5 yr old hitting me, saying "I hate my mother" etc

[TicketBoo23]

Is this within the normal range of 5 yr old behaviour?

The hitting is occasional.

The I hate my mother, I want a different mother, different parents is ... Maybe weekly.

All occasions are when she doesn't get her way.

Or very occasionally if I did something accidentally that "inconvenienced" her, like pressed the wrong thing on her tablet

What is the correct response to this type of behaviour (my instinct is "you little effing bitch" 😫)

She started P1 and I thought she was mercifully not doing anything similar in that context bug today teacher told me she'd scraped a child who took her flower.

What did you do? I think I would take them home if they treated me like this.

It was on the way out of the centre with the soft play in it, we were leaving anyway.

I spoke to her in the car about her behaviour.

I have a feeling she'll forget about it in a months time if something angers & upsets her sufficiently again though.

I'm not sure I'm much use on this as my 5y.doesnt do those things but sometimes useful to have a range of responses maybe. My 3 yo hit me today for the very first time he wanted another game and it was bed time. I overreacted a bit "oh no! That hurt! What happened?!" And he stomped off to his room, maybe cross, maybe guilty, maybe mixture. I left him a minute then went and asked if he wanted to talk about it and explained in a serious voice that we don't hit or hurt people in this family. Then I distracted onto storytime and he was very cuddly. This worked on his sister she was 3 and hitting passed as a very short phase. With the hating language, does he maybe need more ways of expressing how he is feeling, cross,frustrated, out of control, etc? We also don't allow the word 'hate' for anything, even mushrooms! So it could be you can give him some other options from that language when he uses it in other contexts, not about you, as another way in? Good luck, sou ds really tricky.

Your job is to teach her that her actions have consequences. Hitting is unacceptable, even if it's done 'unthinkingly', and it will always lead to a consequence that she won't enjoy.

I would leave the words for now - it's actually a more acceptable way of her dealing with her emotions than lashing out physically, and you can deal with that later. Right now you need to reassure that no matter what she says or does you love her absolutely and unconditionally. So she tells you she hates you/wishes she lived somewhere else? 'I'm sorry you're feeling so angry, I love you very much no matter what.' I always try to offer a hug, even if they've been massively hurtful.

I think it can be normal for them to adore their TA or teacher.

Her TA is an absolutely lovely woman, and looks like she could instigate world peace single handed.
However she's only dealing with her a few hours a day, among other kids, and not 24 7 with a hundred "I wants" that have to be resounded to with "I'm sorry, no" on an ongoing basis.

Besides I think people often treat people they know very well and whom they know are going nowhere worse than relative strangers. Familiarity, contempt and all that.

My cousins child behaves well for teachers, is possibly a pet, but absolutely gives her the runaround at home.

For hitting id have said we are leaving now and going straight home because you hit me, or no ‘x’ toy today when you get home because you hit me and that’s not kind. Tablet/lego/ doll whatever is important to her.

a chat in the car she will 100% forget. It needs to have impact on something she values. Short lived is fine, I only believe in fairly immediate consequences

in terms of the ‘I hate you’ at 5 it’s fairly normal boundary testing or something which has attracted attention/reaction on the past. A bored/nonchalant ‘well I love you’ whenever she does it should see her grow out of fairly quick.

I would say hitting is totally unacceptable and needs an immediate response - time out, toy taken away, no sweets or snacks for a day… telling them it’s wrong in words doesn’t work.

with the ‘I hate my mother’ - I’d always respond with ‘I love you no matter what’. As ‘mother’ is a word she usually wouldn’t use do you think she heard it on tv and is just trying it out?

I would try not to think of her as an ‘effing bitch.’ She’s 5. She is lashing out in the way she knows how.

I find the most effective response to this sort of behaviour is a sort of dull niceness. ‘Oh dear, that’s a shame that you’re saying that’ and move away whenever she says something unkind. If she says something like ‘I want to go home with my teacher’ I’d say ‘I love that you like Miss Johnson so much! But I’d miss you too much if you were with her all the time.’

As for hitting, I’d move her away and stop whatever activity is happening. So if she’s hitting because you put her iPad on the wrong video, move the iPad away and stop the activity. We can’t play iPad if you’re hitting/we’ll go home now from the fun day out since you’re hitting etc. And talk about it at a time when it isn’t happening.

When I say talk about it at a time it isn’t happening, I mean don’t try to get into a negotiation while she’s attacking you at soft play etc. Just ‘we don’t do that,’ then straight home. But next time you’re going somewhere fun, set the rules out ahead. You can buy one ice cream/sweet, and nothing else. Any shouting, hitting or bad behaviour and the day out will be over and we will go home to do some boring jobs.

Hurtful words I would ignore but hitting is an automatic time out every time.

By ignore I mean obviously acknowledge but don’t make too much of it

no ‘x’ toy today when you get home because you hit me and that’s not kind. Tablet/lego/ doll whatever is important to her.

It's her tablet. I'm going to have to test it out and see if it makes any difference to her "impulse control" thereafter. I'm worried it won't. The school have said they suspect she might have some asd traits. Could that explain some of it. Is the response the same, if so?

Today I had to get groceries after the playdate. . By the time that was done, and me speaking to her sternly in the car, time had elapsed and she seemed down in the mouth when we got home, so I cuddled her (she was visibly not herself) and then I thought it was too long after to go taking get tablet off her.

Some good suggestions here from pp.
I would add that if she is over reacting to being thwarted like this it might be worth making sure that she has a degree of control/choice in other things that are acceptable to you, so that you aren't the bestower or take away-er of all things.
So allow her to decide some stuff that is reasonable, like, do you want half an hour of TV now or play game with mummy... Or, do you want choice a or choice b for dinner.. Her call.
Then you aren't the gate keeper of all things, it might mean when you block a choice it has less impact on her emotionally.
But absolutely respond with love and boundaries. 'I hate you', gets response something like 'I'm sorry you feel like that now, but I still love you'.
Hitting you gets calm but firm consequence - 'this is unacceptable so if you do that you can expect me to... Take you home straight away/withdraw telly for the rest of the day... Whatever...'
But the consequences should be more or less immediate, and always follow through on what you say.
It is just a stage but you need to parent and manage her to lovingly guide her back to the right path.

Is she on her tablet often? I only ask because I’ve noticed (I work with children) kids who have a lot of computer and device use tend to have some issues around it. Usually, in my opinion, because they are addicted to instant gratification and constant stimulation.

I would try not to think of her as an ‘effing bitch.’ She’s 5.

I was expressing fairly humourous frustration - that clearly did not come across well in spite of the emoji.

Tbh though both of us do sometimes think she is - like many kids I suppose - utterly unaware of how good she has it, thinks we're her servants, and is like a mini tyrannical dictator requiring constant push back that can be wearying. Ive seen similar (and worse) from friends kids ... I've seen the "this is the worst day evvveeer" thing from them, and she did that today as well.

Worst day ever being one in which they are denied one thing having been entertained, indulged and bought stuff for the preceding 4 hours.

Did she get the ice cream?

And took the tablet away for the rest of the day.
Hitting is serious.
It needs a serious consequence so it doesn't happen again.
You feeling sorry for her as she was a bit sad isn't helping her.

Too many sweets can have a negative impact on moods. Headaches, grouchy, etc.

Maybe she’s just a bit overindulged? If she’s regularly having really fun days out and being bought stuff, she possibly doesn’t appreciate it. I so notice a lot of kids I know are constantly asking what’s next. Where are we going now, what are we having now etc. But that’s because they are genuinely always going places and doing stuff constantly.

So in that scenario id just say, when we get home there will be no tablet for the rest of the day because you hit me. When she inevitably asks for it later, I just keep upbeat and say ‘maybe tomorrow, remember I said no tablet today when we left soft play’. Don’t continue punishing or going over it but don’t give in.

then next time you feel she’s getting overwhelmed you can remind her that if she doesn’t stop xyz behaviour you’ll have to take her tablet away again.

money thing that’s helped us is I’ve always maintained the tablets belong to me & DH, therefore it’s ours to give/take away without any injustice ‘but its miiiiiiine’ a small thing but I swear it’s helped

But next time you’re going somewhere fun, set the rules out ahead. You can buy one ice cream/sweet, and nothing else. Any shouting, hitting or bad behaviour and the day out will be over and we will go home to do some boring jobs.

I came to this conclusion earlier too

I heard another Mum doing it at a playdate I organised for us.

My h thinks this is too much like threatening. I don't think I agree. It could be done in a boundaries type way. If she's prepared for what she will or won't get etc. it might work better.

*One thing not money

should really get to sleep, typos everywhere

No, there was no way I was getting her another ice-cream after her tub in the soft play (and a slushie), esp with dinner time looming.

I try to keep her on fruit juice and healthy ish snacks. As a result if she gets sugary and sweetener filled stuff, it seems to make her go hyper.

But I felt like it wasn't fair to expect her to sit with a juice when the other Mums were getting their kids slushies.

I think you can use this on a positive way. So we’re going in to soft play - ‘this is going to be so much fun- you can have an ice cream or a slush while we’re here, you decide which one and let me know’. Nothing threatening in there

(She saw a other child (not in our group) getting an ice-cream, which she loves, and she asked me for one. I thought it would a nice idea to get the 3 playdate kids a little tub (really only a scoop) each. ... Maybe it was too much on top of a slushie.

I get the internal sweary-ness as the dark humour it was.
Lack of gratitude is not something I accept either. If my two ever express dissatisfaction for the one blip when they've had plenty of nice-ness day, they get an eyebrow raise with a 'so the xyz counts for nothing then!? Not sure I'll be wasting my time next time then if you don't appreciate it' type thing. Followed by, 'I see you're disappointed at this one thing, but don't forget the rest or you'll be allowing it to spoil your day when actually it's been a good day on the whole hasn't it'
Or something along those lines. Rejecting the negative narrative but wrapped in empathy.

Do you think she might find soft play overwhelming? Does she usually hit when she is hyped up? It might be worth keeping things more low key?

I agree everyone takes their anger out on those closest to them.

I would do rewards too for good behaviour. We used to do jar of marbles with various treats per 10 marbles.

Maybe restrict tablet too. Mine are only 13 & 14 but didn't have any tech at that age.

Spotting her triggers is a good thing, because if she can't be her best self because she's on a sugar rush then she's set up to fail and she won't feel good about herself deep down.
My DD was horrible at that age if not fed at regular intervals, we used to joke she was like a gremlin from the gremlin film. We had to take snacks everywhere (apples usually) or it was asking for trouble. We would have to persuade her to eat while she was adamant she was fine even as she behaved like a total horror. 10 minutes after she ate she would calm right down and agree without any opposition or anger that yes, she had been hangry after all. ☺️
She's 10 now and still can't be her best self if it's been too long since she ate but she does at least accept our recommendation to eat something without resisting now as she has enough experience to know we're right, took a good couple of years to start getting that cooperation though.