So many red flags - am I wrong to ignore?

[StLevanBlackcaps]

I met someone online about a year ago, we spoke for a few weeks then met and got on well. It developed into a relationship and I'm very happy with him. He's kind, funny, generous and loving. Sex is fantastic. We've got lots in common and really enjoy each other's company. We've both got fairly good jobs and our own social lives so we dont live in each other's pockets but we love spending time together. He's never made me uncomfortable or given me any reason not to trust him.

But... his past is like a ticklist of things that people on here would call red flags. I dated a fair bit online before I met him and I'm aware of how many losers/weirdos/messed up people there are out there. I really dont think he's one of them but I cant help wondering if I should be concerned about some of what he's told me.

He was abused as a child and has a tricky relationship with his family as a result. He has 2 children by 2 different mothers, both relationships were difficult and he doesnt speak to either woman now. One of his (now adult) children no longer has contact with him, the other has a LOT of issues. He was also married to a third woman who was abusive.

The kind rational side of me says what happened to him as a child has led to the other situations and that he deserves sympathy. The more suspicious side finds it hard to believe that everything was someone else's fault and thinks that he is the common factor.

I dont want to lose him but I'm very concerned about getting into something I'm not comfortable with. He's always been completely open and honest about his past and asked me to judge him on who he is today, not his past mistakes. Am I right to do that or should I be more cautious?

Hi OP,

It just seems from what you've said that across three women there've been problems. With each of them, they've been in a good enough relationship to settle down and to have children, then something's gone majorly wrong for one to be abusive, the other two not speak to him, and one of his children not speak to him.

It was just a thought that his issues with family carried from childhood can start making trouble for him mentally when he gets into a family situation as an adult.

A lot of red flags here OP.

Can I ask:
How much time do you spend together? Does it stretch out over a few days each time? Have you been together in stressful/boring/demanding situations? How does he cope?

Also ( in my own experience) how well do you know his birth family? Parents and Siblings? Does he get on any better with them? (I appreciate the history of abuse)

How often and for how long have you been in the company of his friends? How does he behave?
Or does he keep you at arms length from them with excuses?

He has 2 children by 2 different mothers, both relationships were difficult and he doesnt speak to either woman now. 🚩

One of his (now adult) children no longer has contact with him, the other has a LOT of issues. 🚩

He was also married to a third woman who was abusive 🚩

He’s painted himself as the victim hasn’t he? 🚩

I’d be really cautious with this one. He’s the common denominator and he’s caused a lot of relationships to break down here. Don’t believe you’re ‘different’ and can fix/rescue him.

Bit dramatic. Who are you to say that anybody else is right or wrong to do what they do? What 'rules' are you referring to?

OP, stay with him for as long as you enjoy his company. If you're not sure whether to commit, don't commit. See how it goes. Be aware, as we all should with all people in our lives, that he could start to treat you poorly. Ensure that you have your own back sufficiently so that you won't fall apart if this happens, and that you will walk away rather than put up with continuing poor treatment.

I think, if you're worrying about it enough to post for advice on a forum, you don't trust him. Make sure you are responding to your own feelings, and respecting them.

Yes he had therapy after his marriage broke down which was a few years before we met. He feels it helped him understand the past and put it behind him - appreciate that is easily said.

How much time do you spend together? Does it stretch out over a few days each time? Have you been together in stressful/boring/demanding situations? How does he cope?

We see each other most weekends and maybe once in the week, we live about an hour apart. We’ve had a couple of weekends away and a short break. I’ve seen him a bit frustrated once or twice (eg over a work issue) but generally he’s calm and less of a stress head than me!

Also ( in my own experience) how well do you know his birth family? Parents and Siblings? Does he get on any better with them? (I appreciate the history of abuse)

I haven’t met them yet - my choice. The parent who he had issues with over the abuse (they weren’t the abuser) is now dead, he’s close to the other parent and one sibling, sees the other sibling a few times a year but no big issues. I’ve met the DC he’s in touch with and they can be hard work but we got on well.

How often and for how long have you been in the company of his friends? How does he behave?
Or does he keep you at arms length from them with excuses?

I’ve met a few of them and he’s just normal, he’s invited me to meet others but like the family thing it hasn’t happened yet - we have limited time so I prefer to spend it together while we’re still in the getting to know each other phase. He is fine with meeting friends/family or not.

Sounds like if you got any more deeply involved you'd be more of a carer than a partner, and that can be enormously hard work. The 'mistakes' comment made me smile. Surely you don't get married and have children 'by mistake'? There are forms to fill in and all sorts of stuff like that! Sounds like there's a fair bit of flailing around on his part where long term intimate life is concerned.

On one hand we see it plenty of times on here when a woman goes from an abusive upbringing to abusive relationships so it's totally possible for that to happen to men too (I appreciate you have not outright called all his exs abusive just generalising there)

However, I also get rather tired of men saying their ex is abusive/crazy and then it's turns out they have little to no relationship eith their children and they have left them with this crazy/abusive woman. I never hear women who have been in abusive relationships walking out without the children and not at least going to court (again I appreciate that's not necessarily the case here precisesly)

So with that in mind I would be wary.

A. Because it's possible that he's using bad relationships to cover up poor parenting

B. because if he had moved from one abusive relationship to another to another has he taken any time out to work on himself so that he doesn't bring his issues to ever new relationships. If he was a woman going into a new relationship after several abusive ones I would want her to look at rhe freedom programme etc first for example.

I’d be looking at the work he’s done in himself. Does he understand the patterns that have impacted his relationships, what does he think is different now, do you see evidence of him holding clear boundaries, does he respect your boundaries, what does he see as his responsibility for the relationships going wrong - how does he feel about them now etc.

Having a difficult past is one thing, saying it’s all in the past is quite another because those experiences will impact him in the here and now - his insight into that along with his behaviour would influence my decision about continuing a relationship with him.

It is often said on here that women who suffered abuse as a child often tend to end up in relationships with an abuser as an adult, because it is 'normal' to them and they have been conditioned from an early age.

There is no reason why this should not also happen to men. Perhaps he is one of them.

Yes those things can be red flags but sometimes people are just quite unfortunate in life and abuse in childhood can really affect how you judge situations and what you tolerate from other people. Sometimes women can be toxic, especially when children are involved.

My DH sounds very similar to this man. He was abandoned by his BM as a baby and adopted and brought up by his grandparents. His adoptive DM passed away when he was 9 and he ended up back with his BM when he was 12. She physically abused him and made him homeless at 15.

He has 2 kids to 2 women. The first was conceived when he was 17 so they weren't really in a relationship. He doesn't speak to her much but can be civil if he ever does need to speak to her. The mother of his DD4 is another story. She physically and mentally abused him for the 12 years of their relationship. I've asked my DH why he tolerated it and he said "she didn't hit me as hard as BM". He didn't think he deserved any better.

If you've been with him a year and see him regularly I'm sure by now you would have experienced first hand any red flags. He would have had to drop the act at some point.

If he's anything like my DH, I bet he's super appreciative of you doing the slightest thing for him. People who've been abused just want to be loved and usually can't believe their luck when someone loves them properly.

If you're going to move in or take your relationship to the next stage make sure you meet his friends first. That should give you a bit of reassurance.

''Yes he had therapy after his marriage broke down which was a few years before we met. He feels it helped him understand the past and put it behind him'' 🚩

''you need to understand your past so you can put it behind you'' sounds like the sort of thing an ex might say to a troubled partner. It's not really how people who have had therapy talk about their situation, if they have successfully completed the therapy.

If you've had a really troubled childhood, therapy isn't a few sessions with a counsellor. It looks more like 18 months of intensive sessions, with the option to go back if you need to.

Maybe flip this around and take a look at yourself. Our childhoods shape us and it can be very lonely to be in a close relationship with someone who had an ideal childhood if you didn’t. We seek connection and understanding, and familiarity.

That can lead us into dangerous territory. You’re very focused on his childhood, but maybe it’s your own inner child that needs nurturing and kindness here. Think carefully about why you’re responding the way you are, and what unmet needs of your own are being triggered.

If he's anything like my DH, I bet he's super appreciative of you doing the slightest thing for him. People who've been abused just want to be loved and usually can't believe their luck when someone loves them properly.

Yes this sounds very much like him.

''you need to understand your past so you can put it behind you'' sounds like the sort of thing an ex might say to a troubled partner. It's not really how people who have had therapy talk about their situation, if they have successfully completed the therapy.

I've had therapy myself and it's exactly what I would say and how I feel. It doesnt mean I can close the door on what happened but I'm more accepting and understand how it affected me.

A. Because it's possible that he's using bad relationships to cover up poor parenting

As far as I know the mother of his DC didnt want to bring them up after they separated, to the point that she didnt even turn up to court so he was awarded custody. She still has very little contact with the DC and offers them no support at all. Again I only have his word but from what I can see he's done his best to be a good parent.

@Andsoforth that makes a lot of sense, I do have issues from my own childhood so I tend to look at other people's lives from the same perspective.

I dont think our relationship is unhealthy though - he offers the stability that my ex husband did but also the fun and excitement which he didnt. It feels like what I should have held out for in the first place.

Yes this sounds very much like him.

That’s the very mindset that would take him into, and keep him in, an abusive relationship because he’ll let his boundaries slip so as not to lose the love even if it comes with a side order of abuse.

Therapy should have helped him see he is worthy of love, not the he needs to be super appreciative of someone treating him well. He still has work to do I’m afraid.

My DH was red flag central when I met him; recently split from a toxic marriage, living at his mums, ex wife telling everyone he was abusive, he’d had a difficult childhood.
He was however, one of the most emotionally intelligent, honest and loving people I’d ever met and so determined and brave. I also had the word of his children that they’d witnessed the abuse and it was their mum, not dad.
We’ve been together 8 years and still have never had an argument, we sort issues out like adults. His ex wife now has a volatile toxic marriage with someone else. 🤷🏻‍♀️

It is possible to behave badly in a relationship without being abusive - and for relationships to end despite either partner having done anything wrong. All that seems to have happened to this guy is that he has three failed relationships. I don't think that's remotely unusual!

With no evidence that he has been abusive in past relationships (and I really cannot see any in anything you have said) I would judge him as you find him.

I have had four longish term failed relationships before my current one. Neither I nor the men were abusive. We all did non-ideal things, and I certainly did things I will try my best to avoid repeating in my current relationship. Like most human beings (not all) I try to learn from my mistakes, in relationships as in other areas.

I would judge him as you find him OP. Obviously it is always worth being cautious, and it sounds like you are being. But I would say, don't scupper your chance of a happy relationship because of a suspicion he may have behaved abusively which doesn't seem to be rooted in any actual evidence.

He was abused as a child and has a tricky relationship with his family as a result

not a red flag

He has 2 children by 2 different mothers, both relationships were difficult and he doesnt speak to either woman now

many women don’t speak to their exes either to be fair
but not the healthiest no

One of his (now adult) children no longer has contact with him, the other has a LOT of issues.

red flag 🚩
one of my kids has issues so that’s life sadly
the one not talking to him could indicate he’s maybe sub par dad

He was also married to a third woman who was abusive

dont know , as he might have issues with women and relationships
co dependency
being a shit dad ?

Therapy should have helped him see he is worthy of love, not the he needs to be super appreciative of someone treating him well. He still has work to do I’m afraid.

I agree but we're all a work in progress aren't we, it still amazes me that at nearly 50 I'm still learning - about myself and other people.

We are all work in progress
and people have the capacity to grow and change and evolve

not everyone can stomach or afford intensive therapy either

Two people have questioned if he actually completed therapy, and you have responded with 'yes but'. I think you have made up your mind, and that's affecting how you hear the responses.
Its better to go into this with eyes open; when you minimise things now it makes it harder to tackle them if they become an issue later.

I agree but we're all a work in progress aren't we, it still amazes me that at nearly 50 I'm still learning - about myself and other people.

We are, we never stop working on ourselves but he has particular issues that need attention - what is he doing to work on himself. The idea that “all that’s behind him” suggests he thinks he done all the work he needs to.

@Jellycatspyjamas and @Thelnebriati yes, good points. I think I do have my eyes open hence questioning if I'm doing the right thing. I dont think he thinks everything is behind him as such, just that he wants a fresh start. He knows he still needs to work on things like boundaries though (dont we all) and I guess I need to decide how much I'm prepared to help with that and if the other good things in the relationship make it worth doing so.