DH lending savings to BIL behind my back

[Honeypup]

So it’s nearly 2am and I can not sleep because I am still fuming about. Situation I found out about a month ago.
myself & DH have savings, not a huge amount by any means but money is hard to come back even with both of us working. We private rent and so the savings are for the purpose of a deposit for a house and our three kids.
DH brother has a mortgage with his partner and children , I knew previously that he would regularly (twice a week min once) ask DH for money over text /phone small amounts to see him through the working week.
However around a year ago the mother called DH and said I n ow I shouldn’t ask but could you lend brother a thousand out of savings. (My DH seems to be the one always asked for money ) needles to say this caused lots of arguments between myself and DH , I expressed it was too much (apparently bil was in a lot of debt and this thongs and would sort all his woes out) I made it clear I did not think it was okay. My DH said he felt he had no way of saying no as the family know we have savings and how much, we agreed on this occasion yes but NEVER again.

less then a year later I ask partner if I can look at the savings, only he has the account and I kept being put off, so one evening I said let me see and I was in the end told NO. We had five nights of screaming matches I felt like I had caught him out cheating… just SHOW ME the account. It came out after it nearly breaking our family up… look I’m sorry I lent BIL another thousand behind your back. I told BIL it was behind your back as you would not agree and so I need it back asap possible no later the 2 months. I was told about this six months later .. I said okay so how much has been paid back……… nothing, not a penny.

so I messaged the partner (who I am very close with we speak regularly about all sorts include domestics with our own partners) I said I am so angry I can’t believe I have just found out the above.

since then the BIL does not speak to my DH who has been a wreck with the communication being cut - he has reached saying this is really hurting him and he has been told he will not be speaking to him until he is able to pay it all back as he feel so embarrassed by the message. It took him a month to pay anything at all while working, In the last two months we have received two payments.

I just wondered if anyone ever reaches the end of this, whether you make me right in the way I reacted?? At the time I said (we were arguing at the brink of breaking up) we shouldn’t be arguing about this , they should!! My DH even started to put money back in pretending it had been received from BIL .. more argument for us.

You seem to feel that your DH being 'soft' excuses what he's done. On the contrary, it's all the more reason why all savings must be placed in your name, and then to ensure that you can't be manipulated as well, the account should be a 90 day notice account.

There are multiple layers of secrecy in his family dynamic. He doesn't tell you about the money he's given to his brother, no-one tells the brother's wife how much he's stolen from their savings, whilst accepting money from her parents. No-one benefits from the secrets and lies except him. I suggest you blow the lid on the whole thing and have done with it.

I don't understand why you think your DH will appreciate a line has been drawn in the sand if there are no consequences for him of his actions. This will happen again, because he doesn't think it was wrong.

Your husband is using emotional blackmail on you in the same way as his brother did with him. You feel sorry for him because he's upset, he felt sorry for his brother because he was upset. Get all saving into your name, keep at the brother and his partner to repay their debt, not your problem if she doesn't know, so her a favour and make sure she has all the details.

Until your DH lets your BIL sink to the lowest point, he won’t get help or sort himself out.

He may have debts with all family members, he already owes his parents, he may owe people outside the family - friends who he’s suddenly fallen out with?

He needs to fail, before he gets better.

Is it correct that you work and SIL stays home with the children? Surely the obvious thing is for her to work?

Stop paying into any savings & have your own account.

What was the reason your name wasn't on that account in the first place?
I'd be worried how much he's really given him over the years.

Put all the money in an account in your name only. That will stop the needling from his family to support the gambler. He is welcome to see it anytime, view the statements so completely open about it.
Did your DH tell them how much savings he had as how did they know this?

Do you think your SIL is aware of his gambling issue returned? He is likely lying to her. You might give her a small heads up for the children's sake.

I would be telling DH I won't be put lower than his brother and all joint savings must go into an account that you must both sign to draw any money out. If he refuses I would kick him out/leave. You should put all your earnings into your own bank account. Your DH is stealing from you to appease his brother. He can't bare for his brother not to speak to him but he is willing to lose his own wife and kids. I don't think he will ever put you and kids before his brother.

You need both of your names on that saving account

This has been deception by your husband. The savings go into a savings account in your name only. You write out a payment plan of X per week for BIL and his wife to sign and follow. The BiL and DH have created this situation. Shine light on it op.

A savings account that needs both of you to sign for withdrawals would both protect your money and also give DH a way out - after all if you won't sign it's not his fault he can't give BIL the money ...

Gamblers can be extremely manipulative and obviously your dh was worked on . As well as protecting your savings your dh needs to understand that gamblers will never be satisfied..they steal from their own children's money boxes..they would steal from their dying granny. Unless your dh knows what he is dealing with this will happen again..maybe not your savings but his regular earnings. Your bil could genuinely have money to pay back ..say from a win.. but is keeping that money to pursue more gambling. it is obvious your mil is being manipulated as well. The dramatics he is going on with now is all part of the scheming. Maybe your dh would consider going to a gamblers anonymous meeting even once as they support families as well. He might have his eyes opened there.

It would be reasonable to leave.

But if you don’t want to then you need fully joint finances, and you need to give him a level of bollocking he will never forget. And ask yourself what the fuck you were thinking not having access to your own savings account.

Ignore any infighting btwn your husband and BIL, that’s their problem - and point out to him he needs to focus on his marriage if he wants to still be in one in 6 months.

I really could not stay married to someone like that, my DSis needed financial help for about twenty four hours, (to pay for something) she rang me and she said when do you need repaying, I said, we can carry you for a few months, so take that breathing space, she will pay us back in September.

The point is, before I was so magnanimous with family money I checked with my DH, our attitude being, we both earn it, so we both decide what we spend it on.

You are not in a financially respectful relationship, you had to kick off and carry on like a fish wife to be given the most basic of access to your financial information.

I would be looking at the BIL situation and making plans to leave, you appear to be the "little woman"

You have a family problem and your bigger one is your DH

THIS.
BIL knows how soft my DH is. He is known for being a softy with his family and will help anyone out but usually it’s never been more then tenner here or twenty there now makes me feel that the amounts in the past must of been bigger.

He is known for being a softy = he is known for someone that can exploit. But he hasn't been a softy with you has he? He has happily taken your savings, given them to BIL the gambler and lied to you about it. His priorities are all wrong.

AND total transparency from now on. Get it all out in the open and let them know how you feel about it. They've all gone behind your back, so what have you actually got to lose.
I would be having words with MIL too, as she was the one asking for BIL to be lent the money - and I'd be telling her and the rest of the family that the bank of Honeypup is closed and no further applications will be accepted. Your savings were taken out without your consent and then you were lied to about it and the details kept hidden.
Tell MIL that this has caused a serious issue in your marriage and if she wants your gambling BIL to have the money she can foot the bill herself.
Your DH has to agree a repayment schedule with BIL and you have to see evidence that its being met.

Don't move it to a joint account, move it to a sole account in your name. Then next time BIL asks DH for money, DH can truthfully say he no longer has access to the savings. Extreme, but I think this may be necessary. BIL will ask again. DH will be a soft touch.

"I am also aware he does have an issue with gambling and that he actually had to borrow the deposit from my in laws for his house as he had lost a chunk due to his problem. However it is made out this is no longer an issue for him (he has never paid the in-laws back and it can not be openly discussed as his partner does know the extended of him dipping into their savings)"
He's a gambler? That's where all the money is going, then. Of course it is still an issue and always will be unless he seeks help. Point this out to your husband, that by giving lending money to his brother, he is keeping his brother in the grip of gambling. He feels unkind not giving his brother, make it clear to him that it is far more unkind giving a gambler money. Would he give an alcoholic with a failing liver a bottle of whiskey? No? Then why is he giving a gambler stake money (that he will lose and lose again and get deeper and deeper into debt)?

Your husband stole from your savings. This is IMO unforgivable. I'd get a solicitor before he clears you and your family out completely

Your dh was caught between a rock and a hard place and wanted to help out. Not wrong in itself. However, he should have discussed things with you. Do you want to end the relationship over this, or not.

if not, you need to take action now. Firstly, get a joint account for the savings, in fact all accounts (so he doesn’t secrete money out of other accounts). Secondly, set up a payment plan now with bil. Eg. Standing order, such as £100 per month to you. Thirdly, make it clear to everyone , that there will No More lending of money. Don’t be embarrassed to shout this out to the houses. They started this monologue by asking you for the money. Cite the cost of living, deposit etc if they need a reason.

@WhereYouLeftIt has made some good points about giving money to a gambler.

You will never get the money back if he is still gambling. He probably has a string of people he has been borrowing from that won’t be repaid - ever.
There will be plenty of threads on here and other forums and it’s highly likely he is lying to his parents and his partner and obviously your dh.
It will be hard for your dh to understand that this isn’t a normal loan which you can expect to be repaid as he naturally loves his brother and can’t or doesn’t want to believe his brother will do that to him. His brother has not offered to repay any of the money (because it’s all gone) and has cut communication with him. If he was that ashamed he would be coming clean and addressing his gambling addiction - but he’s not- so draw your own conclusions. Be prepared for him to get back in contact at some point though when he’s desperate enough.

However your dh has now colluded in his brothers deception and has stolen from you. Only you can decide if this is a dealbreaker for you also I wouldn’t lie to his partner. He has to reach rock bottom and that will probably mean losing his house and possible his relationship - and do and your DH want your relationship to also be a casualty?

assuming you want to stay together
Take all the savings and put them in your name.
Stop telling your pil /other family about your finances - to be honest you could tell the truth and say your savings have taken a hit because dh loaned his db over £2k that hadn’t been paid back and with the cost of living increases your struggling to save at the moment.

Your BIL and his wife have fool made of your husband and you by entension.

You don't own a home, with 3 children, and your husband is giving a couple of thousand to a gambling loser.

God help you OP.

Get the savings put in your account asap and start looking at your marriage.

Your husband is a liar and a thief, stealing from his family for a gambling brother.

Why you aren't bringing this up with your SIL is beyond me.

Spell it out, you want your money back.

I couldn't look at a man who would steal from his own family.

If your BIL's wife knew nothing about the loans then she probably asked him what it was about. It may be that he told her a load of lies about the situation that mean she now thinks you're at fault, hence her being off with you. If he's a gambler he's almost certainly a practised liar.

I don't think you can trust your DH with a joint savings account.
BIL sees that as his access to spare cash and he and MIL will wheedle DH into coughing up again.
DH even put his own money into the account to hide from yo how much he'd given to BIL. He is as bad as BIL. BIL is a gambler who will continue to tap DH for cash and DH is unable to resist him.
It should all go into an account in just your name.

Christ, your partner is utterly pathetic and his family are manipulative thieves.

She's said he's got a gambling problem

You mentioned you have a holiday home. Is that something you are renting for half term or is it something that you own that you could sell to buy a house? I was thinking that if you could raise some money from it, would that plus your savings be enough to put down as a deposit so that there is no more savings to be given lent to BIL?

Your DH is stealing his brother's rock bottom. It is actively harmful to you, your BIL and your family.

He needs no options but GA and stopping. Open and honest with SIL and DH and everyone else. He needs to understand no one is lying for him, stealing for him or managing him.

And all the savings would be going into an account solely in my name, tomorrow.