How would you deal with this?

[Myrubbishlife]

My partner drinks a lot. Always has done, ever since I met him - although when I think back, I would swear that it's crept up from a bottle of wine on a Friday and Saturday to his current level of two bottles of 13.5% red wine (he won't drink anything with less alcohol) and a couple of bottles or cans of beer every Friday and Saturday.

I say every Friday and Saturday but it often extends to Sunday too and then sometimes midweek as well.

During school holidays, it's every day.

I don't think he's addicted as he CAN stop (he does occasionally go for 5 days without drinking, when I nag him enough) and he doesn't get hangovers, seem shaky or distracted and is able to get up at 7am and go to work the next day (first bottle of wine opened at 6.30-7pm and he finishes drinking at 10pm).

So, he drank every day over half term, then this last week did Tuesday, Friday and Saturday. Last night he mentioned a BBQ for today and I said that was fine, but not if it involved drinking. His reply was "I don't really want a barbecue without a beer". A heated discussion followed about his drinking and the fact that after drinking all week last week and doing three days this week, he still can't go tomorrow without another drink. He denied that just saying he would fancy a beer with the BBQ and we just went round in circles until I gave up and decided we would have chili instead.

This morning he announced he was thinking of "just having the BBQ anyway". I expressed how upsetting it was to hear that after the discussion yesterday and he said he would have the BBQ without drinking.

Then - and I have no idea why but this always happens - I said that as he had 2 beers in the fridge anyway maybe he could drink today as long as he went Mon-Thurs next week without drinking.

He went to the shop, came back with 2 beers and 2 bottles of wine.

So now I feel like crap again. I dont understand why when he says he won't drink I always say something along the lines of "ok maybe one more day won't hurt". I think deep down it's because I know he doesn't want to stop and he'll be bored and sad if he doesn't drink.

After he came back from the shop, I said how uncomfortable I was with it all, how I felt that he had somehow manipulated me into agreeing to let him drink and that he knew that if he started hinting about a BBQ I would end up 'allowing' him to drink.

He says he won't drink it and can put it in the cupboard, he also says I give mixed signals all the time about the drinking and he's confused.

From my point of view, I don't want him to drink at all. Our bedroom is downstairs so that's where he drinks and whether it's due to lack of ventilation or not I don't know, but the bedroom absolutely reeks of a strong alcohol smell that lingers all night and to the next morning. The hallway downstairs and up the stairs also smells strongly of alcohol, from about ten mins after he's opened the first bottle.

So. I suppose what I want to know is how much of a deal breaker this level of drinking is - bearing in mind he has always been a heavy drinker would I be unreasonable to say now that I want him to cut down or stop?

And which would it be - do I ask him to stop altogether or cut down to the Friday and Saturday then go from there?

I don't even know if he wants to stay in the relationship for me, or because it's 'easy' (I pay all the bills as I don't work due to illness, so all bills come out of our universal credit and he chips in for food a few times a week).

He pays for all the alcohol himself by the way, so it's not affecting me or the family in that way.

So yeah, what would you do if you were me?

@KettrickenSmiled
i don’t think that drinking on a Friday and Saturday night is heavy drinking no .
That is my opinion - you don’t have to agree

Ah so it’s not his drinking that’s the problem, it’s your attitude towards it. If you could just fix your issues, everything would be fine.

see number 11 of reasons to drink

11. My only problem is all the judgmental people around me.

Alcoholics quite often blame others not only for seeing a problem where there is none but for creating a problem. They believe that they wouldn’t drink so much if everyone would just get off their case for a while. Of course, this isn’t true. The alcoholic will never run out of reasons to drink. Alcoholics may also be extra-sensitive to being judged, as addiction can bring out paranoia in many people

www.addictions.com/blog/13-excuses-alcoholics-make-to-themselves-and-others/

@Myrubbishlife I bet that much of your chronic indecisiveness is caused by living with someone who gaslights you and tells you that your feelings are wrong and your opinions are unreasonable .

Someone who agrees to only drink the two beers in the fridge, then goes out and buys two bottles of wine and two more beers, is not a healthy drinker. I mean seriously, two bottles of wine and four beers would have most people on their back, you have to have a lot of practice to consume that much without passing out. Come on OP, stop deluding yourself. Can he even just drink one or two beers and stop, or is it the case that once he starts that’s it, he doesn’t stop until all the alcohol is gone or he’s completely wasted? are you sure he doesn’t drink in secret?

How odd @Fidgety31

Why are you focused on frequency instead of volume?
You can hold any opinion you like, but it doesn't make you right!

2 bottles of red + 2 cans of beer is about 26 units.
He drinks that much in a single night, then does it again the next night.
He's already escalating into Sunday nights & midweek.

What's your agenda in describing that as "not heavy drinking"?
Why would you choose to be so contrary & unhelpful to OP?

Possibly...I have been this way all my life (the indecisivesness) but whenever I raise anything with him that he perceives as a criticism, it's always wrong. He always counters with something I do that's similar, or a tedious example of when I've done the same thing (but for a different reason).

He will also never take my opinion on anything as being right - "he always wants to talk to someone in person" about it (like with discussing universal credit and splitting up the joint claim, he didn't believe what I was telling him about him being able to claim too for a bit).

I've told him we need to split up but I've said this many, many times and it's never happened. Trouble is, right now I just feel awful and keep wanting to talk to him about it and get him to agree (I mean, he has agreed but he doesn't want to go obviously).

How do I stop caring what he thinks?

I can't remember ever seeing him drink just the one or two, but he has left wine in the cupboard and it's stayed untouched untouched a few days.

I can't say he definitely doesn't drink when I'm not aware of it, but he's only out of the house for a couple of hours a day whilst he's working and he pretty much stays planted in the bedroom (door open) when he's home, so I can't see a time he would be drinking without my knowledge!

Sorry I must keep track of log ins! The last post was me under a different username.

How do I stop caring what he thinks?

You start to care more about your own happiness and the welfare of your children.

I've told him we need to split up but I've said this many, many times and it's never happened.
Well ... what's going on here? It won't "happen" unless you make it!
What are the practicalities? Who is on the tenancy/mortgage?
Can one of you afford to keep the house on when the other leaves, or do you both need to leave?

Trouble is, right now I just feel awful and keep wanting to talk to him about it and get him to agree (I mean, he has agreed but he doesn't want to go obviously).
What are you feeling awful about?
He's horrible to you, & he's a drunk.
This relationship is going nowhere.
Stop talking about splitting up, & start getting proactive with your options. Decide if one or both of you needs to move, decide who, & tell him it's happening.
You do not need his agreement to split.
You do not need his permission to split.

How do I stop caring what he thinks?
By reminding yourself that this is a man who prefers holing up in the bedroom, boozing until he stinks it out, to spending any time with you.
By holding on to what YOU think, & dropping the rope.
He is going to drink himself into the ground, or not. Nothing you can do will make a blind bit of difference to that. Focus on yourself for once & get YOUR life back where you want it ... with a sweet-smelling bedroom all to yourself, & no more time wasted on pandering to a mean man who makes you feel like shit.

You can only stop caring what he thinks by getting some distance, and starting to care what you think much more.

al anon is a good place to start, you will learn about co-dependency and how it works.

His problems will drag you down, OP. You must act sooner rather than later.

Mr friend died before his last birthday because of brain aneurism - caused by his heavy drinking.

He left 2 young sons behind, teen and preteen. Their Mum had died years before too from her drinking.

He was found 3 days after he'd died. By his kids when they returned from their Nan's.

That's where your 'd'P is headed OP. And yet you're willing to expose your kids to that. Grow up. Throw him out. Get some dignity for yourself.

My friend*

You seem to need permission to leave , you don’t need anyones permission or even a reason if he asks for one, it is enough that you no longer want the relationship to continue but just in case you want permission to ditch him , here it is.
You have my permission to split up with this man.

You start to care more about your own happiness and the welfare of your children.

This!

He needs to go! No ifs buts or maybes

Oh just bloody dump him OP.

No amount of nagging, begging, pleading, asking nicely, discussing, etc. is going to make him stop – he doesn’t want to. It’s that simple.

He’s a grown man and he’s made a conscious lifestyle choice to drink heavily. The ins and outs of when, where and how are completely irrelevant. HE HAS A DRINK PROBLEM (and an attitude problem). It doesn’t matter if you knew he drank a lot when you first met. It doesn’t matter that you was okay/thought you’d be okay with that initially – he’s just deflecting and justifying (in his head) why it’s okay for him to carry on. He will only change when HE wants to.

That he’s putting his love of drink over and above your relationship is telling you everything you need to know.

Heavy drinker. Alcoholic. Troubled man. Call it what you like. You don’t like it. He won’t / doesn’t want to stop. So set him free to continue his love affair with the bottle.

A few observations:

1. I suspect he has no off-switch so he couldn’t have just had the two beers in the fridge

2. Why is he drinking in the bedroom? That seems weird and secretive

3. What is he like when he drinks?

4. WTF the government can pay the bills.

5. What difference does it make whether he’s an ‘alcoholic’ or ‘just’ a heavy drinker? The impact on your life is the same

Id be saying he has to contribute properly to the household, financially. That means not prioritising booze over bills.

Id also be saying he needs to not drink in the week for starters, but that might not be enough for you. That depends on whether it would solve the problem- there’s a world of difference between a sociable drink on the weekend, or even a few in front of the telly, and secretly getting drunk and being nasty. Only you know the reality.

He isn't an alcoholic if he's only drinking at weekends and in the holidays
But if I am honest that doesn't seem the biggest problem here.
Why are you paying for everything?

@maddy68 you're clearly not a medical professional so please stop with unhelpful opinions like this. The man drinks 26 units in a single sitting, a minimum of twice a week. That makes him an alcoholic - & also one whose drinking is escalating into Sunday & mid-week drinking.

What do you think that is, if it isn't alcoholism?

Hi again all.

I don't think I made myself massively clear in my last posts; whether he's an alcoholic, 'just' a heavy drinker or anything in between doesnt really matter if its something I'm not comfortable with, I was merely trying to get come sort of idea as to whether 'normal people' think he has a drink problem.

It's so hard for me to explain.

I grew up in a household where drinking wasn't a thing at all. My mum had a bottle of Babysham in a drinks cabinet for years that was never touched. My stepdad never drank, I didn't go out as a teen or young adult and drink, apart from a couple of times after work when I was in my mid 20s but I wasn't fussed. Apart from those few times I was teetotal as an adult, just didn't really like the taste of alcohol.

So you could say my relationship with alcohol was different to a lot of people's.

When I met my partner,

He's a man who is undeveloped fully in some key areas.

He has dependency issues - on the alcohol and on you financially and on the "government to pay the bills".

He doesn't fully take responsibility for himself nor does he really face the impact of his choices on people around him - he is immature and undeveloped in that sense too.

The drinking is all about what you will let him drink, what he can get away with, it's all framed in relation to a kind of struggle with you. Which means he didn't ever really have to take responsibility.

If he did take responsibility it would mean facing not only the withdrawal but also the guilt about what he has done to himself and others, and confronting his sadness and depression that the drink masks.

And also the feelings of shame because deep down he knows he has a problem and that he has got work to do to really grow up properly.

To address all that would take him bring up for doing a lot of work on himself.

Sorry, pressed post by mistake.

When I met my partner his drinking wasn't a problem at all, in my eyes. He would bring a bottle of wine with him when he came round to visit and we would share, although I could only have half a glass because I didn't drink bit he certainly didn't seem bothered that I would have some of 'his' wine I'd expect an alcoholic to 'need' every drop of the bottle).

If we went out he would only have one or two drinks and I feel like his alcohol consumption crept up on me, but I can't remember when or how.

He says he was always a heavy drinker and I knew what he was when we met.

The reason I get confused about whether to split is there are weeks like this week, where his drinking feels more 'normal' - we had the row last week where I said we had to split as I couldn't see any way forwards and he didn't drink or even mention it all week.

Yesterday he had his usual couple of beers (both around 4.30-5pm with dinner as we had a BBQ) and opened the first bottle of wine at 6.30. At 10.30 we were both tired because of the heat so went to bed and he still had a glass of red wine (we don't have wine glasses so it was a small tumbler) that stayed on the side in the bedroom all night.

Granted that was all that was left of the 2 bottles but he didn't try and neck it before bed or anything like that, and again this isn't something that I'd expect an alcoholic to do - be able to leave any drink in the house untouched.
There are also still two beers in the fridge BTW so he didn't drink those either.

I'm not saying he deserves a sticker for leaving a hit of alcohol untouched by the say before anyone jumps on me, but it just makes me wonder whether if he just drank 'to excess' on a weekend, is that any different from a lot of people?

Otherwise the relationship is okay and for whoever asked about what he's like when he drunk - he's just happy and sleepy.

I suppose what I was trying to say is that the dependence on drinking is part of a bigger picture.

So in a way it doesn't matter too much whether his drinking could be "classed" as alcoholic or not. Knowing the answer to that, if indeed there is an answer, isn't going to really be determinative of anything.

I think you're getting fixated on how much he drinks.

But your user name is "my rubbish life".

If people come on here and say "yes that's alcoholism" or if they say "ah no that's normal" it is not going to change your difficulties.