or personal safety, or the lives or safety of others.

Intent really isn't the primary issue here; the question is whether other people are being harmed. It's not OK to cause harm to family members irrespective of your neurotype. If we want to prioritise understanding and meeting anyone's needs for physical and psychological safety, it should be OP's kids.

OP this is the right place because on the relationship boards etc people can be very quick to judge and project and say very unhelpful or upsetting things.

If it is domestic abuse, we know from the research that women being told "this is abuse you must leave" actually only makes the victim feel anxious and it rarely ever actually encourages them to immediately leave. Women will try to leave a domestic abuse relationship 3 or more times before they actually do leave. And if people are very very strong with their opinion it can almost be a shaming way of doing it, like "this is obvious how can you not see it" just makes you not ask for help ever again. Also if you did need to leave him you'd need to think about how to make sure you did it safely: women are in more danger when they try and leave because the perpetrator feels they have lost control and go big to get it back.

The fact is we can't tell you here. None of us were there or know enough about you or the situations to jump to conclusions and start demanding you take action.

It sounds to me like regardless of the motive or cause, it's really hard for you and the kids and it must be awful for you to carry this on your own. It also sounds like you are torn between your loyalties from wanting to give the children a happy calm home, but worried about your husband. You have a lot of empathy for him which is great, but also this might be muddying the water if it makes you feel too guilty to do anything. But you and the kids come first. You can get away from him or ask him to leave to give you both space to think. It doesn't make you cruel to him if you want space.

If you feel scared now you can call the police or leave and go stay with a friend.

If things are calm now and you are overwhelmed by the idea of running out into the street with two kids on a Sunday night, I can understand that too.

Either way you need professional advice. Try women's aid, maybe speak to someone at your local police station or call the non emergency line and also someone who can give a professional opinion on this specific persons ASD.

However the bottom line is this, you don't have to label it or know the cause. If you feel unsafe, call 999. Regardless of why or what's happening. The police would attend with body cams and look into what's happening, talk to you both and offer advice. If he can and wants to change and he is not deliberately wanting to hurt scare you it might be the shock he needs. If he is a perpetrator of DV he will likely deny it and be horrible towards you for reporting him: in which case the police can put in an emergency restraining order and advise you.

I am a survivor of domestic abuse. And I know how dreadful this whole thing can feel. I was abused for a period of 17 years. I left him after 7, and he continued to abuse me through the family courts over childcare arrangements and spiteful
Allegations for the past 10. It's not an easy road to navigate and you need proper help from professionals.

Take care. Big hugs. I wish I could do more for you

And some signposting to help you:

www.nhs.uk/live-well/getting-help-for-domestic-violence/

www.nationaldahelpline.org.uk

www.womensaid.org.uk/information-support/the-survivors-handbook/

www.met.police.uk/ro/report/domestic-abuse/a1/report-domestic-abuse/

cpdonline.co.uk/knowledge-base/safeguarding/what-is-clares-law/#:~:text=Clare's%20Law%20is%20focused%20on,agencies%20to%20believe%20that%20someone

asdmarriage.com/2022/11/20/can-abuse-be-attributed-to-an-autistic-spouse/

autismawarenesscentre.com/how-do-i-know-if-i-am-in-an-abusive-relationship-what-is-different-about-family-violence-in-the-asd-community/

www.verywellhealth.com/what-is-an-autistic-meltdown-260154

www.quora.com/How-can-I-tell-an-autistic-meltdown-from-abuse-I-m-married-to-a-level-one-autistic-adult-Usually-our-relationship-is-great-but-after-being-sensorily-overloaded-from-travel-she-exploded-and-emotionally-abused-me-for

Hi, using a throwaway account to reply to this - obviously it’s a sensitive topic.

I was in this situation for four years and, like you, I often thought ‘it’s because of his autism’ and downplayed it.

I would be punched, beaten, kicked and bitten on a regular basis, sometimes several times a week and even more so whenever I tried to end the relationship or take some space - so I know how scary that prospect is too!
There were also all manner of insults, put downs, accusations and whatever else that came off (to a neurotypical person) as sheer insanity but later made sense the more research I did into ND (eg. if an insult had been heard somewhere it would be randomly used and repeated - hence sounding out of context in our relationship. God knows where half of it came from!
My things would regularly be broken, either during a meltdown or just to be spiteful.

The meltdowns that led to this violence would happen over seemingly nothing to us, but are a big deal to someone ND (eg. one time a clothing item ‘looked wrong’ so I got my head smashed in).

Whatever’s causing it, it’s still abusive and it’s still scary. Your partner needs to get some help. Mine started to, but lied to the professionals constantly, would never admit the violence - so no improvement. Hopefully yours is better!

It’s been almost a decade since I was able to get out (ended with police involvement and physical removal) and I have PTSD, as well as physical scars where chunks were bitten off me.
I’ve heard through mutual friends that I’m still to this day talked about - how I’m the ‘bad guy’ and an awful, abusive person for putting him through the ‘trauma’ of the police, but I don’t want to hear it and I don’t let it bother me. It was my only choice. I’d be dead without and I know I did the right thing.

Please, please, put yourself first and look at what you need and/or want from this relationship. If it’s staying with him and seeking further help - that’s great as long as it’s helpful for you too.
If you need to leave, that’s also fine. You don’t need to feel bad or guilty, because you need to feel safe too.

If he doesn’t take the steps to prevent this, it will keep happening and it WILL get worse.

Sorry this has been a bit of a ramble, I’m probably not much help but I hope you’re OK, OP.

Dear @Throwaway23X thank you for your brave post. I'm very glad you got away.

I think it really needs to be emphasised that abuse remains abuse regardless of the 'cause' or whether the harm is intentional. My DH can actually be quite financially abusive but was shocked and horrified when I told him this. He simply didn't 'see' how his behaviours were not acceptable and that withholding core financial information from his wife was not on. Once this was made clear to him the penny gradually dropped.

I’d say that this is abuse. The way I’d distinguish abuse from a meltdown is how he responds when you try to talk to him about it. If he’s prepared to talk rationally about it and about how he can take steps to avoid the behaviour, then that’s not abuse. But I suspect that this isn’t the case.

You talk about ‘Walking on eggshells’ which is normally something people say when they’re dealing with a personality disorder. You also talk about managing his moods, which again suggests borderline personality disorder. Undiagnosed and untreated borderlines can be very abusive. Do a bit of research and see what you think.

It doesn’t matter what’s causing this abuse though…you don’t have to put up with it and it could escalate.

I’m sorry you suffered this horrific abuse but I find this incredibly offensive, as I imagine do most of the ND people on this thread.

“eg. if an insult had been heard somewhere it would be randomly used and repeated”

This is just rubbish….why are you posting such nonsense on the ND board?

Why are you offended by someone else's experience? I don't actually understand what there is to be offended by. Are people not allowed to discuss abusive behaviour simply because their partner is ND? Do you believe that ND people are incapable of abusive behaviour? Do we have some kind of halo or special ND get out of jail free card?

My ND makes me more prone to being reactive. I used to think shouting and swearing was normal behaviour because I grew up in a reactive ND home. When I began to realise it wasn't normal I looked at my behaviour differently. Rather than shrugging and saying Oh well, I'm ND I took steps to recognise my unacceptable behaviour and behave differently. It will always be harder for me than some people but I don't get a pass on it just because I'm ND.

It doesn't matter whether his behaviour is intentionally abusive or not. It makes you scared and stressed and you are entitled to leave to protect yourself.

Him being ND doesn't change that. He's not your child and you are not responsible for him.

i thought this was a safe place for neurodiverse mumsnetters .
im sick of all the autism bashing and thought this board would be somewhere only neurodiverse mumsnetters would post ..