Controlling men and women: I want to hear from you!

[Chevybaby]

The following query pivots on people who control their spouses/SAs being aware that they do so....

Why do you do it? How does it make you feel? How does it feel when you don't have enough control over your partner? How do you think your behaviour impacts on your partner's well being? Do you care? Do you think it's normal? So many questions!

For context I am just out of my 3rd and final relationship with a controlling man. I learned how to enable and endure this style of behaviour from my lovely mother who herself was in a relationship with a very controlling man (my father) her whole adult life.

My dad is a wonderful and kind and thoughtful dad, really brilliant. If you met him you'd love him. Why he treats my mother like he does is such a mystery to me. My mum seems to think it's conscious behaviour, I assumed it was unconscious. Any insight you can give would be very welcome!

My dad is a wonderful and kind and thoughtful dad, really brilliant. If you met him you'd love him.

a) no he isn’t
b) if his controlling behaviour is evident no I wouldn’t.

And if it isn’t evident then it’s clearly conscious. So he’s not nice or wonderful or any other deluded superlatives.

It isn't kind or helpful to call someone who has grown up in this kind of toxic family environment "deluded". She's not deluded; she is another victim of her abusive father and has been conditioned. And apparently this has led to a lifetime of relationships with controlling men.

Interesting that you would make a motel judgement and reject any interaction with a controlling man (going by your comment that you wouldn't like him) but would simultaneously label one of his victims as deluded.

*moral judgement (autocorrect)

@Puppers

Acknowledging someone is controlling, realising their behaviour has caused you harm and negatively affected your relationships but still describing them as wonderful is deluded.

But she’s saying he’s a wonderful dad. she says he is a ‘wonderful, kind, and thoughtful dad.’ He may have spent every day after work playing with, caring for, and supporting his child, and also been a controlling husband/partner. It’s really arrogant (and in fact deluded) to think that abusive people are always abusive. They’re not. They can be, or can appear to be, kind and friendly pillars of the community.

I don’t think you’re going to get the answers you want though op - nobody who is controlling will be the type of person who can reflect on their own behaviour.

Fair enough! I'd probably type the same thing to strangers who say their dad has been controlling their mother but here I am looking at my own parents, reflecting on their life and hearing from my mum what she's been quietly putting up with for decades and it doesn't feel so cut and dry. I am sad to hear what she's endured but I also don't hate my dad now.

That's a very good point about it not being evident means it must be conscious! So I guess he does know because honestly it's so subtle. You really wouldn't know to see them together.

I don't think it's deluded to say my dad is lovely but I do think he's very broken and I am delighted my mum has now left him. But I am aware as I get older that people who behave like this are absolutely everywhere... it's not a rare affliction at all and I'm fascinated to hear from even one of them in this anonymous space about what goes through their minds.

Agreed ,controlling partners can actually be great with kids, co-workers, friends etc.

I'm sure you don't need the connotations of the word explaining to you. It's clearly hurtful and unnecessary and there are many different words you could have selected that would have made the point without also being hurtful. I'm also certain you wouldn't be so rude and unkind to a victim of abuse in real life.

You're probably right! It's far too ambitious. I just can't comprehend the behaviour so live in hope of someone opening up on the matter.

You're exactly right with the dad stuff. He has been an archetypal lovely dad my whole life and as an adult I consider him a good friend and I know in these roles his kindness is not an act. But I guess he himself grew up watching my grandfather treating my grandmother that way and is as conditioned to behave that way as I am to allow people to treat me this way!

The one I knew was utterly horrible to his wife and kids but extremely compliant, keen to please, and even submissive to co-workers and in fact anyone else. His excessive people pleasing and going out of his way to help all the time was actually rather nauseating.

Ah ha, don't worry! The opinion of some angry stranger on the internet cannot hurt me! But you're right, you never know what sort of feelings this sort of language might trigger in people reading the comments.

Bring "controlling" while obviously not a positive for the people who are subject to the behaviour doesn't really say enough about the person.
People with eating disorders are controlling, as are people suffering from OCD. People with anxiety can be controlling as can parents. Many people are controlling towards themselves and others. It's a way of trying to feel better about a stressful situation that they find difficult to cope with. It's not positive, but neither is shouting or not communicating either.

I think you are referencing a specific type of controlling man. Some men can have controlling tendencies but in no way would you be afraid of them, more annoyed or bored, the same as any character flaw. Others are controlling with a violent streak. It's the violence, not the rest.

You think I'm deluded. I think you're lazy, obnoxious and simplistic. Have a great day!

Being

It depends what you mean as controlling.
I'm pretty laid back but my exH told me I was controlling.
He had absolutely nothing of his own no house, no money, and as I found kept getting sacked from jobs all the time due to not turning up, behaviour issues, not getting work in on time.
We had joint accounts and I noticed that he started going through my savings and earnings like water and had racked up £20k of debt which I didn't realise as he hid all the paperwork.
I had to change the accounts back to my name only or he would have bankrupted me completely and I have a DS to think about.
Apparently this was incredibly controlling of me and he put this in a divorce petition.
The judge disagreed with this and awarded him nothing as a settlement. He was furious. Contested it and lost with all the court fees to pay.
Last I heard he owed £50k and had no job.
I think it's an idea to specify what the controlling behaviour is. It can often be damage limitation.

it is an interesting question OP. My sister can be very controlling. She won't do it if you don't tolerate it though - wouldn't dream of trying it with her husband but would create war with my parents and me in an effort to get us to do what she said/wanted. She is also a very loving, generous, kind person and has been a great sister and daughter (as well as at times being a very cruel and scary sister). I think it comes from a very deep insecurity within herself. She knows she is doing it.

It's true, it's too broad a word.

I guess I'm referring to behaviour that is behaviourally controlling rather than violent, which neither my father nor my boyfriends have been. Although I think a lot of this ultra negative behaviour whether violent or not is borne from the same societal problems.

Oh wow I mean you did what you had to do! I guess it's trying to define the difference between taking control (which you had to do or you'd be living in a hostel by now) and exerting controlling behaviour on others.

I would say things I'm personally referring to are subtle and slow burning: isolating your partner socially; contriving a situation where they are dependant on you financially; belittling and chipping away at their confidence; telling them what to eat and wear etc.

I think you're probably right about it coming from a place of insecurity. What happy healthy person feels compelled to dominate someone else?

isolating your partner socially; contriving a situation where they are dependant on you financially; belittling and chipping away at their confidence; telling them what to eat and wear etc.

*Why do you do it? How does it make you feel? How does it feel when you don't have enough control over your partner?How do you think your behaviour impacts on your partner's well being? Do you care?

Do you think it's normal?*

I'm not controlling but I'll try to answer from any insight I've gained from being on the receiving end and from observation.

Why?
To gain and keep control in the relationship, this feeling secure & that you have power, and that any "risks" (loss etc) to you are minimised.

How does it make you feel?
If successful - secure and in control. With a slight side dish of anxiety/worry that it might drive the person away.

How does it feel when you don't have enough control over your partner?

Anxious. Angry because you think its their fault that you feel anxious.
Perhaps self righteous - because you think they're violating your "rights".
(These are obvious entitled "rights" that are not actually fair).

How do you think your behaviour impacts on your partner's well being? Do you care?

It's their fault so it's self inflicted (in the abuser's mind). Only to a small extent; because it's "self inflicted". They'd only worry that they might push it too far and cause the person to leave. But feeling in control and secure is more important than any distress/stress to their partner.

Do you think it's normal?

They don't care if it is.
They think it should be normal, they think people who don't act like this are saps, simps, soft, cucks, weird etc.

I think that, for example, Lundy Bancroft makes a very good point in his book that this behaviour is underpinned by values.

The values lead to entitlement & self righteousness.
The values don't change.

They are formed very young and are fairly hard wired.

He described trying to council abusers and them saying, laughing incredulously, while they said it "but this is my wife".

They often have a similar attitude to children.

There are obviously women who behave like this too, though you tend to not see quite so much of it from women.

If your dad only controlled your mum and no one else then it must be conscious.
He did what he thought he could get away with.
Being nice to you and getting you ‘on side’ was maybe even a way to get at your mum?
Trying to make you like him best?

They think it should be normal, they think people who don't act like this are saps, simps, soft, cucks, weird etc.

Just to add an example;

My controlling ex would respond to various things I related to him, in the course of ordinary conversation, like eg. me visiting a gay uni acquaintance abroad when he moved for his partner's work with "that wouldn't be happening with me", in a very snide, death tone.

He considered my ex weird and a sap for "allowing" it, and our relationship weird for that to be happening. He saw absolutely nothing wrong with saying that; he considered men who didn't see things like he did as saps/odd/being taken advantage of, and he thought things like that happening were why the relationship ended (they weren't).

*very snide, dry tone.

I would add that he felt he was morally superior (and if the woman went along with it, the relationship superior) for acting the way he did too; he assumed couples who eg socialised or holidayed separarely were cheating or at the very least, a risk for cheating. He abd his partner & relationship were therefore, in his mind, superior to these inappropriate, lax, risk taking people.