Teen daughter blaming me for her self harm and suicidal ideation

[Alwaystoblame]

She doesn't live with me because she is violent to her siblings and me, lies constantly, is verbally abusive, bullying others at school, truant, shoplifting, drinking, smoking, having sex, you name it. She refuses all mental health input saying it doesn't help and she just wants to move on from the past. Social services aren't interested and closed the case recently. She lives with her dad and is 15. If anyone says no to her over anything or takes her phone as punishment she self harms or threatens suicide and despite the fact she rarely sees me or communicates with me it's always my fault. Misbehaves in school and it's because I've said no to her coming her after she's threatened a friend with extreme violence and told them to Jill themselves. Her dad is very abusive and has successfully alienated her from me over the past few years. I have 2 other dc who have no issues but I'm told I'm unstable and an unfit mother by Dd and her dad. She has said she doesn't want me in her life anymore so I am respecting her wishes. Everything is still my fault though.
Has anyone got any advice on how to cope with all this please?

Something is going on for your daughter. Something has happened.

I know it’s not you, but something has happened

Great post from @Turmerictolly - OP I agree.
I also agree that something has happened to her.

She has reached out to me at teatime. I have firmly but kindly stated my boundaries and we have spoken on the phone. It is obvious her dad is poisoning her mind. She has asked to see me regularly and promised to attend MH sessions. This has all been promised before but I will always give her the chance again as I always do but keep my boundaries around behaviour. She's making more of an effort this time with what she is saying and prepared to make changes and realises her behaviour has gone too far.
I'd written her a text earlier stating I love her and would always be here for her when she is ready. I love her so much and this breaks my heart to see her do list and I'm powerless to help until she will accept my help. I'd love to take her away for a couple of days just me and her but I don't know if it's possible. I'll see what I can do and it depends if I can get care for my mum in my absence. I'm also very aware that she unwittingly has me in a cycle of abuse with her push pull behaviour and that I find it hard to have boundaries because she reacts so badly to them but do badly needs them.
I really appreciate the support here, thank you.

They won't diagnose her with BPD, it's a very stigmatised diagnosis and the NHS are moving away from using labels, preferring to treat symptoms instead. I have BPD which is asymptomatic now but can tell you it's a horrible, horrible illness for the sufferer and very tough on loved ones too.

If she does have BPD traits it stems from deep seated trauma, and it can lead to feeling very emotional when presumably alienated by someone. She needs love and support, and help, at 15 she is so vulnerable. You want her to manage when she gets to adulthood, so it's really important to intervene now.

This is also not uncommon. She may feel in that moment that she truly needs help and wants to change. But her emotions are so strong she can't control when she flies into a rage.

It can make you feel very very ashamed. I was the same although not to my mum, and the only thing that helped was DBT.

Your daughter sounds very much like I was as a teen. My narcissistic father would tell me terrible things about my mother. He used to wait until I was feeling mentally vulnerable or had been drinking then call her awful names. He also used to wind me up and upset me by shouting at me and not backing down until I would have a massive meltdown. I would then feel really bad about losing control and would self harm or attempt suicide. He told me brother he thought this was funny and that he liked having that much control over me.

In the end I saw how bad he was and avoided him. But then my mother threw me out because she couldn't handle the meltdowns, but that's another story...

I was thought to have Borderline Personality Disorder at one point, but it turns out I have Autism and I strongly suspect so does my father, as well as Narcissistic Personality Disorder, my mother probably just NPD.

Whether you daughter has ASD, BPD or neither, I don't see there's much you can do while her father has this much influence over her. If he's at work a lot meet up with her, do something fun, just be there. And DO NOT bad mouth her father, let her come to her own conclusions about him.

'd love to take her away for a couple of days just me and her but I don't know if it's possible. I'll see what I can do and it depends if I can get care for my mum in my absence

With all due respect, given the situation your dd is in right now, your mother needs to be looked after by someone else, anyone else quite frankly or she goes into respite for a few days. Your duty is to your child. Your child is in the greatest need right now.

A few days won't be just good for her, it will be hugely beneficial to you as well. A rest and a break with your child will be good for you.
You are both locked in a negative vicious cycle that needs to broken.

Your text worked, and she connected with you - the power and strength of your love for her broke down the barrier of indifference, and actually doing concrete things for her will break the impasse between you. A few days away will show her you really mean it when you say you love her and you are there for her. It can be a cheap B&B or if you can stretch to it, make it even nicer and enjoy the break. Talking to her in the mornings in bed, have breakfast together - spending time walking, shopping whatever she likes doing. Talking about how she is feeling, how you have felt. What can be done for the future to make it easier/better. Hug her, look beyond the big walls she has built around herself for protection, let her be loved for a while.

You will never regret being there for her now, whatever happens in the future - take one day at a time and hold her hand. The rest of the world can take a backseat for a while. Your child comes first now.

Send a thank you message to her for her reaching out, that is a big thing to do at 15. They are not known for backing down. Let her back down with dignity.
You may not know this, but your message probably gave her a feeling of hope, that someone out there does actually care for her

Keep going op.

She's here with me today. She's smiling and hugging and laughing. I've got both dds off today for a mental health day after a very unpleasant evening and morning with their dad. We do this every so often as she phones and wants me then shuts me out again if her dad gets to her. So far she's ok and we will have a proper talk later just the two of us.

That is a lovely update. If she feels happy and supported with you, she is less likely to return or listen to him. I hope they are okay. What happened with their Dad?

Can you try to pinpoint when all this started OP? Could it be hormone related or even ADHD? There’s a reason she’s behaving like this and it doesn’t automatically mean trauma or bad parenting. Obviously your ex will have had an effect on her though.

Could you explore with her the first time she felt like she does and what she was doing for eg.

I have a daughter who’s behaviour completely changed when she started her periods. No trauma, similar parenting as yours, Dad at home. I just couldn’t understand why she behaved liked that. Brothers, no issues. It was like a switch had been flicked. Horrendous mood swings and impulsive behaviour and she really struggles with her emotions still now. Calmed down a bit in late teens in terms of good choices but still a nightmare at home.

I had a very abusive, traumatic childhood and never behaved like that so it really threw me and I tore myself up in knots questioning what we did wrong.

She was later diagnosed with PCOS and the only thing that’s helped to some extent is a Mirena coil and anti depressants sadly. Obviously your DD (mines 25 now) is way too young for both, but worth discussing and looking into at least so if it is a possible cause, she will know that it’s not her fault or yours!

Do you have any other family that could help with your Mum and DSs for a bit? Agree that DD needs to take priority over them for now. A break, just you and her, may help her open up and invite some open conversations and more understanding from her on the situation between you and her Dad.

In the long term she needs to get away from him, even if she’s not with you. He’s just feeding toxicity to her.

What’s her plan for the summer holidays? Anyone trustworthy she can stay with far away? Would she do a summer camp, obviously might be a big cost there though?

It all started when her dad left. No issues until then at all. She refused to see her dad for 9 months because he threw something at her but court ordered contact and she went and I be and the enemy and are started running away. Lockdown really exacerbated things and I think she found it very hard as I was shielded. Her dad was very blasé about it all and she missed her freedom and he could provide that. Between him and his ex there was a steady intensification of the alienation towards me and things went from bad to worse. She's copied a lot of his behaviours and she's his puppet abusing me in his place. He can't get to me directly so he uses the dc. Younger Dd is having none of his manipulations but my eldest is very much an imitator and feels very divided in her loyalties. Currently they both hate him but I don't want them to feel like that. I want them to have a good relationship with him but I'm not sure they can due to his narcissism.
We have had a really good day today. All positive, lots of Dd being open to suggestions and negotiating regarding plans for the day and the future. Therapy, routine, exercise, better diet etc all discussed and I've supported her with school, her dad, her friends, everything today. She's seen that I totally have her back and want the best for her but most of all for her to be well and happy. She has said her dad has blamed her for lots of things such as his failed relationships (3 in the past 12 months) problems at work and saying she is making him stressed and depressed. That's why she was suicidal.
So, lots of positives today. Lots of work to be done. I'm not perfect and I have my own struggles but I'm trying and I'm showing Dd that I'm trying to be better too. All 3 dc have really enjoyed being with each other today and it's been wonderful to have them laughing and playing in the park, watching rabbits down in the valley, exploring by the river and just being kids. Dd doesn't often get to just be a kid and be carefree. She needs more of it.
I really hope we can continue in this positive light. It's done me so much good to have us all together and see that things are not all bad and that my baby is still there, she's just lost under the weight of negativity and can't get herself out of it without my help. She sees that too now. We are going to see her beloved grandmother later who she hasn't seen for months. My mum can't wait to see her. They used to be very close but Dd has been alienated from us all.
Thank you for all the kind comments and the helpful ones and the general support. I was in such a state of anger and bewilderment when I wrote this thread but now I'm calmer and have a plan in place and several options to help and to explore. Thank you.

Sounds like you’ve had a great day.

Shes sounds like a child caught up and used by people (her dad) to act out their own issues, and that’s hard to bear.

Im always dubious about the emphasis on counselling here, she hasn’t actually done anything wrong, it’s the adults around her and that needs to be very clear for her. Yes, have some counsellling to talk things through with someone, if she wants (ie. Not forced) but the emphasis needs to be that the way in which she has reacted is normal, there is nothing wrong with her, it’s the situation she has had to be in.

But have more fun, reassure her her feelings are totally valid and expected given the situation, and be consistent, even if she makes a few mistakes along the way

She's seen that I totally have her back and want the best for her but most of all for her to be well and happy. She has said her dad has blamed her for lots of things such as his failed relationships (3 in the past 12 months) problems at work and saying she is making him stressed and depressed. That's why she was suicidal.

Congratulations. This is a major breakthrough. She needs to see and feel the light for herself.

I am very close to someone who has been through this exact situation. Moved out with the DF who used her as a conduit to abuse the DM indirectly with the DD being emotionally abused at the same time. You can see this. You can’t point it out because she is being controlled and if you do it will be counterproductive. It is actually good that the tide is turning and she is seeing and experiencing for herself that he has now turned on her directly.

Keep calm, consistent, connected.

This approach worked for friend. Her daughter is home now and doing brilliantly.

She never directly pointed the finger at the XH to her DD because this would be inflammatory but she would say things like “how does that make you feel, do you think that’s fair, acceptable” etc. when the DD told her stuff. Her DD has now come through it. Don’t worry that throwing everything at it is not sticking - just prioritise the moments of connection you have with her in a very balanced and boundaried way. She absolutely wants you and is craving the routines, comfort, calm and kindness that you built in her childhood.

Know that - even if her behaviour looks otherwise.

It won’t be a straight line. You will have loads of other shit times - but log the moments that are good and hopefully see it settling over time. Manage your expectations - be realistic and think maybe by Christmas she will engage in therapy.

Don’t feed her dysregulation by becoming emotional yourself, don’t let her hijack your day or the rest of the family. Calm, calm, calm consistent boundaries, deadlines and consistent consequences. Don’t allow yourself to be emotionally triggered and bounced around the drama triangle from rescuer to persecutor to victim.

You job is to help her learn to self soothe so that she can identify and dial down stress to feel better inside and then behave better to herself and others and this is achieved by you being constantly being neutral, attentive, boundaried. As a PP said it’s called co-regulation (you can see the effects of co-reg with your X) - she will absorb your energy. She might need to learn some overt grounding techniques as well.

I read a great animal analogy of parenting in crisis recently - where we get triggered to extreme behaviours which are totally counterproductive - ostrich (obvious head in the sand) rhino (aggressive frustration, blame, attack and demand of the child) Kangeroo (overly engulfing, wrapping in cotton wool and keeping trapped in our pouch) jellyfish (where our inner triggered emotions are too transparent and destabilising for the child). All are unbalanced when we recognise ourselves like this we need to switch to either the St Bernard (solid, no drama, safe, predictable, reliable, plodding in through one foot in front of another) or the dolphin - attuned, responsive, role model, side by side, playful sometimes out in front, sometimes behind letting the calf lead the way.

This stuff sounds simple but it’s not always easy. If you can get some professional emotional support for yourself and take time to restore to cope through this difficult time as well as ensure your other child are prioritised.

She may have an underlying genetic MH issue (if her father does), she may have an early unresolved relational or physical trauma, she may have an undiagnosed neurodiversity, she may have an untreated physical / hormonal issue. She may not. She may have all of these compounding issues or she may have a combination of some.

But first off she needs emotional stabilisation which IMHO starts with her reconnecting with you, little by little and then over time you / she will have the perspective to investigate other potential issues.

You are further through this than you think if she knows her DF is dumping on her and she can articulate that to you. You have her back, always have had and that’s money in the emotional bank that he can’t drain and will begin to pay back.

Look after yourself OP. You are a wonderful mother in these truly trying circumstances.

She's gone back to her dad now as he's reeled her back in with an apology and no doubt lots of bad mouthing of me. There will be lots of this I expect. Lots of back and forth. Ups and downs.

Yes there will. I am sorry this has happened. But he can’t take her lived experience, feelings and memories away.

Try to be glad you had this breakthrough opportunity and that the tide is turning but there will be the some back and forth to endure before she comes through. Keep calm and consistent and your door always open and have faith and hope that things will come through in time.

Okay so she is back with her Dad, send her a message and thank her for spending time with you, how much you enjoyed it and love her and hope to see her again soon.

Suggest something fun with a date, maybe a day out to the theme park or to the beach and ask her when she can make it.

Keep being present, making time for her.

You are not going to solve this over night, esp if your ex is emotionally manipulating her to go back, but you can stand back from his power play and refuse to engage and keep sending her love and letting her you are 100% there for her wherever she sleeps.

This is not a step down , it was an expected side step. That poor girl is trying to juggle both parents and their needs and his case demands/manipulation - which is not right, but it is what it is.
Keep being the positive, loving parent with the door firmly open. She needs to do the freedom programme op, please think about putting her name down.

She's come back tonight to stay for a couple of nights. Hopefully she will have an uneventful school day tomorrow and all the positives will add up over time to equal a much happier girl.

That’s great news. Try to just keep calm, steady and consistent for her - not too OTT or too grateful as she might perceive it as a tug of war and heightened emotions even if too positive might be counterproductive and overwhelming.

Give her space, try not to walk on eggshells - get on with life with the rest of the family.

Teach her how to reflect and put in boundaries with her DF v subtly if needed. If something happens don’t judge him directly ask her how she feels and if she thinks that’s a respectful and kind thing to say / way to behave etc.

www.papyrus-uk.org/

@Alwaystoblame Sounds much more positive and you've done really well these last few days. Just quickly sending you a link for an organisation who specialises in suicide prevention in young people. They may be able to give you both more support around DDs suicidal feelings to help her develop strategies for coping if they crop up again.

Thank you.
She's on her way to school with dd2. She's got up no problems, had breakfast, has clean uniform and has done her homework. This is quite the miracle for all those things. I've told her I'm proud of her and to take things one step at a time today but that she's doing brilliantly.

So pleased to read this. She might hit some more bumps - these things are rarely a straight line - but don’t let them devastate you - trust that she will come through and keep being the St Bernard - calm, consistent, caring but always moving through.

She is likely experiencing the same pattern of abuse you absorbed from your xH but on a fragile child’s emotional psyche. Hard for you all.

DFOD posts are incredible and really great advice.
I always imagine as a parent of teens that are struggling we are the harbour, the rock solid harbour twinkling in the night, and the teens may be out to sea and it can be very choppy but they can return to the harbour at any time to feel the safety and warmth when they are ready - but it has to be their choice.

You are doing brilliantly op.

There may be steps back and sideways and bumps, know in your heart that this is to be expected, don't show disappointment if it happens, but what you are doing now is working. Quietly supporting her, loving her, guiding her through the choppy emotions and ups and downs. Not judging just holding her hand as she finds her way through. A harbour for her in life, a refuge of safety. That is all we can be as parents and it is the greatest gift we can give fledging teens. I agree you are further on than you think, she feels safer with you and she wants to come back slowly but not lose her freedom, a tightrope indeed, but you are managing it beautifully.