relationship counsellors or those doing relate - does this sound appropriate?

[bossykate]

dh & i have been going to relate for approximately 3m now. dh has found it quite helpful. i on the other hand have found it has made things worse. part of the problem for me is some of the behaviour/comments from the counsellor herself and i would like to hear mumsnetters' opinions on whether this sounds reasonable/appropriate/professional.

(1) i do not feel our sessions are well facilitated. too often they degenerate into rows and the counsellor makes little effort to diffuse the tension. i am frequently "ambushed" in the sessions by dh - this is unchallenged by the counsellor, e.g. dh said in our last joint session that he wishes we had never got married - counsellor left this statement unexplored - for me it was like a nuclear bomb going off!

(2) focus is totally on what i understand is psychodynamic therapy - how the past influences present behaviours. we are told that it will be a long and painful process - and that's it. i was expecting more "handy hints" and exercises to help us cope outside the sessions.

(3) i feel the counsellor has totally bought in to dh's view of our marriage and its problems, i.e. it's all my fault. not surprisingly, i don't agree! i feel that my issues with the marriage are not being explored.

(4) counsellor has told me off on more than one occasion, that i am too angry and hostile. i think this is inappropriate - surely the sessions are places where uncomfortable difficult emotions can be explored?

(5) counsellor has told me on more than one occasion how what i say makes her feel. surely her feelings are irrelevant?

(6) told me yesterday that dh and i were like arguing toddlers! now this may well be true but i don't feel this is a helpful, constructive, professional way of describing the situation.

i have already decided to find another counsellor but i wondered whether my experience is normal and whether i should expect more of the same or whether she is just hopelessly mismanaging me?

TIA

It sounds a little odd to me

can you email me countessdrac at gmail dot com I can recommend someone to you

if i may suggest, before looking elsewhere, make a print out of all the points above and take them to your next session. The results may prove interesting. Often counsellors have a plan which may not seem apparent to their clients and being open about your concerns and annoyances may just be a launchpad to the next level.

Conversely, there is nothing to say that she is just either not a good couples counsellor or just not the right one for you. Either way, before deciding that, I really would recommend taking your thoughts first to the next session.

Good luck.

My oh and I have had about 6 or 7 sessions at Relate. He wanted to leave me and I wanted to convince him to stay. It has been a very painfull experience but we have learned a lot about where we have been going wrong and how we should deal with our problems.
I want her to say that we should do x y and z and then we will be happy together but she has not done that.
I do feel as though she has a tendecy to side with OH. At one point I wanted him to leave and he would not because if there was a chance of us working he wanted to try whereas I was just angry - she said we should stay in the same house.
She seems to sympathise with his confusion which annoys me.
She also seems to understand (or at least not criticise) his feelings for another woman and the confusion this causes which drives me mad.
All in all through I think it has helped. She spotted that he is depressed and he has now been to see his Gp.
There are also times when she sides with me but I tend to forget those.
All in all I think that her contribution is helping - if you do not then you need to change counsellors now. If that seed of doubt is in your head then you will not be able to relax and the process wil not help.

Okay, I will answer point by point but I do think that the best advice is to take this list into your session and work through them with the counsellor.

Tell her you're frustrated, think she's on your husbands side, and doesn't facilitate you - that way you might get some of your needs met - it's highly likely that she knows that you're sitting there a simmering ball of anger ready to burst (a breakthrough point in therapy).

I'm responding to your points because actually what you are asking is very much about the process of therapy and not about the content of what's going on - being open about the process is easy but remember for a while in therapy all anyone wants to talk about is content ('he did this, she did this' etc)

1. 'dh has found it quite helpful' - he would because he's getting to get all he wants to say out while your simmering

1. 'degenerate into rows' - your the ones rowing in front of her, you're the ones that need to relearn how to talk to each other - it would not help if she told you how to behave or if she stopped him 'ambushing' you, you need to figure it out for yourself you two are creating the tension in the room and letting it explode - do you know why you are doing that - maybe explore in the session what is actually happening inside you when your husband 'drops bombs' like the one you describe - keep it in real time -

1. She has definitely not bought into his idea of the marriage and that its your fault - tell her that's what you feel, explore why you feel like that (maybe in your past you have never felt heard properly and felt other people were taking someone else's side). The counsellor leaving things unexplored - you explore them - you keep talking about them, you keep raising them. And there's no such thing as fault - just a search for understanding why we behave as we do.

1. I hear you saying that you feel told off (explore why you feel it) - but the words angry and hostile are descriptive not judgemental. You are angry and hostile in your post - and those emotions/expressions that your conveying are fine. I'm now going to relate this also to your next point - when she tells you how what you say arises feelings in her, this is very important - because then you hear what impact you're having on someone else. You hear how you're heard by someone else. She is in the room with you both, in a relationship with you both - her describing how the way you both behave or the feelings you arise are important. Her feelings are most relevant, she is not a facilitator, she is in the room as a person too - what she says she sees is also useful cos you can get too wrapped up with arguing to see what's going on.

1. 'toddlers' - you say you were acting like this, she described it - she used a word that you all relate to. Maybe you don't like being described as 'childish' - again its descriptive, not judgemental. Look at why its happening - you say you were acting like this, think about why.

You are not being 'mismanaged' - you are not being wholly explicit about how you feel - all the points you raise are also about feelings underneath. Raise them, keep raising them, make yourself heard.

I also think that it is important you have a counsellor whom you like and get on with and you may not be ready to deal with all the very important things you say in your post.

I'm sorry that you want to find another counsellor right now - your husband is finding it useful ? Think about that,

What is definitely going on is that you are not asserting your right to speak and be heard - please take this list to her and when you feel ambushed say 'I'm feeling ambushed, I don't like feeling ambushed'. And focus on whats going on inside you when your feeling defensive rather than the content of what he's saying.

I have no idea if anything I am saying here will help you but its taken me half an hour to write this so I at least hope you believe that I'm not attacking you but just reaching across cyberspace to explain. I'm aware that the written word on mumsnet can read harshly and I mean none of this harshly.

thanks to all for the responses so far

countess, i will email you tonight from home, thanks a lot.

postingatlast, i wanted to have a session with all of us next week to go through "ground rules", but tbh last night's session was so dreadful (i nearly walked out) i thought i should just get another counsellor. hmm. will think about it.

hanaflower, yes i intend to have some individual sessions. in fact i am not going to have any more sessions with dh for a while. if it is a counselling strategy, it is not working .

layla, i am inclined to agree with you that once the trust is gone there is little point continuing with the same person.

thanks for all the comments so far and keep em coming! tia

"I also think that it is important you have a counsellor whom you like and get on with and you may not be ready to deal with all the very important things you say in your post."

this sounds very patronising, its not meant to be, just descriptive, there are many things people have to work through and many times to do it - when I have top up therapy (I'm a counsellor) there is still stuff to work through.

What I'm trying to say is that there is no such thing as a fully sorted person - just a lot of people on a journey

absolutely fantastic post, Lauriefairycake. It didn't at all come across harshly and said way more eloquently what I was alluding to in my earlier post. Bossykate, you really are lucky to have someone respond in such a cogent, lucid and, I must say, right way. Take it all to your next session and don't give up on this counsellor yet. The very fact you are looking to change therapist is something in itself you can work on in the room. Really, this will all be for the benefit of what you are trying to achieve with your DH, even though it feels totally frustrating to you at the moment.

and we all crossed each other's posts again! Lauriefairycake, I was referring to your first long post of course, not the second shorter one - although your last line is one which resonates with me and I have said it in as many words many times elsewhere on this board.

ah laurie, x posted with you.

thanks for your very long and detailed reply. maybe i am not "ready" for the process but tbh from what you describe i wonder what value the relate counsellor will add?

you say she is not meant to facilitate. ok. it's not up to her to get to get us to explore things. ok. my feelings of being angry and hostile are not fine with her! honestly. i know what effect i'm having on dh, i'm not interested in what effect i'm having on her, she is there to help me not the other way round. believe me her saying we were behaving like toddlers didn't help - any more than if dh or i said it to the other.

sorry but i am genuinely in the dark now about what help a counsellor can provide?

sorry, but it did come across harshly. obviously that is my fault and she is a wonderful counsellor and i am deficient in some way

and i am not bottling anything up! believe me i let rip - hence the angry and hostile comments. i am angry and hostile but that is not ok with her, oh no.

from what has been said i think she wants me to bottle it up!

btw, i am more than happy for dh to carry on seeing her if it helps him horses for courses.

the nearly walking out point yesterday was after i had raised some of these issues, she suggested that if i didn't like what she was doing i obviously wasn't committed to saving the marriage

is that what going to relate is supposed to be like?

and believe me dh can see how angry i am - he just doesn't give a shit because addressing the underlying issues would mean him having a less nice life

angry? hostile? moi???

honestly, bottling up is not the problem here

need to step away now and practice some calming techniques...

is this Relate? They usually act in a very non-partisan way, just mediating, bringing up issues etc.

From what you have said - unless she has some hidden wise agenda - she just sounds a bit crap. What a shame.

Of course the trouble now is that if you find another, more impartial counsellor, your DH will think that she is 'on your side' all the time.

Bugger

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