I think I need to end my relationship

[EatThoseFrogs]

Together 8 years, mortgaged house, no DC following a few losses.

We get on, we always have loads to talk about and have similar tastes in books and politics and hobbies. He says he loves me every day and he does make me laugh.
But he doesn't naturally think of others. He doesn't pull his weight in the house at all (leaves his dishes on the dishwasher, never puts a wash on etc). It's bigger than that though, he's never done anything for me that takes effort from him.

He's never had tea ready when I've been travelling with work or done the housework when I'm not well. He'll tell me to give myself a rest but never thinks of just doing it himself - it's just waiting for me the next day. He's rubbish at presents. We have a monthly date night booked in and I stopped organising things at Xmas when I started a new, busier job. We've done nothing since because he hasn't bothered at all.

He does things that suit him, no matter the impact. He has an exercise routine that he does every morning at 6am in our bedroom regardless of whether I'm asleep or not.

I just don't feel very valued. And I know you can end a relationship for any reason but after this long, I kinda feel like I've made my bed? He's pretty much always been like this but I just didn't notice at first. I was young and we were long distance for a while.

Would you try and fix this or do you think its a fundamental personality thing?

LEAVE!

My now ex was like this. I tried and tried to fix it. I did the whole 'Do nothing and he will come around'. He did 'come around' but he resented doing it and would mannounce to me every day all of the things that he'd done like he wanted a medal. He would complain like mad and shout and grumble while doing housework. (The kids were in school and I WFH so heard him). I resented him for not doing anything and he resented me for asking him to do shit TBH.

Now, DC have been diagnosed as autistic. It was recommended that both their dad and I be assessed as we both showed traits. Eldest DC does not naturally think of others and I can see how much of his behaviour mirrors that of his dad. I think when we both realised that this was just the type of person he is and no amount of anything would make him less selfish (or more selfless) it was time to call it a day.

He's fundamentally selfish.

Not mean-selfish, but he just doesn't see others' needs.

I doubt he will change. It sounds like he lacks empathy, could possibly be on the spectrum.

8 years may seem like a long time, but trust me, in 20 or 30 years, it won't seem so long. It's no reason to stay, in any case.

Do you want to be spending your twilight years with someone who, despite living with you for decades, has no idea how to look after your most basic needs? Who has no idea how to do nice things to make your life a little easier. What if your health fails when you'd old? How miserable will it be to be with someone who has no idea how to recognise your needs, or put you first. And it really will be too late to start again, then.

Get out now, a better life is that way, change your path. Only you can.

You don't need to be able to explain it to him perfectly. And it sounds like no matter how you put it, he won't really understand, anyway. That it's not working for you is enough.

He sounds rather dimwitted. I'd leave while you are still young.

Why haven't you told him to exercise elsewhere???

How can I say to him after 8 years though that he's just too selfish?

And this is exactly why it's gone on so long.

I mean this kindly as I am the same. It took me ages to realise it and it's still a struggle to fight against it.

But, stop thinking about his needs and think about your own. You need to take a leaf out if his book, fins a spine and be selfish for once

This guy isn't treating you well. You would be better off without him, you know this.

But, you are worried about how to explain it to him. You are putting barriers up by trying to find a way to be fair to him, or to get him to understand.

But fuck that, as he probably won't understand, nor does he need to. All he needs to understand is that although you haven't stopped caring about him, this relationship isn't working for you and you want to call it a day.

If he is on the spectrum, he can't really help being shit at empathy, and there will be no magic way of explaining it that makes him see the light. Doesn't mean you need to put up with it though.

You need to think about what YOU want to do. Stop worrying about how he will take it, think about what you want. And if it is to end this relationship, then make a plan and do it.

But if you want help with how to say it, you could say

"I need to have an important and difficult conversation with you".

And then, when you have his attention, say.

"I'm sorry but this relationship just isn't working for me. I care about you very much, and have enjoyed about our time together, but the longer time has gone on, the more it has become clear to me that this isn't the kind of relationship I want. I want more of an equal partnership where it comes to sharing the boring jobs of life, like housework. I've tried to address this too many times now and nothing has changed, and this simply isn't what I want.

It's too late to change, that ship had sailed. I have thought about this and made up my mind, I would rather be on my own from now on, I have decided to (say what you plan is e.g. "that we will need to sell the house and I am going to go back to my hometown" or whatever your plan is).

I'm sorry, I know this must come as a huge shock and I understand you may need some time to process this, but my mind is made up, it's too late to change anything."

If he says he'll change, you can say "I don't want to be the manager of the life admin, telling you what to do or how to put me first. It doesn't come naturally to you, and that's the point. There will be someone else out there who will love being in a relationship with you and not care about all that stuff, but I do. We are fundamentally incompatible, the longer we're together the clearer it is. I want to leave now, before I grow to resent you. I'm not asking you to change, I'm telling you I need to leave."

There is nothing wrong with ending it because he is selfish and telling him his lack and care and thought over you and the home means you are incompatible and it makes you feel like his mother not equal adults.

OP think of it this way, presumably he goes to work and does his job without needing continual reminders and someone else else stepping in to do everything for him?
Of course he can share equally with you if he wants to but he's too lazy, thoughtless and selfish.
I suggest you sit down with him and just explain it's make or break, he shapes up or its over because you are sick of living this way. If you want to help him structure a plan, put lists up of daily tasks, have a shared diary or do whatever it takes then go ahead, but certain things like exercising in the bedroom whilst you're asleep need to stop immediately, that's just ridiculous when theres a whole house at his disposal!
You can't make him thoughtful and empathetic but you can express disappointment at his attitude and explain how it makes others feel. And stop doing things for him, leave his washing etc until he's run out of stuff, don't cook for him if it's his turn and stop enabling him. Make it very clear that if he doesn't try to be your partner instead of acting like your child then it's over.

I had one like this. You can prompt and encourage to a certain point. We had an issue where he CBA to put his dirty clothes in the wash basket and just left them where they dropped. So I left it..13 days before he finally ran out of pants and he reckoned the solution was to buy more pants 🤦🏻‍♀️
The problem was he had a fundamental lack of respect for the house and anything I did. He just didn’t give a shit. I gradually realised this was indicative of our whole relationship and who he was. I realised that, even as a single parent, I would have less work without him. It’s demoralising when you’re trying to keep your home nice and someone is following behind you making mess.
So we split up. Life is easier without him. The house is tidier and cleaner. Not been easy but I don’t regret it.

I was in a relationship exactly like this for 10 years. He was selfish and lazy and wouldn't change. He'd make an effort for a few weeks then revert to his old ways. I didn't want to live like that. So I ended it.

Best thing I ever did, I didn't realise until I was on my own just how much I carried the relationship and how draining it was. I'm so much happier now on my own

I think the above suggestion for what to say to him is hugely involved, if you've decided to leave. It's enough to say 'I want an equal relationship, you haven't respected that when I've told you before, so I'm leaving.'

He'll try to talk you round, he'll say he'll make an effort, he'll tell you he's sorry, he'll tell you he loves you. You tell him that your mind is already made up. Other than fixing up the practicalities, you don't need to offer a long, drawn out explanation to Mr I-don't-really-care-about-your-feelings.

You deserve so much better than this. And think ahead. If you became ill, then when you got up from your sick bed, the whole house would be a right bloody state. He wouldn't take care of you when you were ill. Yet he will accept you looking after him, won't he? He does know what is nice because you do it for him. He sees it every day. At his age, he is not going to change. I would tell him he's just too selfish and needs to go. Ignore tears, threats of suicide, promises to change. You'll just get more of the same.

Time to think of you and your happiness. @whereismysleep puts it perfectly, I wish I'd had this advice and conversation years ago but I got there in the end.

You've definitely given it your utmost and ultimately you won't get your needs met by this man so set yourself (and him) free as the longer it goes on the more you lose yourself, your happiness and wellbeing.

Sounds like you do love him and that makes it hard to find a way to press home what your needs are in a way that he understands. It may not be too late as although he may not have natural empathy to the situation that ultimately is just a habit, it is possible to form different and better habits. I guess only you can answer if its worth the effort to perhaps help him form more agreeable habits towards you that show you more respect. Hopefully he might then realise what a lucky man he is to have someone as wonderful as you by his side.
The "meeting your standards" bit seems to be a common issue (that I've met with myself!). Might help if you think in terms of incremental improvements and "marginal gains" to help him get you to somewhere where you feel satisfied?
And final point is that I think it is hard to know when to pull the plug and taking responsibility for that can be terrifying. And it is also always easier to rationalise after the event when you have all the facts to use as evidence. My sense here is that there is perhaps still one more iteration that you could at least try even though you are clearly at the end of your tether - but as above, only you can really decide that.
Wishing you good luck and that you find the happiness you deserve.💐
[FWIW if it is relevant to you - this is a man's point of view who has been through similar situation, so might help understanding yet another perspective. And "Language of Love" sounds like an interesting read to help cope with differences that we all discover on our journeys with our partners]

I’d also be wondering about autism.

The problem with this situation is you can’t teach someone things like buying a book for your partner in the series they like. That is an instinctive reaction to loving someone.

It’s the same with household maintenance, they shouldn’t need someone ‘supervising’. Someone playing supervisor and someone being supervised isn’t a romantic relationship. That sort of thing can make you fall out of love.

Do not fall into the sunk costs fallacy. Life is definitely too short.

Ultimately being in a relationship should enhance your life, adding positive things that you don’t get anywhere else. From what you’ve said about your life and his general attitude, it just doesn’t seem the case here.

OP I really feel for you, my ex was very similar. He wasn't lazy as such but he'd just got it into his head what his jobs were and all the other things around the house were done by fairies. He never cooked me tea, if I said I don't really feel like cooking he'd just suggest take away, but if I said I wasn't really hungry and I'd just have a piece of toast he'd magically be able to make something for himself. He never did any house work past the washing up and washing his work clothes, everything else was down to me.

He's never bought me a present, we'd both kind of agreed we didn't do presents for eachother, but I used to pick up just little things for him at times that I knew he'd like. He hated that I bought presents for my family for Christmas too. He rarely organised an evening out for us, rarely did anything that was just for me (had to remind him that he used to make me a cup of tea in the mornings).

Unfortunately by the time I realised how much all this was getting to me it was too late, I'd lost so much respect for him, I no longer wanted to be intimate with him as I felt he was just taking he piss. When I left he was very upset, said it was out of the blue and argued I didn't really give him a chance to fix things. I realised he was just selfish and wouldn't change, I didn't want that any more.

Maybe you can have that conversation before you lose all respect for him and save your relationship

Why are you allowing him to exercise in the bedroom at 6am when you are trying to sleep?
That makes no sense to me.
I'd start by telling him he needs to stop this. Hard No.
For date nights you can take it in turn to plan and organise.
Tell your DH that if he is not putting effort into this you will not feel like you matter to him.
Have a planning session every week to discuss household tasks and joint goals and activities.
Tell DH it is unacceptable for him and downright disrespectful to do less than 50% of household chores.
Tell him you've mentioned this before and noticed that the pattern is that he ups his game for a short while then drops it again. Tell him that if he does this again you will not want to be in a relationship with him. In fact why not get him to do 70% of the housework for six months as payback.
Set the bar higher OP. Love and value yourself.

Amazingly sound advice in those last 3 posts. Mumsnet at its best IMHO! Blend to your personal solution - and find your smile again.

Another one here that says you will be better off on your own.

It won't be out of the blue though will it? You've tried talking , lists etc and he just cba.

You shouldn't have to train a 40yr old man to be nice to you ffs!

My ex husband was exactly the same op, I spent years trying to get him to pull his weight until I realised he just didn't want to, and that was fine for him, but I refused to waste my time anymore and it was the main reason I divorced him.

They all say you should have made it clear what you wanted, how it's a shock, blah blah blah, but at the end of the day you HAVE repeatedly spoken to him about it but he refuses to listen. Get rid.

Wow so many replies thank you!

I'm sorry so many people have been in this position and I think I do need to not rationalise this feeling in a week or a month which is what usually happens.

On autism, I have no idea. He's never had any assessments as far as I'm aware. He does work full time but does have some issues there e.g. he'll tell his manager he doesn't want to do A B or C but will do D, E or F instead. He's great at D, E and F and not a lot of people want to do it so it works for the business and his boss is made up but that seems an odd way to manage work to me and it hasn't always worked out for him in the last.

Practically, we would need to sell the house/he could buy me out with a remortgage if he wanted to keep it. And our lives could separate quite cleanly, no kids, our families live a good few hours away from one another.

I'm just really scared of the conversation and I can't work out why

He exercises in the bedroom when you are trying to sleep?

OP what would you do if you had a colleague or a manager who insisted on interrupting your work calls and lunch breaks every day? You would not tolerate it.

OP I had the same marriage! I asked him to help. I begged for things to change. It always changed for a week or two and then back to shit. I told him I wanted to separate and then hit bought the nicest birthday presents he had ever bought. It all felt like a manipulation.

We did separate and I feel so free. I can’t describe it but I’ve been told I look 20 years younger!

If you have the conversation and nothing changes then stop wasting your time. No one should have to beg to be treated with kindness!

You're probably scared of the conversation because you feel guilty and still like him as a person, that's normal and understandable.

No doubt it's a difficult conversation to have but I guarantee when all this is done the feeling of relief will be like a weight off your shoulders xxx

You're probably scared because you're worried that he won't cope without you, while also worrying that he will cope just fine without you but is choosing to treat you like this.

This could be it!

I think it'd be almost easier if I thought he was this horrible person that was doing it all on purpose to punish me for something.

But I genuinely just think it doesn't occur to him at all.

He would be a great friend, but he isn't a great partner to me (and obviously I wouldn't mention the friend bit!)

I'm just really scared of the conversation and I can't work out why

Because you're framing it as a conversation. It's not. You're telling him something.

Yes, there'll be conversations about practicalities, but 'I'm leaving because I'm not happy' isn't a conversation. It's not something where you have to convince him of your point. You just need to tell him, and not have a conversation. Any processing is something you'll do separately, and if he starts to try to make it into a conversation, tell him you're not the one to talk to about it, because your mind is made up.