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Original poster

Is this a red flag?

40 replies

CP85 · 03/04/2023 09:55

I started seeing someone new a couple of months ago, met him on Hinge. It's been going well, we mesh well and have similar interests, seeing in each quite regularly.

When I last saw him on Thursday he revealed to me that he has a daughter who is about to turn 17. I am fine with my partner having children - it is to be expected at my age (37). However what bothered me is that he doesn't have any contact with her and hasn't for over ten years.

Apparently it was a one night stand when he was 22 and it was with an awful woman who made his and his whole family's life a nightmare, threatening them and just being generally nasty. He wasn't even informed when she was born.

But...surely that's no excuse to not be in her life? If anything shouldn't he have fought to stay in it so that this awful woman wasn't her only parental influence?

I just worry that this means he is fundamentally not a very nice person? He had tears in his eyes when he was telling me and he has paid child maintenance consistently but I still feel very uncomfortable about it. Should I leave it? Or am I being judgmental, I don't have kids myself so maybe there are situations where this is ok?

OP posts:
Isthisexpected · 03/04/2023 10:01

Just to clarify, so he was seeing his daughter but at some point between her birth and seventh birthday contact was stopped by the mother or by him?

Men who walk away often cite an unhinged/crazy/difficult woman as the reason. Call me cynical but I'd be wondering exactly what's happened here and agree about it potentially reflecting on his character. If her behaviour was really that awful and he pursued contact as much as legally possible but wasn't allowed to use a contact centre and had no recourse with the police etc for the woman's behaviour then I can understand walking away.

The most concerning aspect is that this child has been old enough to establish a relationship and contact with him completely independent of her mother for several years. So why hasn't he bothered?

Raindancer411 · 03/04/2023 10:01

To be honest there are so many sides to a story, it's hard to answer. Some women make it awkward for men, so it's not totally his fault he hasn't. Once his daughter is an adult and the mum cannot stop her contacting him herself, it maybe a different story.

savethatkitty · 03/04/2023 10:02

I think you might be judging him a little unfairly. Get to know him & see if other red flags present.

category12 · 03/04/2023 10:02

Yeah, I'm not sure I'd believe a word of it.

Seems very random for a woman to act that way for no reason.

And "crazy exes" who "refuse to let me see the child(ren)" are a very common thread with unpleasant men.

I'd have expected a decent man to have gone to court to get access in those circumstances were she this awful woman denying him his child.

Shoxfordian · 03/04/2023 10:04

If she was that awful then surely he would have gone to court for access. Bit of a red flag

GreyCarpet · 03/04/2023 10:07

And "crazy exes" who "refuse to let me see the child(ren)" are a very common thread with unpleasant men.

This is true but they rarely pay maintenance.

OP, I would find out more about the maintenance. Is it true? Was it consistent? Meaningful?

Are his tears for his daughter or himself?

Unfortunately, 'crazy exes' do exist (male and female) and some people stay away for their own mental health. There are times when it is not ideal but the lesser of two evils.

IfIHadAHeart · 03/04/2023 10:08

I’m the mother in such a situation. My DC is 15 and his father has never seen him. He does pay maintenance after a long battle with CMS and it’s not my choice.

He tells people I stopped him from seeing DC; this could not be further from the truth. I tried my best to encourage contact but he was not interested and in the end I gave up flogging a dead horse.

I would run a mile from any man who has no contact at all with his children.

category12 · 03/04/2023 10:13

GreyCarpet · 03/04/2023 10:07

And "crazy exes" who "refuse to let me see the child(ren)" are a very common thread with unpleasant men.

This is true but they rarely pay maintenance.

OP, I would find out more about the maintenance. Is it true? Was it consistent? Meaningful?

Are his tears for his daughter or himself?

Unfortunately, 'crazy exes' do exist (male and female) and some people stay away for their own mental health. There are times when it is not ideal but the lesser of two evils.

We only have his word for it that he does pay maintenance. And he may have been forced, ie. it being taken directly from his wages if he's PAYE.

Of course there are cases where it's true, but I would be wary.

Original poster
CP85 · 03/04/2023 10:20

So I just asked him about why he didn't pursue access through the courts and he said, 'having spoken with people who'd done it, essentially it'd end up being through an intermediary that I saw her, which would mean her having to be taken to a centre before I'd see her without her mum (if she took her) and the environment is not great for a child, nor is it settled quickly, even when the other parent cooperates'. Sounds like he really didn't want any situation where he had to see the mother?

I do believe he's paid maintenance, he was telling me specific sums.

It all just makes me very uncomfortable though.

OP posts:
Heroicallyfound · 03/04/2023 10:23

My mum was the crazy one. My dad paid maintenance, and on his account she made it difficult for him to have contact with me and my brother.

But from my perspective, it takes two to tango and my dad has never shown much drive to see me and no emotional availability when he has seen me. As an adult now he feels very distant to me.

I would pay close attention to how this man is telling you his story. Does he show any concern for his daughter’s feelings in it all? Is there any hint of pleading with you for you to see him as the good guy in all of it? Does he recognise his responsibility as a father? Does he show any regret for not fulfilling those responsibilities? Is he able to tell you his part in the story and his feelings about it without defaulting to blaming the ex? It’s not so much mistakes made in the past that are the problem but whether he has a mature outlook and takes responsible actions now.

category12 · 03/04/2023 10:24

Sounds doubtful - I think having supervised access only is quite unusual if there's no safeguarding issues?

And if you gave a shit about the kid, surely you'd jump through that hoop anyway?

theWarOnPeace · 03/04/2023 10:33

My exh pays maintenance because CMS force him to. He does not see his kids.

If and when he ever randomly rocks up to see them/as it’s been so long, I’d tell him to go via the courts as the disruption after such a long time would be disruptive and he is abusive so it’d be a no unless it was court ordered and some boundaries in place.

There’s no way with my EXH level of behaviour, as vile as it was/is, that they’d limit access to a contact centre if he wanted to see them. The courts I think would let him see them with few restrictions.

The whole story of having to see her in a contact centre is the red flag for me. Maintenance he would have basically very little choice, plus it gives him the ability to say he’s doing his best.

KettrickenSmiled · 03/04/2023 10:36

CP85 · 03/04/2023 10:20

So I just asked him about why he didn't pursue access through the courts and he said, 'having spoken with people who'd done it, essentially it'd end up being through an intermediary that I saw her, which would mean her having to be taken to a centre before I'd see her without her mum (if she took her) and the environment is not great for a child, nor is it settled quickly, even when the other parent cooperates'. Sounds like he really didn't want any situation where he had to see the mother?

I do believe he's paid maintenance, he was telling me specific sums.

It all just makes me very uncomfortable though.

Sorry OP - he's full of shit.
Why would he need to see his own child "through an intermediary"?
Why would the child need to be "taken to a contact centre" in order to spend time with her own father?
Why would you believe such dramatic posturing?

If he'd wanted access, he could have taken the necessary steps to have it court-ordered, & at his own home.

If he'd wanted a relationship with his child, he would have ensured it happened.

Don't be taken in by crocodile tears or talk of "specific sums". Besides, whether he pays maintenance or not (or is forced to by CMS) isn't the issue - the issue is he didn't even try to see his daughter. If he had, she'd be having a relationship with him independent of her mother by now.

But he didn't bother, because "crazy ex". Yeah right.
Funny how women with crazy exes - like some of the alarmingly coercive & nasty bastards written about in agonised threads here - don't allow the craziness to stop them ever seeing their children.

Original poster
CP85 · 03/04/2023 10:38

I assume the whole contact centre scenario is to protect him from the mother, given how threatening he claims she was with him and his family?

But if she's really that awful then he should have claimed full custody? Or maybe she's a great mother but just awful to everyone else.

I'm starting to think I'll never be ok with this as there's too much I can never really know about the situation.

OP posts:
AllOfThemWitches · 03/04/2023 10:43

Realistically, how many men do give a shit about the results of one night stands.

Dogsitterwoes · 03/04/2023 10:47

Hard to judge without hearing both sides, but hell or high water wouldn't stop most Mum's seeing their kids, but funny how it's too hard for so many men.

The contact centre stuff is bollocks, who told him it would have to be that way, and why, and why did he believe them. And it would be better for a child than nothing.

I know a young man in his 20s with a genuinely poisonous ex who did her best to turn their child against him. He represented himself in family court 3 times every time she stopped access. He has a lovely relationship with his child now.

I'd be very put off by this.

theWarOnPeace · 03/04/2023 10:50

No. You know who was threatening and menacing on every level? My EHX. And the many, many many examples on here of abusive nasty bastards (I know not all men) and very rarely have I ever heard of a woman just hold her hands up and ditch her kids forever with such a nasty piece of work. My EXH is bigger and stronger than me and was as mean as they come, and if he took my kids and stopped me seeing them I would climb every mountain until I got them back, I would do whatever it took.

An ex boyfriend years ago cried about his kid and I fell for it. He did see her, but was unreliable and it turns out years later, was volatile and abusive to the mum which is what made contact so difficult and dramatic. Hence the tears.

I will give most people the benefit of the doubt and often will play devil’s advocate and look from different angles. A man who doesn’t see his kid, though. Nah.

KettrickenSmiled · 03/04/2023 10:53

I assume the whole contact centre scenario is to protect him from the mother, given how threatening he claims she was with him and his family?

Courts don't protect women whose exes beat, raped, financially & emotionally abused them by offering contact centres. Those exes are deemed fit parents & the mother has to suck it up, & facilitate contact in the standard way.

Which shows how much work your b/f has put into understanding how the system works. He knows jackshit about it & is concocting a tall tale of him gallantly paying the CMS mandated maintenance, sorrowfully suffering the absence of his child in his life ....

MadeForThis · 03/04/2023 10:55

You know who he is, you just don't want to admit it.

She's a shit dad and will be a shit partner. Don't waste any more time.

orion678 · 03/04/2023 11:39

My brother had a child quite young. We were in that child's life for a few years, and then - due to some really complex family dynamics and the breakdown of my brother's relationship with the child's mother - we lost contact with the child. The child's mother actively broke contact and effectively disappeared (there were moves to different countries involved, etc.) It absolutely broke my brother - to the point where he had a mental health crisis and was hospitalised. He didn't see his child in over a decade and that was absolutely in no way his choice. Ultimately, when his child was in their late teens, their stepfather reached out on their behalf through mutual connections on facebook and we were reunited. All this to say, I don't automatically think your boyfriend/partner's situation represents a red flag, and perhaps merits more discussion if you feel the relationship has long-term potential.

MzHz · 03/04/2023 11:46

never underestimate the damage that an awful mother can do to a kid to hurt the ex. I've seen it happen to the point where the dad had to step back to protect the child

a mother with bad intent would be easily able to manipulate the 7yo DD to NOT see her dad.

Before I met my OH and saw what his ex would do - and still would if there was anything to be gained out of it - I would have thought it a red flag and very convenient to say 'crazy ex'

Some crazy exes really are. My ex is. OH ex is.

WHAT ELSE are you getting in terms of instincts from this guy @CP85

Asummersday · 03/04/2023 11:48

Yabu imo…..which 22 year old would want to become a father to a one night stand? Who wasnt even made aware of her being born & toxic family.

theWarOnPeace · 03/04/2023 11:57

Re people who have genuinely had terrible experiences with contact, yes if course it does happen. This guy, however, didn’t go to court or seemingly do anything about any of it. He allegedly pays maintenance so the mother hasn’t changed her identity or anything, she could have been pursued.

Annoyingwurringnoise · 03/04/2023 11:58

I’m sorry, all this she’s a psychopath bullshit is just that, bullshit. I’m fucked if I’d let anybody, psychopath or not, come between me and my child. Why hasn’t he gone to court for access? If she stopped access, he should have gone to court, and if the court has refused him access then you shouldn’t need us to tell you to run, and if he hasn’t been to court then he’s chosen not to see his child.

lots of parents try to maintain some sort of relationship with their psychopath exes for the sake of their child so I’m not buying a word of it. Unless you’re the sort of person who thinks it’s perfectly fine to not be bothered about your kids and would be happy just to never see them again, then neither should you.

UB40andaglassofwine · 03/04/2023 12:02

He hasn't even tried to have contact! He has just as much right as the mother. He obviously hasn't taken things further and just let his daughter grow up without a dad.
Massive red flag 🚩