Role of dh in my anxiety and how best to move forward

[Flippinghecklike]

I will try to cover this as quickly as possible whilst including all the most relevant details to avoid drip feeding. I am partly sharing to figure it out in my own head and partly for advice.
My husband is a good man. He is kind, he is intelligent, he works hard in a job he hates to provide and he is the best father I know. Domestically, he is neither practical (to the extreme - think putting dripping wet jumpers back hanging in a tight packed closed wardrobe when I once asked him to hang out a wool wash) nor particularly interested, but does every school drop off and bedtime. We both work full time, and I do all school collections all meal planning, shopping and cooking, laundry and putting away, kids admin like calendars, presents etc and all the cleaning. We did have a cleaner at the start of the first lockdown who we kept paying but she moved away so we have not had a cleaner in years til this week. I wanted to get a new one but he said we couldn't afford it which we probably couldn’t and still probably cant. The problem is I have to leave for work at half six each day and dont get back til after six with the kids so am often ironing or cleaning when he goes to bed and often leave before he gets up.
Typically I am quite cheerful and I have also been worried about him as he has hated his job so much and I havent wanted him to be even more stretched so initially got on with things. Periodically and increasingly so though I have raised this and the need to share the load more, telling him I am tired and not coping. I only do this when I really feel I am not coping and sometimes end up crying and I think probably sound like I’m just having a bad day. Either way, it never changes anything - he agrees, makes a general commitment, does some more for a bit then it just slips back. Anything to do with what the kids or we are doing when goes into a calendar on the wall and our shared google calendar and he will still ask me details several times which doesnt sound so bad but just feels like more work and less responsibility for him. He took our son to the wrong pool for his first new set of lessons - he has only ever had lessons at one pool and I still don’t understand how that happened. He got us tickets for my favourite band but we missed them because he missed several emails about the change of date. More often than not if he has a business trip or trip with friends he will ask me where his passport is and I will find it but feel responsible for not checking he put it in the usual place when we last came back. I generally feel if I haven't triple checked everything there is a significant chance things will go wrong if I am not in charge and I dont want it to be like this.
Ive been getting more upset more often and since jubilee weekend think it is likely I would be described as mentally unwell. I have a history of health and generalised anxiety and I am currently hugely worried about some issues I am desperate for help with but he is in a v difficult position as he isnt supposed to let me reassurance seek or fuel the fire. Even so, unless I sit him down and beg him to talk to me about the plan for addressing the mental health stuff if not the physical things I am scared about he doesnt really. It cant be much fun or easy being married to me, but one of the exercises I recently did for the therapist I am seeing was a questionnaire about essentially having an inflated sense of control and responsibility that fuels the anxiety. The problem is, I dont feel I have a choice but to feel responsible for everything- I manage our finances, everything in the house, my job which I am increasingly crap at, my mental health, everything the kids need. I cant work out if it is a legitimate objection or the anxiety being crafty as it is to say “i do need to take responsibility for investigating all my health worries because how can I only be worrying because of an inflated sense of responsibility and simultaneously be trusted to be responsible for everything else despite asking not to be repeatedly.”
This weekend I went away for one night for my best friend’s son’s christening and he stayed with the kids. It was lovely but I am on new anxiety meds and generally “not myself” so found it exhausting. He called in the afternoon, absolutely cheerfully not demandingly but checking when I was back after I had told him many times and mentioning he needed to do a work call but could sort it. When I got back I tried to explain I felt he was implying I had made it hard for him to do the work call but he said he was just thinking out loud. I couldn't stop crying and think just gave the impression I was having an anxiety episode but he didn't engage really- he gets stressed when am like that and clams up.
I have an appt with a specialist today that I am so scared about. I am scared almost all the time and am desperate not to be but cant find the rational space between taking responsibility for my health worrries vs my mental health worries and have some no doubt unhelpful residual feminist resentment about wholesale accepting it is just all mental like others seem to think when that goes against my instincts and I am not only trusted but expected to be exceptionally responsible in every other area of our life.
I cant see how we move forward when every time I express what I think are sensible concerns I can be gently ignored as hysterical, or how I can move forward with a mental health problem, which I really hope is a mental health problem not the various physical things that terrify me, whilst this marriage is this way.
Does any of this make sense? Does anyone have any advice? X

Oh you poor thing, I'm not normally like this but I wish I could give you a hug.

Get the cleaner back, it sounds like you absolutely need one. Tell your DH he gets a voice when he does 50% of it.

I'm also not one for armchair diagnosis but it does sound as if your DH may be neuro diverse and the lack of organisation and inability to remember anything could be beyond his control- especially as it manifests in things that also impact him like missing the concert.

As for the rest, gosh it sounds like you need a proper break. Is there anyone else that could look after DC for a couple of nights like GPs ?

I think your H is not a good man at all and you'd be all better off without him in your lives day to day.

The phenomenon of shirking unpleasant tasks by pretending not to be able to do them has come to be known as weaponised incompetence, or strategic incompetence. Weaponised incompetence shows kids that even though there’s two parents in the home, only one (you) is trustworthy and reliable. And it shows kids what all kids have to do to get out of what they don’t want to do, as well as what they should allow and do in their future relationships. Do not let this be their legacy from you to them.

He does not behave at all like this at work and its for you that this is all directed at. Hence all this undermining crap he pulls about putting wet jumpers back into a wardrobe, his behaviour re his passport after returning from a business trip, missing the date to see your (note your) favourite band or taking his child to the wrong pool. He's doing such things so badly so he does not get asked to do this again. You are basically responsible for everything because he put you in that position. All this man cares about is his own self and getting his own needs met. He has basically opted out of family life and does not care about any of you. You will never be able to move forward with someone like this also because he likes things the ways they are, he is as happy as a clam.

What sort of specialist are you seeing today?. I would also think you would not need so much, if any, anxiety medication if he was out of your day to day life permanently. Giving you spaghetti head too is par for the course with such abusive types. You, and in turn your kids, are being abused here by this man and it would be a very good idea for you to contact Womens Aid.

Sounds like ADD to me. He’s putting all his effort into work and somehow thinks you’ll hold the rest of it together. It must feel soul destroying.

Thanks for your support. He does behave like this at work unfortunately- i have been really worried about him being fired because of it increasing my sense of a need to limit what else he has to manage.

I have wondered about neurodiveristy - but he has no other traits just a deep and genuinely astonishing lack of or lack of interest in developing practical skills.

He is just fundamentally unobservant and not one to hold a thought in his head more than momentarily so it just doesnt register or stay registered how much more I do. I love him and I dont want to leave him and he is so so good with our kids but I do think I am slowly losing my mind, not because of this as I have a disposition to poor mental health already but exacerbated.

This man (or whoever else you are sharing chores with) knows how to wash dishes. They know how to vacuum the floors. They are capable of remembering that Thursday is bin day. These are not complicated tasks. Even if a person is genuinely new to household chores, we live in a golden age of information; all of us have instant access to a wealth of blogs, articles and video tutorials that will teach us any household skill we need to know. If a person is genuinely making an effort, it does not take years to learn how to separate laundry or figure out which cupboard the plates are kept in. It’s true that most people will be better at certain chores, or prefer certain chores. But a partner (or anyone else) who claims to be hopelessly bad at everything they dislike is putting on a show. He is doing this because he can and it works for him. It gets them the outcome they desire, which is other people taking over their responsibilities for them. Having other people think you’re clueless is a small price to pay if it means you get to do whatever you want while others scramble to cover your responsibilities.

There is a big difference between someone who wants to pull their weight but gets distracted halfway through a chore, and someone who does a bad job on purpose so no one will ever ask them to do chores again. A person with ADHD may need more reminders and take more time to do chores (or any other tasks), but they produce high-quality work. People with ADHD also tend to be aware of their issues with task management, and work on strategies to overcome it. People weaponizing incompetence will simply insist that they are hopeless and see no point in trying. It is possible for a person with ADHD to use weaponized incompetence intentionally, but this is different than their own inherent struggles with executive functioning.

Stop saving him from his responsibilities and stop tolerating it.

He sounds as if he has ADD, which is difficult for him and you to live with, and I have no doubt this is fuelling your anxiety.

Not sure what you can do, other than strip back your responsibilities to the minimum- drop the ironing for a start, and get a cleaner. Get him involved in the meal planning, get a repeat shopping order which will be his job to put away. And don't sweat the small stuff/ it's annoying if he gets the wrong swimming pool but not catastrophic.
I have an adult son with suspected ADD, and a DH who often forgot to pick up DC from school, who would go out leaving the front door open. It was very hard. All I can suggest is think carefully about what jobs he can do that don't require input from you- hoovering or cleaning bathroom weekly for example. Put it in the calendar. Get him to set alarms on his phone, but try not to remind him ad that makes it your responsibility.

How do you know he behaves like this at work?. Do you think he is behaving so incompetently at work so that people like you as his wife eventually give up on the idea of him working at all?. He has done a right number on you here.

Why do you think he is good with your kids?. I am certain that as the years pass if you remain with him they will learn that you are the competent one whilst he still sits there pontificating. What sort of relationship model is being shown to them here?.

You may well love this man but he does not love you; if he did properly love you he would be treating you and in turn his children like he is. He does this because he can and it works for him.

The specific question at the heart of this I think is this. Let’s assume I am mentally and not physically unwell. (I have acute and what seem to me very credible fears that I am physically unwell but for sake of argument let’s say it is all in my head.) How can I get better from a mental illness fuelled by an inflated sense of responsibility and need to control everything whilst in this marriage / life. I know DH would say I can leave things and he will do them and he might but it all mounts up so quickly with two small kids who play outside every day so get through clean clothes daily and plates from every meal in the sink etc. I have tried leaving it but he doesnt do it for days at which point it’s all a bigger harder job. I think he thinks I should relax my standards, but as it is things are hardly pristine, it’s an hour or more of work a day doing the basics really.

@AttilaTheMeerkat he tells me his feedback from his boss who finds him flippant and careless with details he considers unimportant but that she values… it sounds familiar :)
he plays so well with the kids - inaginative games, has so much time for them and they adore him. He really is good just ultimately sort of not a partner and that is the issue :(

In the short term I'd do whatever made your life easier. So get in a cleaner, send out ironing, buy a robohoover etc. Yes it costs money, but unless it leaves you unable to pay the bills then I think it's a price worth paying for now.

Go through the list of tasks and see what can be done to make each easier, I'd work on the assumption that I'd be doing them all myself as that would be less stressful than assuming your DH is going to do anything.

Is there any way to play to his strengths? Could he take the DCs out for several hours at the weekend so you can blitz the house work? I know it should be more even, but short term it seems like getting into a bit of a sustainable routine might help you feel a lot better.

Practical things: get a cleaner, cut back elsewhere if necessary (pref on something that affects him most). You can't afford not to have one.
Cut back on jobs that don't affect you. He does his laundry from now on.
Give him more responsibility w the kids as he seems more capable of doing those. He does all the chauffeuring. Doesn't matter if he got the wrong pool once.
Lower your standards a bit. Anxiety goes hand in hand with thinking that things must be done perfectly or the world will end. Its a form of trying to control the anxiety (won't work just feeds it).

He's likely practising being strategically incompetent at work also to dodge his responsibilities there. He's also doing this so that people like you as his wife eventually give up on the idea of him working at all when he gets fired.

Your kids may "adore" their dad but they will over time indeed see how little he actually does with them. As it is he's doing drop offs and bedtime (both are short tasks in terms of time spent on them). He's being a Disney Dad with them whilst you're doing all the other stuff. Does he really have so much time for them; as they get older their needs will change and I doubt very much he will want to at all attend parents evening or help them with a task like getting their stuff organised for cookery class in secondary school. He will indeed leave that all to you.

He's already taken his son to the wrong pool and your kids will further see his incompetence in action.

I think all this is sensible. We do have some money worries but can manage. I am going to take this to the therapist to see what he thinks.

"Go through the list of tasks and see what can be done to make each easier, I'd work on the assumption that I'd be doing them all myself as that would be less stressful than assuming your DH is going to do anything".

There is really no point in having him around at all if this is how he is going to be. He is capable of doing such things, he does not want to do anything. He's already objected to OP having a cleaner because he states "they cannot afford it". The OP's anxiety is already through the roof; he is making her ill through his incompetence.

It doesn't really matter whether he's neurodivergent or not. He doesn't try to change to pull his weight. He is all talk. Why isn't he in therapy to learn some practical strategies to make him an equal partner?

I actually think you are fundamentally incompatible and staying with him will continue to feed your beliefs that you need to hold it all together, because quite frankly it sounds like being with him, you do!

I am married to someone like your DH. He is generally incompetent with everything, including work. Thankfully all he has to do is drive from point A to point B for a living so can manage that. He leaves doors unlocked, keys in doors all of the time. Always forgets something. Usually his wallet.

We reached a crisis point in our marriage a few years ago when I was in a pretty similar position to you, on the verge of a nervous breakdown from doing everything. I was ready to leave him, well make him leave actually. I told him factually that he didn't do anything anyway, so he might as well not be there. I think what brought it home for him was when he asked what would we do about things, I had a well thought out answer for everything. He knew I was serious.

We met somewhere in the middle. He upped his game and I lowered my standards. You really do need to let things go to shit to be honest and let the shit hit the fan. You need to let him pick up the pieces though as well. If he has forgotten something, he goes back and gets it etc. DH does more housework and chores. He doesn't do them to my standards TBH but then I don't think if I had a cleaner they would either. But generally he has his shit together a bit more now. There are still things that go wrong, but I am also better at accepting they're not the end of the world. For instance, my eldest is going into school today in his PE shirt because DH didn't do the ironing yesterday. But it doesn't matter really.

Only you can decide what you want to do and what's best for your family. But no matter what you do, there will be an element of having to let go and letting things fail. Either if DH stays with you and doing more or if he leaves and has the kids alone. You need to decide what is best for you. I guess it also depends on whether your DH does step up like mine did.

What was he like before he was with you?

So, DH is treating your anxiety the way he's been asked/recommended to handle your MH ( to avoid stoking the fire of needy behaviour/dependence) . He listens to your worries and does offer the immediate support you ask for. Then he dials it back down later. (Possibly because it's just not possible to spend all his time juggling plates on the high wire while also manning the safety net .)

I think you need to discuss this with your therapist.

DH's mentioned lapses of behaviour and memory indicate he is also suffering high stress , but you resent being asked to support him with reminders etc and still feel he's the lame partner and you're the crutch. (Actually, IME its a normal function of a working marriage that each partner relies/leans on the other's memory and skills).

There's a couple of other inconsistencies in your OP ( you manage all the finances, yet it's DH who knows if the budget can support a cleaner). I think they are examples of the "inflated sense of control and responsibility that fuels the anxiety" your therapist mentioned.

Bottom line, I think you know you're not quite seeing your problem straight. Your DH can't fix that, so take it to your therapist/specialist.

None of the above is a criticism of you. What shines through everything is how hard you are trying. Don't punish yourself; and don't punish him either. I'm pretty sure he's trying his best to follow the advice he's been given about your anxiety . DH could maybe do with some specialist support too.

@2bazookas think that is a really fair summary. I manage the finances as in pay all the bills, manage the joint account etc but things like a new weekly expense would be agreed together and he thought not unfairly we needed to pay off cards before we got a cleaner. I am actually pretty bad at doing the finances just not so bad as to miss payments avoidably like he has in the past but not great at medium or long term budgetting.

It is also really hard and unfair to be cross he isnt helping the right way when the therapist has told us I cant reassurance seek. He was so kind for a bit on friday then sort of disappeared and explained he thought our conversation was finished. He cant reassure me but he can sit with me or hold me or not disappear or just walk around the house twiddling a pencil like no one is there. I dont want to feel this resentment or sadness or fear, I want to get better, I just cant work out what to prioritise financially or energy out of home structures, health fears and mental fears and so am working on the basis I have to do this alone and getting a plan for health fears at least, then house and mental. I just wish I had someone in the trenches with me.

One for your therapist, but it does seem as if you are mentally overwhelmed at the moment.

That's why I thought parking the DH issue for now and focusing on practical matters might help.

I simply don’t believe this “oh he’s useless, and at work too, but he just can’t help it” rubbish.

It sounds like you do, and are responsible for absolutely everything. I don’t think you’ll ever get completely better while you’re with him. Life will be a roller coaster where things get a bit better for a while because he’ll pull his socks up in the short term, then deteriorate again until you lose your shit at him, rinse and repeat.

At least if you split up you’d get some child free time to get yourself sorted for the week ahead with admin, washing, ironing, etc. I bet your life would be so much easier without him.

Good q about what was he like before me - answer - childless, living happily with pals in a fairly mouldy and smelly house share living on ginsters pies :)

Appt found something that might / might not be concerning and took a biopsy so no more action there til get my results which wont be for weeks and will talk through these issues with the therapist. It is tricky. He isnt bad and i cant exactly think of parallels but maybe it is like youre a recovering alcoholic or borderline type two diabetic or something and your partner is supportive in general terms but cant quite remember to not keep lagers or cream cakes in the house. I hope that isnt offensive, I know alcohol and diabetes issues are much more serious than anything I am handling, it is just that I know I have anxiety, even if some of my fears may be founded, and I really don’t know if I can get better living like this. Will see what therapist says and thank you all for support.

Sorry to hear about your medical scare @Flippinghecklike .

I'd definitely plough ahead with any changes you can to make life easier in the short term that don't require any big decisions. That will also give you a focus for the next few weeks while you wait for the results.

I have had this with my husband and I have trained him out of it. That man is so much better because of me 🤣🤣 in my DHs case it is definitely some form of ND. what has helped for us is Assigning tasks and allowing him to fail and be ditsy and make mistakes and learn. Lists, lists, lists and really specific and clear communication. I never ever expect him to read my mind. I still have a lot of the mental load but my husband is a work horse and a doer so we have split the load into doing/thinking. It has worked for us.