How important is conversation to you?

[SunsetOverParadise]

I know, the title seems weird. But it’s something I’ve been musing on lately. I’m someone who has high mental energy - I am deeply curious about everything. I love to learn, to read, to debate anything and everything. I think understanding and perspective is important.

I have started to notice a pattern with men I have been in relationships with. They are often drawn to me because of the above qualities, and at the start they join in and enjoy talking and they have strong opinions etc. All good. But at some point it’s as if they’ve given everything they have had in their heads and they just drop back to wanting to listen to me. It’s not that they become less interested in me - if anything, it feels like they expect me to show up and provide the mental stimulation and they just sit and soak it up, like I’m something to be admired. I ask their opinion - ‘I don’t know.’ I ask about them - ‘not a lot happened today.’ If I try and do similar - to say little, or keep it about the daily grind, they start asking me questions so I go deeper again. But they still don’t provide anything back.

I get really bored of it, if I’m honest. I choose to be with specific people because I’m interested in them. I want to hear their opinion. I want to receive of them. I do get that nobody can be ‘on’ all the time, and I really encourage personal space and time apart, participating in separate interests etc. But at some point if they aren’t refilling the cup, I’m going to drink it dry. And then what’s left?

I welcome honest thoughts on this. I’m fully aware that some people don’t care about having conversation or exchanging ideas. And that’s fine if that works for them. But I feel this is an integral part of who I am. I don’t want to date just a body.

Am I being too demanding? Is this unreasonable? I feel like maybe it’s my issue, if several men seem to just…run out of things. But at the same time I don’t understand how a person can go weeks on end just existing on rote.

either you aren’t dating people as intelligent as you, or you talk too much ?

How long are we talking about time wise? Do you get bored of them after years or weeks? I've been with dh for 25 years and we still have proper conversations but tbh most of our daily chats are just that, chat. We talk about work, cricket, the kids but a lot of it is 'did you pay Brownies?'mixed in with some slightly more interesting news stuff! When you say you 'go deeper' what sort of topics are you talking about?

It would depends if the level of conversation, the sharing of ideas and the subject of the conversation I suppose.

It depends on the time of the conversation also. Not all the hours of the day are good for talking at least for me.

I'm all in for a good conversation but I'm rubbish talking daily stuff in nothing special had happened, I found talking about daily stuff utterly boring and I easily withdraw of that kind of chitty chatty conversations. You can include here conversations about something that happens on daily life to my family, friends etc.

I wouldn't say a word if someone I know go to a mega wonderful holidays to a paradise, that is daily stuff, but I would happily bring those holidays in a conversation if they for example got lost on their way to a restaurant and found and adopted a dog. The holiday itself doesn't interest me, being lost and adopt a dog in a foreign country sound a kind of adventure and I happily talk about it.

I'm a bit weird I know, but what I meant to say is like not everyone has the same level of sharing.

If you like talking in general and discuss you will find someone who will appreciate it.

Your question was is important conversation. Yes it is, but not everyone does it at the same level.

I’m not sure I would say I’m bored of them, more so I’m bored of just being the one providing the stimulation. I don’t like to hear myself talk - I know what’s in my head. But they want me to talk and don’t really join in.

Timeline varies massively. Unfortunately usually after I’m emotionally invested.

Topics can be anything - current affairs, what I’m reading, something I’ve seen that prompts a particular train of thought, politics, religion - the list goes on. Sometimes the guy brings me a topic - so for example: ‘I read x’ or ‘I heard y’ and then they sort of drop it at my feet and don’t tell me what they think. If I prompt that? ‘I don’t know.’

Thanks. This gives me things to think about. Sometimes the time can’t be helped - I’m seeing someone who works different hours to me right now so the times we both have free are very limited.

I try to be really mindful of tiredness, energy levels etc. It’s not like every time I see them I’m like ‘let’s discuss the conspiracy theories surrounding the JKF assassination’ (random example!) and I don’t feel like I talk AT them unprompted.

But I also can’t do the ‘let’s sit in silence and not say anything’ for hours on end thing. On my own? Sure. I’m perfectly content in my own company for extended periods of time. I can do what I want then.

Most conversation sort of flows naturally between and into different topics and segues. Do you perhaps fixate on one particular topic at a time and want to continue talking about it long after the other party has exhausted what they know or their level of interest in it and is indicating by “sitting out” of the conversation that they’d like to move on? If you consistently experience the same problem with people you converse with, are you missing the signals that they’re attempting to lead away onto something else? You’ve used phrases like “exchanging ideas”, which makes it sound a bit academic rather than enjoyable closeness. Do you think that’s the case?

DH and I might talk about the Big Stuff like economics, current affairs, history, linguistics etc but we do it entirely in passing, and it’s usually interspersed with anecdotes, jokes, and mocking what rubbish somebody we vaguely know has posted on Facebook, and thus we pass an evening. I went out for dinner with my ex last night and we discussed everything from accurate presentation of mark to market losses on a reinsurance loss portfolio to Charlie Sheen to Thai cookery tips to what our former neighbours are doing with themselves nowadays - each topic just somehow led into the next without either of us realising it was happening. Do you never have that sort of evening with somebody?

I adore conversation and have not found this, in friends or romantic partners. Are you choosing poorly — are these men who are putting their best foot forward conversationally to impress you at the start, but it doesn’t come naturally, and the performance breaks down once the relationship ‘settles’? (Though no idea how you would tell in advance…)

How long does it tend to take before they stop conversing?

A man limited in conversation is a very boring man to me.

It’s like a death by one thousand swords.

In my experience, intelligent men are usually very good communicators and are far more skilled at interesting conversation on a very broad level.

You definitely need to find someone more intelligent and interesting. Don’t ever compromise on that would be my strong advice.

I could have written the OP’s post ☹️. My DP is so loving and kind and dependable and brilliant in bed but he is no conversationalist at all. He’s not unintelligent, rather he’s incurious and lazy and lacks confidence. My XH was the opposite in every way, lots of good conversations but he was an idiot. I have one male friend who I have endless excellent conversations with but I don’t fancy him. I give up.

If conversation is about social bonding and that makes you "happy" some people will seek conversation because it makes them happier.

Imagine if someone didn't get much happiness out of social bonding. Imagine if they only got happiness out of novelty.

What happens is that initial conversations are taking place because of different motivations: social bonding versus novelty.

Social bonding lasts but novelty by definition does not.

Just a thought OP. What do you find with friendships, with men or women? Does the same thing seem to happen eventually?

Really important to me. I want someone I can discuss current affairs, politics, everything really. I’d be pretty bored in a relationship with someone who had nothing to contribute.

Thank you. Yes, that’s the sort of evenings I enjoy. And usually happen at the start. But then they vanish.

I CAN get stuck on a topic but it’s rare because I am pretty self aware so I tend to only allow that with people who happen to have a particular interest in a topic. It’s an issue that happens before any conversation can get started. If I don’t initiate (and continue) then it isn’t happening at all.

So while I do think it’s a me issue, I don’t think it’s the particular issue you’ve mentioned.

This is what I’m afraid of — particularly the comment that you can’t tell until it happens. I very much choose partners on the basis of value alignment and then my interest in their brain. I like smart men. They don’t have to be academically smart; I’m not a snob. Current guy is blue collar with little in the way of formal education but I fell hard for his ability to think around anything.

When it happens varies.

I don’t ever think I am compromising. That’s part of the problem. It starts off great. If they can’t talk in the first place we don’t get off the starting block.

But I’m starting to feel like I’m sort of oddity that they want to ramble on while they gaze adoringly. I’m not interested in hearing me - I want to bounce things back and forth.

Gah! I feel bad that I’m glad someone understands. This is exactly it. I don’t feel like I have ridiculous standards either.

This is interesting. Though I think I’m an endless novelty for them whilst they get to stop trying.

I don’t have much time for many friends. But generally, no. Those I have are deep and long lasting. Interestingly, with one of them, we rarely discuss anything beyond the sensory - so things that are happening around us. People we know. Situations. But we can talk for hours together. She’s also a work colleague though and I wonder if that situation changed the friendship would remain.

The friends are mostly (but not exclusively) female.

I find this. I’ve found it a pattern over and over with romantic partners but not with friends. That’s how I know, for me, that some men would rather just have sex with me than listen to me. Or they become lazy once I’m “snared”.

I know exactly what you mean and it took me a long time to find a man cleverer than me. We have no shortage of intelligent conversation and interest in life. Keep looking

That’s interesting about friendships OP and it’s where we part company - my conversations with female friends and family are very rewarding and equal. To be honest it’s where I focus my energy now. Finding that unicorn of a fanciable male with equal conversation and emotional intelligence as well is not going to happen for me now (I’m 60, i can’t be bothered frankly!) so I’m sticking with my imperfect DP for love and sex and my female friends and family for intellectual stimulation, fun and adventures.

My partners tend to be talkers, OP, and I am the quieter one. I don't really like repeating myself, and am afraid to bore people by talking about banal things. So I will probably have more to say at the start of a relationship than later on, as there are lots of fresh stories I can tell or opinions I can voice, and big topics we haven't talked about.

My chatty partners tend to be less afraid of repetition, often using the same stories, arguments or lines whenever a topic comes up. If they're a good conversationalist, I think "I should repeat myself more often too" (but then never do!). Sometimes I might zone out slightly. One guy in particular would always tell the same long stories so that you couldn't even jump in with a comment as you had to wait for them to end. And he hated silence, so when a story ended, before you could work out how to get a normal conversation going again he'd he off again with a chirpy comment about something totally different.

I doubt you're like that - in my experience it's usually men who give lectures - but perhaps you are a) attracting partners who like someone chatty because they are not, b) getting your comments in a bit too fast, not leaving them the aeons they require to voice an idea, c) giving the impression that you are happy to hold up the conversation, and better at doing so than them? Maybe stepping back a bit, waiting longer and acting interested when they do talk might bring them out of themselves more? Or holding back during the first few dates to see if they can hold up a conversation on their own?

I think you have just pinpointed why I ended my last relationship - he thought it was really out of the blue, i couldn't believe he wasn't also bored out of his mind!

It is tricky to find someone who can regularly converse on that level, OP.

My exh and I would talk non stop - converse got hours with conversation segues from one topic to another - philosophy, literature, film analysis, why my mother was the way she was, current affairs, politics, the neighbours, history, education, the reasons underpinning low literacy and numeracy rates in inmates linguistics, women's rights... The list went on. Debates could get heated but were entertaining and always respectful.

Tbh, it was the main thing fhat kept us together. We didn't fancy each other or feel romantic love for each other but neither of us had ever met anyone we could discuss and debate with on that level.

It's the only thing I miss about him tbh. I've not since met a man able to converse on that level and with that level of integrity. Some have wanted to but, unless I submitted to their position, they'd argue with me 🙄

My current partner isn't much of a conversationalist. He is intelligent but has never mixed with 'intellectual' types so it's a skill he's mever really developed. He's not disinterested and is happy to listen to me. He asks questions but most of his opinions on topics are informed by mine on a lot of subjects. We do still discuss and debate topics where he has more knowledge and more knowledge than me but they aren't as wide or in depth.

I don't really mind this time so much. He's a far better partner overall than anyone else I've ever had a relationship with so I'm happy to sacrifice it a bit and find other outlets for it and other people to meet that need.

Tbh, I work with intelligent people and there isn't much appetite for it with them either. I don't think wanting deep and intellectual debate is as simple as finding someone of equal intelligence. It's a skill and an interest. IME.

Thank you for the solidarity, and also the advice. I think I’ll try that and see what happens. I do try all of this with my partner (who is very interesting and had a very different upbringing to me) but he currently tells me he’s just too tired from work. Which I get, to a limited degree, but the bottom line is how long do I wait for him not to be tired? I’m not willing to waste my life on the drudgery.