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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

My sweet brother has gotten himself in a pickle.

45 replies

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 12:47

Name changing for this.

Looking for a bit of advice here.
My younger brother has been having a tough time of it recently in his current relationship of over a decade. There has been issues with his grown up stepkid stealing and also I know that the romantic side of the relationship has died a death. He's not the type to give up and leave and we've had a lot of conversations about this over the last two years. He's not happy but he's not "a quitter" in his words.
I've seen him cry about it. He's a very patient and sweet man and he's always been very steady. Not flighty or impulsive at all.

Two months ago a lovely friend of mine met him at one of my parties. She's drop dead gorgeous and usually has men losing their heads over her, but she's quite careful in her dating choices and hasn't dated anyone in four years since her partner died. The two of them hit it off really well. They both have a similar set of interests and they ended up chatting all evening at the party like they had known each other forever. I thought it was nice to see him animated and smiling again but didn't think more of it at the time because I know what he's like - he's not flirtatious in the slightest (he's very nerdy). They have been at a few events since and they gravitated towards each other but I just thought that was maybe him coming out of his depression and engaging with people generally more and the same for her. Just to add they are both in their fifties so this isn't young folk we are talking about here.

She told me that one night last week he messaged her and basically very awkwardly blurted out to her he wants to be with her, arranged to meet her and then stood her up. All this is very out of character for him.

She likes him and was very hurt by his behaviour. And he's now hiding away feeling guilty about both his wife and her. He apologised to her and said he's feeling terrible for blurting and then standing her up when she's been through so much already. He came over here later that day and mumbled a lot about being an idiot but didn't talk about it. Of course I've now joined the dots. I think he was trying to tell me what he'd done but he's too ashamed of himself.

How to handle it? Do I tell him I know and ask him to chat? Or leave it to them to sort it out? We normally have a close relationship so I feel I could say something to him and just let him talk. I know he's struggling with his own sense of personal responsibility and guilt but I don't think he should be handling it alone without talking because it's obviously doing his head in.

My friend is handling it very well and she was nice to him about it but I now think in hindsight that he's head over heels about her and that's why he's now gotten himself into a pickle. She's alway now for a few months working abroad so she's effectively removed herself from the picture. Do I just tell him I know and then see what he says? I hate the idea of him being upset and struggling - our father was the same and stayed in his second marriage to the detriment of his own mental health and I'm worried my brother is doing the same, in silence.

The other part of my head is thinking WHAT A TWAT HE IS.

OP posts:
TipsyAndTommy · 01/08/2023 12:50

Your 'sweet' brother isn't in a 'pickle' he's trying to cheat on his wife!?Hmm

donkra · 01/08/2023 12:51

So your brother... is married. And you want to encourage him to have a relationship with your friend? Have I... got that right?

Your brother is a twat and clearly has big emotional problems you can't fix. I don't think your friend is his Manic Pixie Dream Girl, and doesn't she deserve better anyway? I would advise your friend her life is her own but your brother is married and probably a poor prospect and otherwise recuse yourself from the situation entirely.

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 12:51

TipsyAndTommy · 01/08/2023 12:50

Your 'sweet' brother isn't in a 'pickle' he's trying to cheat on his wife!?Hmm

Yeah that's the TWAT side of it.
Maybe I just leave him to it but it's so out of character for him and he's been so depressed recently.
Maybe a midlife crisis?

OP posts:
funtimes1987 · 01/08/2023 12:52

Have you spoken to your brother's current partner about the relationship? He could be telling you a pack of lies for all you know.

purplecorkheart · 01/08/2023 12:52

Other than advising your friend to stay away from a married man. I would do nothing and stay out of it.

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 12:53

donkra · 01/08/2023 12:51

So your brother... is married. And you want to encourage him to have a relationship with your friend? Have I... got that right?

Your brother is a twat and clearly has big emotional problems you can't fix. I don't think your friend is his Manic Pixie Dream Girl, and doesn't she deserve better anyway? I would advise your friend her life is her own but your brother is married and probably a poor prospect and otherwise recuse yourself from the situation entirely.

No I don't want to encourage him at all, more if he needs to talk about it to me rather than mess up my poor friends emotions (and damage himself and explode his life in the process too)

OP posts:
donkra · 01/08/2023 12:54

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 12:51

Yeah that's the TWAT side of it.
Maybe I just leave him to it but it's so out of character for him and he's been so depressed recently.
Maybe a midlife crisis?

By all means advise your brother to see a doctor, but I really don't think you're going to help the situation by encouraging him to cheat on his wife with your friend, do you?

You can't save your brother. He will save himself, or not. If he is depressed, he is the only person who can get himself treatment.

WetBandits · 01/08/2023 12:54

funtimes1987 · 01/08/2023 12:52

Have you spoken to your brother's current partner about the relationship? He could be telling you a pack of lies for all you know.

Why would she do that? Confused

If this were my brother, I’d be furious with him and make it clear that I didn’t approve of his actions but he is still my brother so I wouldn’t be going and speaking to his partner about their relationship!

AnnaMagnani · 01/08/2023 12:54

Realistically most people in dying relationships don't leave until they have found someone else.

Your 'sweet' brother needs to acknowledge his current relationship is over and end it. And have some time by himself rather than lurching in to a new relationship with the first woman to show him some attention.

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 12:57

AnnaMagnani · 01/08/2023 12:54

Realistically most people in dying relationships don't leave until they have found someone else.

Your 'sweet' brother needs to acknowledge his current relationship is over and end it. And have some time by himself rather than lurching in to a new relationship with the first woman to show him some attention.

Yes I think this is what I want to talk to him about. That he needs to do something in his current situation and not leak that destructive energy out elsewhere. Because this now has affected my friend.
But it is really really out of character for him.

OP posts:
Outdamnspot23 · 01/08/2023 12:57

I also have a brother that is very sweet and responsible, but in this case I think your bro's usual behaviour is somewhat blinding you to what's going on now.

" I know he's struggling with his own sense of personal responsibility and guilt but I don't think he should be handling it alone without talking because it's obviously doing his head in."

Is it doing his head in or is he in fact selfishly doing your head in, your friend's head in and (if she were to find out) his wife's head in? He might be struggling but he's old and ugly enough to work out that you don't start a relationship with anyone (let alone your sister's friend) while married. It's not much of an enigma is it.

Damn right I would tell him I know, he can't go round spreading his relationship worried or mid life crisis or whatever it is all over the place like a bad smell. You can be sympathetic to his marital troubles but he needs a reminder that it's not ok to get other people caught up in his mess. It's a clean yes or no needed from him - stay married or split.

BanditsOnTheHorizon · 01/08/2023 12:58

TipsyAndTommy · 01/08/2023 12:50

Your 'sweet' brother isn't in a 'pickle' he's trying to cheat on his wife!?Hmm

Nailed it

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 12:58

I think I'm actually really cross with him now I see it written down.
He's being really passive. And it's turned into a mess! And because my friend has told me I feel responsible but I'm not responsible.

OP posts:
BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 12:59

Outdamnspot23 · 01/08/2023 12:57

I also have a brother that is very sweet and responsible, but in this case I think your bro's usual behaviour is somewhat blinding you to what's going on now.

" I know he's struggling with his own sense of personal responsibility and guilt but I don't think he should be handling it alone without talking because it's obviously doing his head in."

Is it doing his head in or is he in fact selfishly doing your head in, your friend's head in and (if she were to find out) his wife's head in? He might be struggling but he's old and ugly enough to work out that you don't start a relationship with anyone (let alone your sister's friend) while married. It's not much of an enigma is it.

Damn right I would tell him I know, he can't go round spreading his relationship worried or mid life crisis or whatever it is all over the place like a bad smell. You can be sympathetic to his marital troubles but he needs a reminder that it's not ok to get other people caught up in his mess. It's a clean yes or no needed from him - stay married or split.

This is really close to the bone. I think this is what I'm feeling.

OP posts:
funtimes1987 · 01/08/2023 12:59

WetBandits · 01/08/2023 12:54

Why would she do that? Confused

If this were my brother, I’d be furious with him and make it clear that I didn’t approve of his actions but he is still my brother so I wouldn’t be going and speaking to his partner about their relationship!

Yeah, I didn't mean speaking to the brother's partner about these latest revelations. I meant had she spoken to her brother's partner about the relationship with her brother. Is it that OP only knows what her brother has told her or has she also heard it from his partner that the relationship is no longer romantic?
My point is that men invariably spin a pack of lies for various reasons, if they want to cheat, if they want flying monkeys, if they want a bit of there-there attention. A sister will naturally believe her brother. There might be a need for more objectivity here perhaps unless OP knows categorically that her brother's relationship is dead and he's only hanging on in there because he's a 'good guy'.

Outdamnspot23 · 01/08/2023 13:00

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 12:59

This is really close to the bone. I think this is what I'm feeling.

You sound close to him, I would try to have a frank phone call or preferably an in person walk and chat and get this across to him. You can add that if he's this miserable it's ok to end the relationship, I'm sure you've told him this before.

WhamBamThankU · 01/08/2023 13:01

He's a nasty piece of shit who's trying to cheat on his wife

Outdamnspot23 · 01/08/2023 13:02

To add, I don't know yours obviously but my sweet usually responsible brother is autistic and occasionally does need the flaming obvious pointed out to him x

Abouttimemum · 01/08/2023 13:03

If he’s not happy in his current relationship he needs to end it. It’s not rocket science. If it was my brother I’d be talking to him about it yes.

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 13:04

@Outdamnspot23 yes I think I will just chat to him now I've processed this a bit since writing it out.

It's taking up my brain space because it's affected my friend now. There's been a lot of times when he himself has admitted he should have left and then he will just stay and so I stopped talking about it with him because he was being so passive.

Now it's bloody leaked out. We are close, very close and he's a really supportive brother to me.
But men can be twats, even the sweet ones.

OP posts:
funtimes1987 · 01/08/2023 13:06

Where was his partner when he was partying with your drop dead gorgeous friend, OP?

Yorkshirepuddled · 01/08/2023 13:06

Stop trying to mother him.
He's a grown man.
You talk about him like he's a little innocent 5 year old boy "sweet brother" "in a pickle."

It's pathetic.

He needs to grow up and grow some balls and you need to stay out of his affairs.

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 13:09

Outdamnspot23 · 01/08/2023 13:02

To add, I don't know yours obviously but my sweet usually responsible brother is autistic and occasionally does need the flaming obvious pointed out to him x

Similar issues at play here.
But yes it's been helpful to just be able to put it where it belongs - with him and not me.

OP posts:
Fizzadora · 01/08/2023 13:14

Your friend is not so innocent in all of this though is she? She agreed to meet a married man after he told her he wanted to be with her instead of telling him to sort his current relationship out first.

Yorkshirepuddled · 01/08/2023 13:24

BroomCupboard · 01/08/2023 13:09

Similar issues at play here.
But yes it's been helpful to just be able to put it where it belongs - with him and not me.

This is exactly why his marriage is in trouble @BroomCupboard he needs an autism diagnosis. I'd bet money on it. I thought it immediately from your description of him.

I can already work out the narrative- he's emotionally unavailable, gets absorbed in his own special interests, his wife is lonely and exasperated, she gets cross with him and angry, he feels sad and hard done by when she argues with him and you feel sorry for him because afterall, he's a sweetheart.

They probably have separate rooms, separate lives and everyone is wondering why his wife isn't more grateful to have such a sweet husband when infact, she's slaving away trying to make a family work with a man who is totally disengaged from it.

Your friend had a lucky escape.
She's an idiot for getting involved with a married man.