Is my H a narcissist.

[hewouldwouldnthe]

He does...

Cheat. how far this goes insofar as actual intercourse I don't know, but I know he is constantly chasing other women. I know he craves their admiration. This has gone on for 20 years.
He loved bombed me and asked me to marry him on the second date, saying later that all men would say that to get the girl to sleep with them.
Once reeled in he future faked me until I gave him an ultimatum, marry me or we're done, and we got married.
once married he continued to do what he wanted, enjoying his hobbies and friends and putting them over me and leaving me alone a lot.
Stupid me thought he would change when we had children, and as he'd never shown violent or temper issues, I thought we could still have a good life.
Rages started when I was pregnant. Totally out of the blue, 0-90 full on screaming episodes lasting up to 2 hours. sometimes pushing and waving his fist in my face.
Never apologised, never retracted the hurtful things, eventually refused to talk about it as it would set off the rage again.
Blames me for the bad marriage, tells me I am cold and distant. (I'm not)
Believes his own lies about me and genuinely believes he is my victim.

Had a bad childhood because he has ADHD and was just considered 'naughty' and punished physically and also told he was wicked.
Suffers with anxiety and depression.
Utterly self obsessed, everything is about him.
racist and mysoginist
Secretive.
Lies very convincingly, to the point I think he believes them
Gaslights me all the time
Thinks he should be the alpha male, despite poor job prospects and poor educational achievements.

Massive porn addiction, but pretty vanilla stuff.
Showed very little interest in his own children.
Massively overreacts to anything he regards as criticism.

However
He doesn't Have grandiose ideas that he should rule the world
can empathise with others pain and suffering, but 'feels' their pain as though it was him, so making it about him. Difficult to explain this.
He does feel regret about some of the behaviours in his past.
Has calmed down a lot and the rages are short lived and not as intense (helped by the fact I don't engage any more)
Loves his young grandson but still doesn't put himself out to do things with him.
His past rages were about 4-6 monthly and he was fairly normal in between. We did some fairly normal family things then.
He says his rages are set of by anxiety but he never tells me he is anxious. I think he is ashamed of this 'weakness'.
Not obsessed with body image.
Used to be a good lover, very giving and affectionate.

Happy to take his grandson to nursery and to help our adult children where necessary.

Chats to our DC and takes a genuine interest in their lives.

I'm not asking for advice on leaving etc, thats all in hand, but I want to know whether I took on someone who would never be a husband or partner and what exactly I was dealing with. He doesn't tick to full NPD boxes, and I basically want to know why he married me just to spend 20 years trying to destroy me.
I am seriously considering therapy.

I'm very glad to hear you are planning your exit after 20 years with this man.
When you begin to learn about people such as your husband, the penny really starts to drop. Narcissists come in many varying degrees but the the things they all seem to have in common is their inability to ever admit wrongdoings. Their refusal to ever apologise as they haven't done anything wrong. Their complete dedication to slowly destroying you and anything you know to be good about yourself. Its going to take a while but your freedom from this marriage will be the best thing you ever do.

Narcissistic personality disorder is a serious diagnosis to be made by a professional, not random internet people

Narcissistic personality disorder is a serious diagnosis to be made by a professional, not random internet people

Why don’t you watch Dr Ramanis videos about it? Do you actually know anything about the subject? She’s written many books and treats many people with it.

People are very rarely diagnosed as most narcissists aren’t suffering themselves, it’s the people around them who are! And you don’t get diagnosed based on how others feel about you. Most narcissists believe they’re completely fine and everyone else is the problem, so why exactly would they get treatment?

Fair enough, diagnose who you like.

I'm not looking for a formal diagnosis, only a psychiatrist can do this and H believes he is normal. I'm asking for other people experiences and if this behaviour ticks some of the narc boxes. He certainly does from what I've read but he doesn't have grandiose ideas, so more behaviours and traits, which is why I'm confused.

The Dr Ramani videos are amazing. So many bells ringing there, and so helpful.

Why op, why do you care? He’s not going to change simply because you’ve put a label on it.

stop focussing on him and start focussing on you

Why does it matter if he is or isn’t? He’s abusive, that’s all you need to know really.

To know someone behaves the way they do because they have a particular personality type is a form of closure. Its a reassurance after 20 years of gaslighting, that nothing I could have said or done would have changed things.

Knowledge is empowering and will give me confidence going forward.

Is it preferable to walk away with years of confusion still echoing round your brain, interfering with new relationships and causing anxiety and depression? Or is it better to understand and eliminate them from your thoughts?

It matters.

Oh ffs, I could go on you tube and tell you a whole range of stuff, and I actually have qualifications to do so, but doesn't mean it's real. For every you tube video that you can agree with, there'll be one that contradicts it. It's like a broken clock gets it right twice a day and horoscopes are vague enough to be able to relate to.
The guys a prick. Stop trying to label him with a condition that eliminates any sort of responsibility for his own behaviour. He is just a prick that you've put up with for too long, sorry

My mind is indeed totally fucked with it all and I just need to understand it wasn't me

When you understand that this is about you, not him, you will be free. When you understand that understanding him is not the key to this, you will be free.

Is it preferable to walk away with years of confusion still echoing round your brain, interfering with new relationships and causing anxiety and depression? Or is it better to understand and eliminate them from your thoughts

It's best to realise that this isn't about putting a name on the ways the two of you were incompatible, and that it's more about you recognising that you can put someone out of your mind and your life without having what you feel to be a conclusive psychoanalysis of them. Whilst trying to name his pathology, you focus on him. What was he doing? Why did he do this? What is wrong with him.

Falling victim to this kind of abuse rests on self doubt. Someone saying you're x/y/z doesn't hurt you unless you think they might be right. Somebody saying it's all your fault doesn't hit home unless you think it might be. The self doubt is what's making you ask us, now. You think he's probably a narcissist, but you can't believe yourself; you need back up. The mindset that kept you in such an unhealthy relationship is the mindset that's posted today. The mindset you need is not 'Ah, he's definitely a narcissist, loads of people said so, so I can put it all behind me now.' It's more like 'I'm putting that all behind me, because he was too narcissistic for my liking'

It's not about what he is. It's about you, and your boundaries, and what you put up with, and how you allowed yourself to be abused.

@baileys6904 I'm not for one second absolving him from his own behaviour. He and no one else is responsible for it. Understanding it though, is important. Not the label, but the behaviours. Now I can see the behaviours are abnormal, not me. Now I can see he has cheated on me throughout, instead of burying my head in the sand and ignoring the signs. I'm also good friends with his brother and he's also (with a bit of arm twisting) told me some shocking things about H behaviour in the past re other women.

Last night he came to me because his arm was bleeding from a cut and he needed my help with a dressing. He used a tone of voice I've not heard in years and it shocked me to see what a powerful hold it had on me after all this abuse. It was the voice he used to reel me in, loving, confiding, vulnerable. I can see how he uses this technique on other women. Of course, after the initial shock I just put a plaster on and said nothing.

It is important to know the truth and process abuse. I need to understand him and myself. Queues for counselling are a mile long.

@Watchkeys Sadly when I met him I was young and naive so had very few boundaries. It was my first real relationship. I would never allow what I allowed here and the reasons I did were long and complex. A lot absolutely to do with my lack of esteem.

@hewouldwouldnthe a huge amount of awareness it what you just posted 👍

OP, when a big thing with scales and pointy teeth is trying to eat your leg, you don't stop and try to work out if it's an alligator or a crocodile. You just get the fuck away, as fast as you can.

I understand your urge to understand his pathology, but it's an attempt to gain some illusion of control over the situation. You cannot control him, you didn't cause his behaviours and you can't cure him.

All you need to concentrate on is getting you and your DC away from this horrible prick. I can tell you one thing for definite - you will all blossom away from him

But you’ll still live with him. Be with him OP. And he won’t change.

how on earth is that “closure”?

I still believe I have to understand him, to understand myself and why I tolerated it for so long. I don't want to repeat the same mistakes, or allow him to haunt my thinking for any length of time. I want to be free completely and I know I need to be indifferent to him.

I'm 80% there but just need that last amount. I don't want to hate as that damages me, and at the moment I do hate him.

I did have a decree Nisi issued a few years ago, but he reeled me back in with lies and false promises. Before I set all that off again, which I will do, I want to ensure he doesn't pull the same trick twice.

I know he has a lot of power over me, not with the rages etc, but when he apologises and becomes the person i fell in love with. Even though I know its an act.

I hear you, hewouldwouldnthe, do what you need to do

Understanding it though, is important. Not the label, but the behaviours. Now I can see the behaviours are abnormal, not me

So why does it have to have a name? Why does it have to be 'abnormal' for you not to like it? Healthy boundaries aren't to do with whether you're responding to a 'normal' behaviour, or whether you are 'normal'. The problem in your relationship with him wasn't to do with whether his behaviours were normal or not. The fact is that you put up with behaviour that you didn't like. Recognising that is the key to closure for you, and the key to healthy relationships and boundaries for you in the future.

We all do some things in unusual ways. Being 'different' and 'original' is regarded as good. Unless you want a relationship with Mr Normal, then him doing things in a way that isn't normal will be a plus point, but only if you like it. What you think is normal won't be the same as what I think is normal, and your next door neighbour will have a different set of normals, too. And your H has his own set of normals. He's allowed to. Unless we break laws, we are all allowed to do/feel/treat people however we like. Normal isn't a thing. Compatible is the thing you're looking for. Unless he's broken laws, all you can do is accept responsibility for hanging around someone who made you feel shit for so long, and resolve to stay away from other people who make you feel shit in the future. There is no over-arching authority to tell you 'He shouldn't have done this/that/the other'. There are no shoulds.

I know he has a lot of power over me

You are in charge of this. He has the power over you that you give him. No more, no less.

It just sounds like a delay tactic to me OP

On this thread alone, you seem to have all the insight you need to see how lifeless your marriage is. Worse than that actually.

I had hypno-psychotherapy after a long relationship with a probable covert narcissist who sounds a lot like your H. It cost me about £100 per session but frankly was worth every penny, however, I live in an expensive place so it may well be cheaper where you are.

I desperately wanted closure and knew that my ex-H would never be able to give that because he was the angry victim of my evil machinations (despite being a cheat and a liar and finally having an affair with a woman 21 years his junior who worked for him)!

The best thing that the therapy did was give me closure and a level of acceptance that there was nothing I could have done to change him or his behaviour towards me and our daughters.

Why do u have to understand it?? Some people are arseholes. Some are not. There doesn't have to be a mental condition behind each one that isn't. Hitler could be described as a narcissist. He was never diagnosed as such though or with any other mental illness. However he was just a very evil person.

You seem to be romanticising the fact that your husband has been abusive and cheating on you for years and yet you continue to allow it. Perhaps stop focusing on him and his behaviour and look at yours and believing in your own value and importance. Speak to women's aid, other women's charities and support services. You're worth so much more