I know the answer. He won't change, will he?

[AnotherCountryMummy]

DP has a history of lying about his ex wife. Over the past few years, I've uncovered multiple lies, or omissions of truth.

The latest being DP going for drinks with 'male friends' but inviting his ex wife along and not telling me. But also deleting messages so I don't find out.

So as not to drip feed, its not really a problem if she did attend these events. My main problem is the lying. Which I've made very clear when this has previously happened. But he seems to continue to do it.

He can't explain why. I don't think anything is going on. I suspect maybe he misses her socially. But he denies this.

I was home looking after the baby. He had multiple opportunities to tell me she attended. Such as the next day when we had a lovely conversation about the evening and I enquired who was there.

If I've made it plainly clear that I don't like being lied to and that it's not okay, but he continues to do it, he doesn't respect me, does he? He won't change? Should I end it? I feel like such a mug and so deeply hurt and disrespected.

I think he probably has unresolved feelings of guilt or disappointment. I think its probably too simplistic to suggest he has any real intention behind his behaviour. He is weak.

Inviting her on a boys night out is just very strange. No divorced man I know would invite their ex wife on a night out.

men are quite simple creatures - he clearly has a interest in her.

if you want this to work you draw your line in the sand and see if he crosses it again. I mean his boundaries are all over the place. Going to a school play with her yes but the pub nope!!!

I think he does have guilt issues around leaving her. I've seen her message him with some very guilt-trippy things and she makes him feel bad as a way to get him to do things for her.

Do you think he invited her out with old friends to ease his guilt by sort of doing a nice thing for her/including her?

Or am I just clutching at straws. Gahhh.

Absolutely this! I would never say a peep about him meeting her for child related things. I entered this relationship knowing he is co-parenting with her.

Inviting an ex to the pub with guy mates is beyond fucking weird in my view.

And lying about any of it is just absolutely unacceptable.

She does not have a partner, to my knowledge.

He did suggest counselling this morning. I suspect he just doesn't want another broken relationship with kids involved.

I think the ex accepting the invitation is also a bit strange. Plus, a group of guys on a boys night out and someone invites their ex wife?

He did suggest counselling this morning. I suspect he just doesn't want another broken relationship with kids involved.

As you have Dc together this may well be a good idea.

Yeah, right! That's if he even was with the boys. Maybe it was just her. I can't even ask the friends as it was his older friends, some of which I don't know. Rather than his local, mutual friends of mine.

Yes it probably is. I don't know whether he means couples or individual.

If you asked him why he invited her he is unlikely to say "because of guilt" he likely won't know why he invited her, so any reason he gives will sound disingenuous.

Again, I don't think he knows why, and there is no real rational intention behind his behaviour. He's just weak. He probably does have feelings for her, but he's unlikely to admit that to you, her or even himself. It seems he has regrets, but maybe he feels unable to go back and put things right. He can't. He now has a new partner and a new baby.

He needs individual counselling.

I don't know if this is important to you but do you think he will commit to you like he did to her?(marriage) as if not I would take that as either her meaning more to him , you not being able to replace her as a wife and he can't take that step with you as he is still hung up on her even though he left her or perhaps it could just be he doesn't want another failed marriage but It just sounds like he is still stuck in the past with her , if he invited her along for drinks with his friends that she knew when they were married then as far as I'm concerned if those friends want to see her, they could arrange that themselves without your partner being there... why is he so concerned for her to see them when you are his partner now so if anything he should want those friends to make a good friendship with you instead, that's even if he hasn't lied again and there was no friends there and it was just the 2 of them. You even encouraged him to go out whilst you were suffering with a bad back, that's throwing it back in your face ! You sound very reasonable and considerate over the ex and I disagree with the comment trying to put the blame over all this on you, this isn't you just being jealous or creating a fuss when he is with her or needs to be near her (e.g school plays) and the lying and covering things up isn't because he is scared of your reaction, Your feelings are completely valid and you are really not asking for much - just for him to be truthful with you which is really not difficult to be!

We did individual first both of us, with a view to doing joint afterwards with someone different. We never needed to do joint in the end. Understanding our own trauma and resulting maladaptive behaviours meant we stopped taking out, I guess, a kind of “ reactive trauma” on each other. I’d pretty much forgotten but my DH often used to have a friendship with a women where he would interact a bit weirdly. I didn’t feel he was at risk of having an emotional affair or cheating on me but I told him it would come across to other people like that (much as what you describe has come across to posters here). I couldn’t understand him or help him with it or get him to stop because it was impacting our relationship (which feels similar to where you are now). However he only needed 4 counselling sessions and it stopped immediately (different circumstances for us as we met as teenagers and were each other’s first relationship and it was never one particular women but I think it may be similar enough to what you describe that I wonder if root cause is similar). What my DH did was actually nothing to do with his relationship with me as his girlfriend and then wife, but to do with his relationship with his mother. Which is why it kept happening, I guess. As I say my DH only need 4 sessions to realise what was going on for him. He had no idea why he was doing what he was doing and didn’t know how to stop. As soon as he realised this was rooted in dysfunction in the parent/child relationship with him as the child in this, the problem remained but no longer impacted our relationship and he quickly used medium chill to handle his parents and this weird irritating, niggly behaviour stopped.

My issues are a lot more complicated and once I didn’t have him to blame for my pain, I got help and assessed as having something akin to PTSD because of a childhood where my primary carer had serious mentally illness that was only diagnosed and they were sectioned when I was in my teens.

There are 2 significant issues here, both of which are serious enough to (IMO) leave the relationship.

1. He invites his ex out when he tells you he's with his male friends. I expect no male friends were there (who invites their ex wife out their mates?). He did this when you had a new baby and were struggling with your back. He left you at home and went out with his ex. He's had conversations with her in secret, lied about those conversations and deleted messages. This all suggests he still has strong feelings for his ex or at least is having a fling or thinks it's on the cards. Why else would he do those things?
2. The lying. This is even bigger. Without trust there is no relationship. Whatever the subject matter of the lie, it means you can't trust him. It means he doesn't respect you and your relationship enough to think you deserve the truth.

And when you put the two things together - he's lying about spending time with his ex, and having secret conversations with her you're not party to. He is lying because he's up to no good, and he knows he's in the wrong. The only other explanation for the lying is that he's a habitual liar who can't help himself - but I couldn't live with that either.

You and your child deserve better. I think he's suggested therapy to appear contrite / kick the issue in to the long grass / convince you he'll change, or to use it to point out that you're controlling and he's frightened to tell you the truth or some such nonsense.

No amount of therapy will allow you to trust him again.

I know a man who does this. Sees his ex all the time but never tells his wife. They are not sleeping together or ever would. In his case its a fucked up way to take back some control of his life as he feels smothered by monogomy but doesn't want to cheat particularly. Its weird. I think he gets off on the excitement of having a secret. His partner is mad controlling though probably because he's a dick. He lies about lots of other stuff as well. It could well be something like this rather than wanting his ex back. Still not good though.

Triangulation perhaps? He knows you will very probably find out and be upset. You haven't had to dig around to find out about his meet ups. It seems calculated.

You havent been introduced to the mates but he’ll happily take the ex wife whilst you stay at home with his baby and need support yourself. Erm no.

his priorities need changing. He’s in a relationship with you. Not her.

he can coparent successfully without going to this level.

it feels deceitful and undermining of your family unit and relationship.

id set out what boundaries you feel should be in place and ask him to do the same and agree on a time to calmly discuss it together if he wants to save this marriage.