Good but unloving marriage. How normal is my situation?

[BearKey]

Happy new year all.

I'm new to MN so apologies I don't know all the acronyms, or if I'm posting in the right group. I am interested to see how many of you are in a similar situation me and I should be grateful for what I have, or feel like there's a bit more to life.

My DH and I have been married 15 years. We have 2 school age children and a lovely home. He is a good man, a good father and a partner with household and kids stuff but he's not remotely romantic, or particularly loving, and can be quite thoughtless because he's just not someone who is thoughtful of others or puts him self out to make others happy. This is the opposite of me who is always trying to make others happy, often to the detriment of what I want or need.

On the surface we have a good marriage and a lovely family and life, but underneath there's hardly any romantic connection going on, we are more or less friends, co parents and housemates. We are intimate rarely, and although we do go on a date every few months, even that's not really romantic and feels a bit forced. Neither of us have a particularly high sex drive so not massively bothered about the lack of that side of things, but I would very much like our relationships to be more loving, and to feel like I'm actually cherished and loved rather than a mate.

My question is, how normal is my situation? Should I just be grateful for what I have and get over the 'romantic view' of what a marriage should be. He is a good man and I don't want to break up my kids happy home. Or is there more to life and I'm missing out on something by staying?

I have discussed this with him a couple of times, and he makes a bit of an effort for a while, but it's just not in his nature so he falls back to normal soon after. I have half arsed suggested counselling but not to any serious level, and we couldn't afford it at the moment anyway.

Thoughts?

Is this just a love language issue?

Two (or three) pronged attack. Explore love languages as pp suggests, so you can value the ways he is showing love in his ways, and so he has a clue about your love language (disclaimer I have no idea about love languages). Invest in and develop your self and your knowledge of what you do that makes you happy and fulfilled. And then look at how you can develop close platonic bonds and connections with friends or social groups that will fulfil your needs more widely. You are not unreasonable to question it and leave if you wish to, but it seems that you have the potential to be happier in what is a set up that has a lot going for it. But you might need to look inside yourself to get it, I think a lot of development in post kids years is about the relationship with the self not others.

I am going through this and am on the verge of leaving. We are at the point where there is nothing left between us. He has withheld all affection and intimacy and it's destroyed my self esteem. Maybe it's normal but life is short and I long to be cherished.

I'd have a look at attachment styles before love languages. Sounds like anxious attachment and avoidant attachment. I'm not an expert by any stretch of the imagination but maybe have a Google and see if that relationship dynamic resonates with what you experience. HTH

It will be pretty common I think. Many couples have relationships with little to no sex. I think I read that more than 20% of couples now have what is classed as a sexless marriage and this rises to 35% in the over 50’s age group. What it doesn’t say is whether they also have no physical affection, because that is what you are describing and want rather than the sex.

I am not sure how to get your DH to change. I think people are what they are and it’s hard to change them. Would he think a hug or perhaps holding your hand might be misconstrued as him wanting sex and he doesn’t want that?

You can only solve problems by communication or by making changes yourself. It is not easy breaking up a family home and starting again. I’ve been through it and financially it’s very difficult and emotionally hard too. I would have thought in this economic climate it will be even harder.

I suppose it boils down to how much you crave affection? I always thought I had a very low sex drive but when I started over and met someone I really connected with, I found I had a relatively high sex drive.

Invest in and develop your self and your knowledge of what you do that makes you happy and fulfilled.

I think this is the answer for many .

I am sorry you are going through this.

When you ask "is it normal" do you imply that if many couples are in this situation you shouldn't do anything about it?

What matters is that it makes you sad.

As someone mentioned earlier, you need to open more lines of communication. Give it your best try and see if you can move him. Maybe he too feels like you do but doesn't have the words or courage to mention it.

I was in a marriage with no affection and just got used to it but found it so sad seeing other couples being affectionate out just thoughtful of each other. I did not c want to break up the marriage too the x children let uni but in retrospect I should have done because they had unhealthy role models.

I don’t know if “normal” is the right word, but I believe your situation is pretty common.

Personally I’d recommend forking out for a couples therapist if you can afford it. I’m a bit skeptical of the attachment types and love language stuff. It seems people often get into these ideas but they serve mostly to obscure the problems couples have, as they are really not much more than analytic descriptions, rather than solutions. And the problems you have need solutions, which will be extremely specific and personal to the individuals involved.

Happy New Year to you too op
i wouldn’t leave in this situation - to go from a stable loving home to an unknown for the children (well not yet anyway)

but what shouts out to me is you are putting all the work into making him happy so put yourself first I think - build your own life and happiness

only you can decide. I am married a similar amount of time with primary dc and it’s not all romance and dh isn’t out there with his feelings but he shows it on different ways and I know if I ever need him he would be there 100 percent. I think life is just like that.

you could leave and meet someone else but then you might have other problems (taking on step kids or that man might be a gambler or whatever) life will never be perfect.

If neither of you is bothered abotu the lack of sex then I would look ast how to foster the friendship side of your marriage. i think a lot of long, strong marriages thrive on excellent friendship - the soul mate aspect of a good marriage. To do that I think you need to engage in joint projects that excite you both. Can be anything from house renovation to travel to running a marathon. And joint hobbies.

One of the things that cements our marriage is DH and I really enjoying the same pastimes - we love theatre, live music, art exhibitions so we are always charging into the kitchen excitedly tellking each other about the latest show we'd love to see, or booking things secretly or treating each other.

What mutual interests did you have when you were dating that you could rekindle?

V common. Women get trapped because they have kids and can’t afford a decent life for them on one salary. Otherwise a dick like this would swiftly be dumped.

And the reason you don’t have sex etc is because he doesn’t bother to be a kind loving person who cares about you. Nobody is inclined to have sex with someone who is unsupportive and unloving.

What do you get out of this relationship now?.

Your situation is common in unloving marriages. Why are you two together?.

Unloving marriages are not good marriages at all; what you're describing here is you both showing a poor relationship model to your children. What do you want to teach them about relationships and what are they learning here?. Would you want them to have a relationship and or marriage like yours, no you would not. You're showing them that a happy relationship and or marriage is not their birthright. Its actions that matter, not words. Telling our children they deserve healthy, respectful, and loving partnerships isn’t taken to heart if we don’t have the courage to live up to our own words.

If we want our offspring to have joyful and successful relationships, we need to provide them with the best example we possibly can. Living in mediocrity or worse burdens children with very confusing messages about relationships and happiness. I also think your children know far more about the parlous state of your marriage than either of you would care to admit; they are not daft and do pick up on all the vibes, both spoken and unspoken, between you and he.

Re your comment:
"This is the opposite of me who is always trying to make others happy, often to the detriment of what I want or need."

Why has this happened?. What about your own happiness here, do you not matter?. Of course you matter. What you're describing here is people pleasing behaviour which you really do need to address now in therapy. Such behaviour often arises from wanting to parent please difficult, prickly or otherwise emotionally absent parent or parents. I would also think your H has taken full advantage of your people pleasing behaviours too.

I doubt very much that he would actually sit in front of a therapist or counsellor and if he refuses go on your own even if you state you cannot afford it (many places operate sliding scales of fees). You need to talk in both a calm and safe environment.

Better to be on your own than to be so badly accompanied.

It is not easy to leave. For example fear of him, fear of the unknown, not wanting to be alone, potential money problems etc are but four of many reasons why many remain. However, it is really a damn sight harder to stay and the children won't say "thanks mum" to you for doing that to them either. They could call you daft for staying and wonder of you why you put him before them. No obstacle to leaving is ultimately insurmountable.

Does it feel unloving, OP, or is it that it’s undemonstrative? If you do still feel affection for him and you feel it's reciprocated, that gives something to work with. If you feel there really is no love or respect there (however displayed) that’s another matter. And having young children is going to put the relationship on a more pragmatic basis because the focus is them rather than the relationship. It’s good that you do find time for each other occasionally. Has it always been more distant than you want? I agree with pp who have suggested looking at attachment styles - these tend to be set early in our lives and are based on our relationships with parents. We will tend to be attracted to people who repeat a pattern that feels familiar to us. It could be worth looking at your childhood as well as his to compare them. If you told him how you want things to change and why, would he engage in couples therapy? Also, no reason at all why you can’t have some therapy yourself in order to explore your feelings.

On the surface we have a good marriage and a lovely family and life,

doubt it OP.

don’t kid yourself that your children will be oblivious to the cold marriage their parents exist in

and I don't want to break up my kids happy home.

your definition of a happy home is somewhat different to mine.

I am a single parent, and I suspect my home is a great deal more of a “happy home” than this

Dont be pulled in to the view that two unhappy parents together is better than two separate happy parents co parenting well together

The time to do the dumping is surely before you have kids? Before you even have a long-term relationship with men who don't fulfil your needs?

Some people are just not particularly romantic or thoughtful. As OP recognises you can't force people to change their nature. But at some point she overlooked it to get married and have kids with this guy.

The time to do the dumping is surely before you have kids?
Yeah but he’s not necessarily a dick before you have kids. When I was fit and healthy and not struggling, my relationship with my DH was fine. When we both looked after ourselves and there were no huge shared responsibilities for him to dump on me, we got on fine. Basically I didn’t need any support so I wasn’t annoyed about not getting it!

But as soon as I got pregnant and became unwell, he was unsupportive. When I had birth injuries and PND and I needed help for the first time ever, he was unsupportive. When someone had to get up in the middle of the night to look after our son, he wouldn’t. When we had to change our jobs and working hours to fit around childcare, he refused and dumped the entire burden on me. He’s constantly angry and resentful about anything he has to do for our son, and of course that wasn’t an issue when we didn’t have a son!

How would he react if you took the initiative and started cuddling, touching etc more often? Men often find this kind of thing awkward - I am a man and I guess my DW takes the initiative with cuddles etc far more often than I do. But of course I always respond as I know it is important to her and it keeps us close. Surely your DH could learn to do the same, it really isn't that difficult. Just saying it's not in his nature is a cop out and an excuse for laziness and lack of commitment on his part.

I would suggest that he isn’t going to change now, he’s tried and failed, so it’s for you to decide if this is how you want to live for the rest of your life.
There’s nothing wrong with companionship and security.

I could have written your post op. I've been with my my husband for 20+ years. There is another similar thread running and I've posted on that. I am feeling 'stuck' currently. Trying to get my thoughts straight. Dcs (also school age) and perimenopause compounding the situation.

I'm not sure I even get companionship but that is probably more to do with me feeling frustration and withdrawn in relation to the lack of connection I'm feeling. It's a sort of no fault thing. I've grown and changed for one thing. I feel I am not living an authentic life but fear jeopodising a sense of security and relative stability - for what?

This coming year, I plan to work on myself - expanding my interests/hobbies and hopefully social circle and working on trying to form more authentic connections with friends. This for me is the only way I see forward in this fog, I seem to be walking around in circles in it.

Watching your thread with interest.

I’m well ahead of you. Married 30 years and children all left school.
Several years ago I knew the marriage wasn’t right, resentment from daily alcohol and not doing anything about ED from antidepressants, along with peri menopause.
Ive been leaving for years, always an excuse not to, but every day and night feeling anxious about leaving. What will happen to me, will the kids hate me, will I see them, where will I live, what happens if I’m ill, will I be old and alone, on and on and on.
I would say from my experience that you move the goal posts continually. If he does ‘this’ it’s over, then he does and there becomes a new ‘this’ and it’s over. On and on, moving the goal posts but not jumping.
If you’re going to go do it now, don’t stay for the kids, don’t wait until they are out of education. It’s a waste of life and sex drive. I know.

If you’re going to go do it now, don’t stay for the kids, don’t wait until they are out of education. It’s a waste of life and sex drive. I know.

and pretty bloody shit for the children to grew up with two unhappy parents that essentially exist side by side

I think it's more common than you'd think.

We've been married nearly 30 years and we live as housemates in separate rooms. I'm not particularly happy with the lack of sex/intimacy (he doesn't seem bothered) but I'm not unhappy enough to go through the stress of a divorce and setting myself up in a new house because we don't really argue and we do have some common interests.

I do often wish I'd done something about it years ago though.