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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Would you contact the OW?

72 replies

Helena22 · 18/11/2022 13:53

I have posted in other chats about my finding out recently that DH has been having an emotional affair with a rep he knows from work. I am actually convinced it is more than just emotional and that (despite his protestations to the contrary) they have met up and spent time together. I have her email (work) and mobile number and wondered if there is anyone here who has been through similar and who has contacted the OW? I guess I just don't believe what he is telling me hence the reason for wanting to contact her but I am at the same time worried about what she will say and how I will feel about it.

OP posts:
SarahDippity · 19/11/2022 01:30

There is exactly zero to be gained from contacting her. The litany of gifts and affectionate gestures you have listed are things you are worried about over-reacting to. You are under-reacting. You are entitled to say this is not acceptable to you - because they clearly aren’t. What you need is a way to articulate this to your husband.

my experience, for what it’s worth, is I went to a counsellor (marriage counsellor - I rang and they told me there was a waitlist: I told them i was in crisis, and they found me a spot), and when I said everything out loud, over 2-3 sessions, I discovered the vocabulary I needed to speak to him. Here on MN, you will find the support and words you need to speak for yourself. You are being treated with abominable self-respect, and you have the power to end this awful hamster-wheel of self-doubt if you build the resources around you to speak out. Ducks in a row and all that … 💐

Dotcomma · 19/11/2022 01:48

Think of your own self worth and your children. Nobody wants to be the one to break up the family but you didn't do anything wrong, he's broken every vow and deserves everything he gets. Put yourself first, he's not the man you married, he chose to lie & cheat then got caught, then carried on. You'll never trust him again.

ExtraJalapenos · 19/11/2022 06:57

He gave her an 'anniversary of when we started to care for each other' gift to her?
How fucking insulting! To actually tell you these things, tell his wife about the gifts he bought his girlfriend. Jesus. Fucking. Christ. Can you not see what a disgusting vain twat he is?

No. Do not even think about bothering with this man. You don't need to know any more. He's cheated on you. Full stop. She means more to him than you do. Realise this, and serve this asshole some papers.

Sleepwhatsthazzz · 19/11/2022 07:40

Op your daughter knows, this is what changed it all for me. No matter what you want, it has now become you need to show your daughter how to value herself and what to out up with in future relationships. You need to walk to show her, that you and her are worth a hell of a lot more than what you have got this past 2 years.
Same scenario in family (not immediate) and family member told me recently, 20 years on she is so glad her mum left and set an example of what not to put up with, how to value herself and how to walk.
It is so so easy to preach though, when not in your shoes.
I do think it is different if children don't know, then it is more your choice and what you are happy to live with.
I wish you the best of luck and I am so sorry you are going through this. You sound so so lovely and do not deserve what either of these 2 put you through

Crazypaving22 · 19/11/2022 08:23

Don't contact the OW. They honestly think they're competing for (and winning) some sort of shiny prize! I've known plenty to twist the knife. Do not give her any relevance, she's craving that let's face it.

Your husband is the issue. He is lying. He is minimising. He is most likely still in contact with her.

When I first discovered a possible emotional affair I was told 'cheats have sex if they have any opportunity to be together', I hated hearing that but have found it since then to be mostly true.

You can not repair a marriage when you don't know what you're trying to accept/forgive/move on from. If you haven't checked out surviving infidelity their just found out forum would really help you right now. Just reading other stories might help you see how he's playing from the cheaters handbook!

Your reaction to all of this is perfectly normal. Finding out about an affair is a trauma. It raises PTSD symptoms including mind movies, anxiety, panic attacks, lack of appetite, insomnia, etc, so be gentle on yourself, healing time is 2-5 years. This is not easy. You may need individual counselling to help you manage.

As for your cheating husband if you're not ready to throw him out, if you're still confused that's just fine. But do seek legal advice, do get an std check and don't do any pick me dance. Surviving infidelity suggest a strategy called the 180 which you can Google and involves getting some emotional space to see more clearly!

I'm so sorry your husband is such a self entitled, selfish arse!

GravyDramas · 19/11/2022 08:31

You’ll never get what you want from contacting her. Whatever that is. You won’t get the full facts. You won’t get closure. Revenge by contacting her at work or exposing her won’t make you feel better or heal your marriage.

Its a tough situation to be in, but really you have all the evidence you need and now need to work out independently of your DH or this woman what YOU want to do next.

Wellitjustgetsworse · 19/11/2022 10:18

Isn't him celebrating an anniversary not enough proof that it was more than ego validation and a fantasy?

I'm in same situation as you and recently found out. I contacted her it made no difference to how I felt or gave me anymore information. It just made me spend a week obsessing over stuff that made me feel worse and more unsure.
I hope she would be able to give me more proof to get to the truth. But in reality she has nothing to gain by doing so unless she is scolded by it all.

I'm trying to get emotional space like others have suggested and it really helps you see things more clearly.

You cannot trust anything he says to you. You really can't. Try to see it for what it is. The anversery the Tiffany gifts. Your daughter seeing it and now being involved.

I just repeat it all over and over when I find myself having doubts. I always thought a one night stand and him actually having sex with someone would be the worst but emotional affair and in your case I bet it was more. Is way worse they lie not just once but everyday that they were doing it.

I think they compartmentalize where you're what they take for granted what they see as safe and the ow is shiny and new and just gets them. You can't compete with that mindset. Fantasy or not you have to try remember that he thinks it's okay to treat you like that.

He will have seen you loosing weight going out your mind but he still thinks it's okay to keep lying to you.

It is world shattering. I'm planning to leave. I know I can't or won't be able to trust him again.

All I see now is a compulsive liar and someone who is completely self serving without a moral compass that goes past his own feelings.

custardbear · 19/11/2022 10:31

Helena22 · 18/11/2022 14:31

She knows she is the OW. She also has a boyfriend of two years that she doesn't live with. And she had a fling (physical) with one of DH's colleagues before moving on to DH. So she is fully aware - when I confronted DH about it - she just said I am sorry.....hmmmmm

So she's shagging around, probably a lot of that's 2 people in the same company!
I've not finished reading the thread but I'd be writing to the CEO and head of HR with as many details as o could. Ask for FOI about emails and phone calls/messages to her electronics - let her squirm for a bit!

I'd also find the boyfriend and let him know

But that's just me!

ReneBumsWombats · 19/11/2022 10:54

custardbear · 19/11/2022 10:31

So she's shagging around, probably a lot of that's 2 people in the same company!
I've not finished reading the thread but I'd be writing to the CEO and head of HR with as many details as o could. Ask for FOI about emails and phone calls/messages to her electronics - let her squirm for a bit!

I'd also find the boyfriend and let him know

But that's just me!

FOI is for recorded information held by public authorities and there's nothing illegal about sleeping with or dating your colleagues. The trouble comes with associated risks such as harassment allegations.

And you might find yourself at the end of one if you start contacting people's workplaces, even going straight to the CEO, to make vexatious demands because you think they're cheating. It's not the job of employers to gatekeep people's sexuality.

You'll look absolutely deranged if you try this and they most likely won't even trouble your victim about it, except maybe to ask if they know who this loony is.

Wellitjustgetsworse · 19/11/2022 11:00

Yeah do not contact his work.. I feel you want to stay and make things work right now and that's completely natural response.

Have a plan B because you could wake up one morning and realise things for what they are.

You want to believe it was just a fantasy and your partner will help guide those thoughts you have by further minimising and lying to you. But deep down you'll know it's more it's why you can't eat or sleep well. Body's way of saying you're not safe in your environment.

rainbowstardrops · 19/11/2022 11:27

What exactly are you hoping to get out of contacting the OW? After reading your other thread, you seem fixated on finding out if it was sexual or not.
He's cheated on you for the past two years - whether that be emotionally or meeting for sex and yet you're still ignoring everything posters are saying!

Bottom line is, do you trust him now? Do you believe him? If the answer is no then you don't need to hear the sordid little details. You need a lawyer.

custardbear · 19/11/2022 12:02

Surely their work has policies about interacting with clients though! That's disgraceful if she's sleeping with different men from companies she's the rep for

ReneBumsWombats · 19/11/2022 12:17

custardbear · 19/11/2022 12:02

Surely their work has policies about interacting with clients though! That's disgraceful if she's sleeping with different men from companies she's the rep for

Unless it needs to be declared as a conflict of interest or it's professionally unethical (eg a doctor and patient), I can't see why. It's certainly not something for FOI. And it's a completely separate issue to sleeping with married men, who are solely responsible for their own commitments anyway. Happy to hear from employment law experts on this but it's all beside the real point.

If there aren't any rules against it then it doesn't matter how many men she shags and it's got nothing to do with OP's marriage.

KettrickenSmiled · 19/11/2022 12:42

Helena22 · 18/11/2022 14:22

I asked him to cut all contact with her when I found out but 3 months on and he still has her mobile number saved in his contacts.....and he will definitely be seeing her on and off at work.

That tells you all you need to know OP.

Don't upset or humiliate yourself contacting the OW.
You will be unable to trust anything she tells you, & all that will happen is 1) she tells H 2) they collude even further 3) he tells OW you are unhinged / controlling / sexless / some other invention & 4) H berates you for your temerity in contacting her & - oblivious to the irony, or the way cause & effect works - manages to blame your reaction to his affair as the reason he had to have it.

You are better off putting all your energy into protecting yourself. Finding a lawyer & making lists of the practical, legal & financial steps you will need to take when you decide you can no longer tolerate being duped & lied to.
Flowers

KettrickenSmiled · 19/11/2022 12:52

Helena22 · 18/11/2022 15:11

I keep questioning my judgement in all of this. What I know is:

He sent multiple gifts to her including flowers (including abroad when she was working overseas), champagne, chanel perfume, a tiffany's love knot necklace and gifts for events such as her birthday and their "anniversary" (which I am told was just the date when they realised they cared about each other). There were intimate messages with some of the gifts - my DD screenshot them after getting into his email account.

What I am confused about it whether I am over-reacting to all this. Whether in truth it was just a close friendship that became a bit of an escape/fantasy and whether this in itself justifies the strong reaction I have had to finding out. I am on meds, feel suicidal, struggling to work and going round and round in circles in my brain.

He has said he wants to stay and he is sorry (cue tears) but the trust is gone.

I also don't understand how she could do such a cruel thing knowing what we were going through as a family (son's illness and hospitalisation)....

Jeeze OP.

How angry are you that his fuckwittery exposed your poor DD to her dad's disgustingly upsetting 'secret' like this?

Those gifts are a fuck-me list. This is definitely more than an EA. He is spunking family money on his mistress.

You are already feeling suicidal.
Nothing OW says is going to help you with that, & you can't trust a word from her mouth anyway.
If you choose to believe your H's nonsense, & stay - what makes you feel that you will be able to stop going round in circles, struggle at work, or feel like ending it all?

I am so sorry your H is a cruel, shameless bastard.
This is your best medicine - CHUMPLADY!
She is honest, wise, compassionate & hilariously snarky.
Get stuck into the archives & learn from ChumpLady & her followers - you will find her a source of solid advice & support. Flowers
www.chumplady.com/archives/

Also see Pick-Me Dance concept.
www.chumplady.com/?s=pick+me+dance
You ringing the OW is a performance of the Pick-Me Dance. DO NOT DO IT.

Tillybobbins · 19/11/2022 13:23

No loving husband would do what he has done and continues to do to you. Would speaking to OW provide answers to help you understand, to overcome the shock of what you’ve learned, to establish a foundation upon which you can rebuild your marriage? No. She’s shameless and experienced in what she’s done.
Your husband is equally shameless. He lacks remorse, integrity and worth. Why value him, thereby devaluing yourself, and remain married to him? Forget the early stages: focus upon the destruction he has brought about in the last two years, his irresponsible and callous attitude. Block out what he says - concentrate upon what he’s done and the harm it’s caused you and your children. Absolutely nothing can excuse him.
You are confused, unwell, medicated, unable to sleep and deeply unhappy. Trying to rationalise or reason what has happened is prolonging your agony.
Act upon the advice given here and effect change.

PAFMO · 19/11/2022 13:27

Helena22 · 18/11/2022 13:53

I have posted in other chats about my finding out recently that DH has been having an emotional affair with a rep he knows from work. I am actually convinced it is more than just emotional and that (despite his protestations to the contrary) they have met up and spent time together. I have her email (work) and mobile number and wondered if there is anyone here who has been through similar and who has contacted the OW? I guess I just don't believe what he is telling me hence the reason for wanting to contact her but I am at the same time worried about what she will say and how I will feel about it.

No.
I'd send the shagging fucker to her with his dirty washing in a carrier bag.

inigomontoyahwillcox · 19/11/2022 13:29

I contacted the OW as I realised it was the only way I'd get the truth (I'd given "D"H enough opportunities to come clean, even in the face of irrefutable evidence). She didn't know about my existence - which the evidence corroborated - and I asked her as a fellow woman and mother to tell me what had happened, which she did.

Helena22 · 19/11/2022 13:33

inigomontoyahwillcox · 19/11/2022 13:29

I contacted the OW as I realised it was the only way I'd get the truth (I'd given "D"H enough opportunities to come clean, even in the face of irrefutable evidence). She didn't know about my existence - which the evidence corroborated - and I asked her as a fellow woman and mother to tell me what had happened, which she did.

Thanks - the OW in my case absolutely knew I existed. And knew my son had surgery….no conscience and no way of appealing to her as a wife and mother as she’s got form

OP posts:
ReneBumsWombats · 19/11/2022 13:44

Helena22 · 19/11/2022 13:33

Thanks - the OW in my case absolutely knew I existed. And knew my son had surgery….no conscience and no way of appealing to her as a wife and mother as she’s got form

You could say all the same things twice over about your husband. He knew you existed and that his son was having surgery. If there's no point trying to appeal to her conscience as a wife and mother, what hope have you with him as a husband and father, when the family in question was his own?

TigerCatTiger · 19/11/2022 14:45

Makes no difference in my opinion, she knows about you and she doesn't care, neither does your husband, you are currently on the outside and feeling like the outsider, a mug, sorry but I know what that feels like.

So many emotions you are trying to come accustomed to, betrayal, lies, dishonesty, shame, devastation and disloyalty, we know how fucking hard that is, it's pain beyond anything. You must feel stuck, not knowing way way to move for fear of making things worse or hoping things will suddenly make sense again and your husband will return to the sanity of the marriage.

Well there's a few things you need to accept, you will never feel the same again, even if he starts dong the right things or making the correct noises, this is the man you never knew, say hello to him. He is and was always capable of this type of hurtful behaviour to you, this is not a madness that has overcome him in middle age, this man is who he has always been.
Good men do not do this for they understand the pure visceral hurt it causes to a long standing partnersip, they would hate for it to hapen to them, it keeps good men from inflicting that sort of hurt on their partner.

So he has a lack of empathy, a cruel streak, a selfishness that makes him unable to understand your pain and for that you need to disengage, this man is unsafe in every way. Now you can sit there polaxed by this treatment or you can act, firstly try to eat, sleep whenever you can, you have been beaten up in a most vicious way by someone you trusted, even worse than it coming from a stranger.

This guy is showing no remorse, his doctor status has really pushed him up onto that superman platform, hasn't it, well you need to start viewing him through a different more realistic lens, he's a complete knobhead, and his friend is no better, both idiots with no sense of loyalty. How wonderful he is saving peoples lives and at the same time killing his wife, big shout out to the deluded mesiah.

Stop covering for him, all that hurt is being sucked up and directed back at yourself to protect his reputation, blow it up, your marriage is a sham, your life has become a sham yet he gets to walk around as though nothing has happened. Being proud and middle class does nothing for you here. Tell your family and friends if you have support there, phone her up, so what if she tells you nothing, it will probably make you angrier and give you strength, show her you don't give a shit about being polite and you are not going to be intimidated by silence, who cares if she laughs, you're beyond that.

Your anger will come, who knows what the outcome will be but by doing nothing and waiting for normaility to return will make you ill, go to a solicitor, get the ducks ready for the time where you may need them, then apply the consequenses, you must apply consequenses, the no sex, the withdrawl of family life and friendship with him, he is now a stranger, treat him so, disengage and dehumanise him, look at him like a piece of shit, he is not worthy of your time or attention, do not beg, ignor and ask him to leave if he will.

He has taken you down, now don't you give a fuck about bringing him down, maybe he will care, maybe not but life's not for covering up, secrets lies and pain in my opinion always need revealing, you'd be be surprised how many people actually look down on this type of behaviour and the type of men that do it, although the cool brigade will tell you no one cares. They do and others will judge him and his morals and he will hate to be judged, they say they don't care but they really do.

Mr Dr what a shame about him.

Stand up for yourself.
Flowers

Maryofthenight · 19/11/2022 15:00

Yes I had an 'important' husband, like this he was well respected amoungst his peers, he became close to someone so I thought I'd let others know.
I changed his whatsapp status picture to one of her which I found in his phone.
He was mortified, the questions, the looks and the paranoia was lovely, didn't seem on cloud nine like he did before.

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