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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

New friend pushing boundaries?

56 replies

Definitelymabel · 30/04/2022 08:57

Hi, quick back story.. Single mum with a long-term single dad partner who doesn't live with me (both our choices), 2 children DD5 and DS4.

I've recently become friends with the parents of a girl who my daughter has become close to in reception year.

They seem nice and very friendly and we've been on a few family days out type play dates together, although the last two times it was just the dad, as I've recently learnt the mum suffers with depression so doesn't often have the energy to socialise.

My partner and his kids joined us recently on a beach day, and afterwards he raised some worries he has about the friends dad. He pointed out that twice in the afternoon the dad mentioned having my daughter over for a sleepover, once in front of my DD who got very excited and was begging me to let her (i think she's a bit too young at the minute so had to say no repeatedly).

We were also running late leaving which could have messed with an appointment. As soon as this came up, the friends dad instantly offered to take my 2 kids back to his for an hour or so until after my appointment. As it happened it wasn't needed as we got back to the car on time.

My partner thinks he may have suspicious motives in pushing so hard to get my DD unsupervised, or at the very least he is pushing boundaries which he sees as a red flag.

I'm not so sure and just thought he was a friendly hands on dad type, but maybe I've been a bit charmed?

What's the group feeling on this?

OP posts:
Pinkbonbon · 30/04/2022 10:50

Surprised that so many ppl wpuld be so ok with this. It would have put me right on my guard.

I would assume a decent man would be well aware it was inappropriate to suggest he have your child for an hour unsupervised when you've only met him bloody twice! OK he might have just 'not thought' and spur of the moment offered, but still.

If he suggests something like this again without his wife present I'd be distancing myself big time. Either that or I'd be blunt but jokey and let him know it's probably not wise or appropriate.

Swayingpalmtrees · 30/04/2022 11:24

As a result of my early experiences I have worked along similar lines to your dp op for seventeen years. I know just what he means, some men definitely carry 'a look', something about them that I can recognise immediately. It is unnerving to be able to spot this look even walking a long a street. However I am often struck by how ordinary some of these predators are, how cheerful and very average they are run of the mill Dads and Grandads, nothing obvious at all that you could possibly discern. However they all have one thing in common usually: A total absence of remorse or recognition of the pain they inflict on children and families.

It is highly unusual for fathers to push for sleepovers between little girls, given the natural suspicion that would arise from those types of suggestions, so the fact that he does not seem to know or care about the boundaries that exist, is a massive red flag. The depressed and potentially disengaged mother is also not ideal, you can not rely on her to care or look out for your child. As a result, I wouldn't be comfortable with this arrangement at all. I was horrified to learn when I first started the number of children that have been sexually assaulted with their own parents in the house, often in another room. You can't be too careful.

badhappening · 30/04/2022 11:53

I'm with your partner on this one too.

It's just not worth the risk.

They are way too young and vulnerable.

Vsirbdo · 30/04/2022 12:00

I would listen to your partners gut instinct on this; you don’t need to do much but just be cautious. The sleepover thing seems a bit odd/misjudged to me

Thepossibility · 30/04/2022 12:21

I'm with your partner on this one. I was recently talking about with my brother who is a single dad and he was saying he is cautious about having sleepovers with his DDs friends at a similar age. A dad pushing the idea would make me nervous.

Mellowyellow222 · 30/04/2022 12:21

I always say trust your instincts. It’s better to be overly cautious than put your child in danger.

it is probably innocent - but your partner is picking up on something here. Don’t ignore him.

opensunflower · 30/04/2022 12:29

Cant imagine my partner suggesting a sleep over to a 4 year old

He knows the level of personal care they need at that age and how inappropriate it would be

DowntonCrabby · 30/04/2022 12:33

I’d continue the friendship with the couple and reassure your partner you don’t intend leaving your young DC with anyone any time soon.

I’d shut down any suggestion of a sleepover with “Jane won’t be going for sleepovers for a good few years yet, let’s drop the subject so the girls don’t get their hopes up”

Ourlady · 30/04/2022 12:57

I wouldn’t be letting my 5 year old sleep over at any house whether it was Mum/Dad or either or. Far too young unless it was family or very trusted long term friend

Winter2020 · 30/04/2022 13:12

I once took my eldest to the park when he was in preschool and got chatting to a dad I didn't recognise but we quickly found our children attended the same preschool.

He was very soon telling me how him/his family and some other family take turn to have the children for a night sometimes - it gives the parents a night off/they can go out and the children enjoy it blah blah blah. I probably said "oh that's nice" but I thought no fucking way will my small child be coming to your sleepovers/I am not joining your babysitting circle.

I don't think small children need sleepover with families you don't know - and by don't know I mean not your oldest/closest friends or family who can do you a favour if you need it.

Even years later when their kids were 6 or 7 years old friends were having kids for sleepovers and having to phone their parents at midnight because they were homesick and wanted to go home - no thanks.

Catupatree123 · 30/04/2022 13:17

This person has a wife though so I assume wouldn't have been alone with the kids whilst you were at the appointment or during the sleepover? Caution is important though and even if they were innocent suggestions don't do anything you're uncomfortable with.

Clymene · 30/04/2022 13:26

Catupatree123 · 30/04/2022 13:17

This person has a wife though so I assume wouldn't have been alone with the kids whilst you were at the appointment or during the sleepover? Caution is important though and even if they were innocent suggestions don't do anything you're uncomfortable with.

She might not be well enough to leave the bedroom. She might not even be in the house.

I would feel very uneasy with anyone suggesting a sleepover to a small child, especially more than once in the same afternoon. 🚩

Quartz2208 · 30/04/2022 13:29

Neither of mine had sleepovers until they were 8/9 so I think that is just the boundary you make very clear to him and your daughter

lollipoprainbow · 30/04/2022 13:35

Yes I'm sure he's a raging paedophile, jees what is it with mumsnet and all men being painted as perverts etc. Poor sod was probably just trying to be nice and helpful, can't be easy for him if he has to deal with a child and a wife with depression.

Mellowyellow222 · 30/04/2022 13:42

lollipoprainbow · 30/04/2022 13:35

Yes I'm sure he's a raging paedophile, jees what is it with mumsnet and all men being painted as perverts etc. Poor sod was probably just trying to be nice and helpful, can't be easy for him if he has to deal with a child and a wife with depression.

But it’s about instincts. Unfortunately awful things do happen to children.

the girls are very young for sleepovers - and it was silly for this man to diggers it infront of the children. He is probably just a bit of an idiot - but his behaviour raised a red flag for this woman’s partner.

so why take the risk? The child is far too young for a sleep over and you really need to trust someone before you leave such a small child alone with them.

if a woman got a vibe from someone the majority of people here would be telling her to trust her instincts

Quartz2208 · 30/04/2022 13:59

lollipoprainbow · 30/04/2022 13:35

Yes I'm sure he's a raging paedophile, jees what is it with mumsnet and all men being painted as perverts etc. Poor sod was probably just trying to be nice and helpful, can't be easy for him if he has to deal with a child and a wife with depression.

Yes but it isnt fair to try and solve that by inviting the OPs DD over for a sleepover (which I suspect is the real motivation here).

It is too much pressure to put on a 5 year old and pushing boundaries for the OP isnt on either

Catlover1970 · 30/04/2022 14:40

Definitelymabel · 30/04/2022 08:57

Hi, quick back story.. Single mum with a long-term single dad partner who doesn't live with me (both our choices), 2 children DD5 and DS4.

I've recently become friends with the parents of a girl who my daughter has become close to in reception year.

They seem nice and very friendly and we've been on a few family days out type play dates together, although the last two times it was just the dad, as I've recently learnt the mum suffers with depression so doesn't often have the energy to socialise.

My partner and his kids joined us recently on a beach day, and afterwards he raised some worries he has about the friends dad. He pointed out that twice in the afternoon the dad mentioned having my daughter over for a sleepover, once in front of my DD who got very excited and was begging me to let her (i think she's a bit too young at the minute so had to say no repeatedly).

We were also running late leaving which could have messed with an appointment. As soon as this came up, the friends dad instantly offered to take my 2 kids back to his for an hour or so until after my appointment. As it happened it wasn't needed as we got back to the car on time.

My partner thinks he may have suspicious motives in pushing so hard to get my DD unsupervised, or at the very least he is pushing boundaries which he sees as a red flag.

I'm not so sure and just thought he was a friendly hands on dad type, but maybe I've been a bit charmed?

What's the group feeling on this?

As you said your daughter is far too young to go on a sleepover - just be firm and keep your kids with you

caecilius1 · 30/04/2022 14:46

I'd listen to your partner too. As for the sleepovers at 4; that alone would set my alarm bells ringing never mind my partner's.

saraclara · 30/04/2022 14:50

He's not inviting her to a sleepover where he's in sole charge. He has a wife.
If she'd been the one to suggest the sleepover, the adults in the house would have been exactly the same combination. I don't know why so many posters have reacted as if he's a single dad.

And yes, it's perfectly fine to think your child is not old enough, and I'd agree. He was thoughtless suggesting it in front of your child, but that's the only issue I can see.

This thread makes me realise how crap it must be to be a single dad though.

Aquamarine1029 · 30/04/2022 14:56

Your barely even know this man, actually you don't know him at all. I'm in agreement with your partner. No way would I let my kids go with him or stay at his house unsupervised by you.

caecilius1 · 30/04/2022 15:02

I'd think the same of a woman who suggested a sleepover for 4 year olds @saraclara, whether it was within the children's hearing range or not. To me, it shows a lack of judgment whatever the parent's sex.

thecoffeewasthething · 30/04/2022 15:05

This thread makes me realise how crap it must be to be a single dad though.

Think how crap it is for a child subjected to sexual abuse, maybe.

If it's "crap" to be a single dad, then men need to stop being the vast percent of perpetrators. They don't wear signs or have a "look" (this is such a dangerous pov - abusers are ordinary).

Keeping children safe from potential abuse trumps feelings of adults every single time.

mast0650 · 30/04/2022 15:13

This seems like perfectly normal friendly behaviour from the parent of your daughter's friend who you have had a number of family days out with. Nothing on its own to be suspicious about. However, I think your daughter probably is fairly young for a sleepover on her own and I'd wait until she's a bit older and you all know them a bit better.

TheVolturi · 30/04/2022 15:14

I agree with your partner but the namalt crew will always disagree. I'd say to the guy, my child is far too young for sleepovers. The end.

Clymene · 30/04/2022 15:15

I'm a single mum @saraclara. I have never ever asked if a child wants to come for a sleepover. It's always been child led. Which is the way it should be.

And I'd expect anyone to be a bit Hmm if I asked.