Am I being gaslighted?

[Whatsinaname321]

Can somebody please explain gaslighting and narcissistic behaviour to me.
I am trying to work out of that is what is going on here if I am being unfair.

Gaslighting is telling you things, about yourself or about them/their actions, that just aren't true but doing it so convincingly that you start to think that maybe you're wrong and they are right. Narcissists are big users of gaslighting as a technique.

Go online for proper definitions of narcissists. But in my experience, they present as people who really do just believe that their thinking, their needs, their wants are not just the most important, but the only valid ones, and who will do whatever it takes to meet those. They cannot and do not take responsibility for their own actions or behaviour (except when highlighting how BRILLIANT they are).

Does it feel rubbish to you, @Whatsinaname321 ?

Have you seen Sliding Doors? The cheating boyfriend denies when challenged that there were 2 brandy glasses in the bedroom. He says that Helen was drunk and had just had a knock to the head, making her doubt her own recollection. That's gaslighting. Making you doubt your own experience and being manipulated into believing their version.

Yes it’s feels rubbish.
whenever I tell him that I am am unhappy with his attitude or something he has done then it’s gets twisted and somehow becomes my fault and I am the reason for it happening.
it definitely feels like I am Being gaslighted.

He is convinced he is a good person and doing a good job at everything and that I am being unreasonable.

My dh called me a lazy cow during an argument. No big deal. When I brought it up at a later date, he refused to believe he ever said such a thing. He said I had insulted him and he was mortally offended that I could even think such a thing of him. I ended up wondering if I had really heard him (even though I can remember where and when he said it as I was so surprised when he said it)

that is gaslighting.

I now keep a journal, and write things down pretty much when things happen. More so I can believe myself than to try and catch him out.

OK. When someone makes you feel rubbish, and you tell them that, calmly, they will, if they respect you, feel sorry that they've upset you. Defending their ego, as he does, demonstrates that, to him, the most important thing is that he is right, rather than your feelings.

Instead of trying to give the right label to his behaviour, think about if you actually want to have a relationship with someone who makes you feel like this.

Do you?

No, I don’t want a relationship with him. I’m just scared of the whole divorce process and splitting of assets and being blamed for the failure of the marriage. I am
planning to divorce, just trying to get all my ducks in a row within the next couple of months. As soon as my child is done with his GCSE exams then I can push forward with a divorce.

My husband is as you describe yours. He says things and then later denies having said it.
he tries to convince me that I am making it all up.
a journal, logging incidents is an excellent idea.

Are you still with a man that called you this?

Your marriage isn't failing because of you - your shite life is ending.. And a new one awaits.
He can't accept you ending it means he loses control.

You bloody well can do this op..

He says things and then later denies having said it. He tries to convince me that I am making it all up.

This is classic narcissistic gaslighting. The reverse is telling you that you said things you know you never said. Another, more subtle version is him seeming angry at you for no reason and when you ask what's going on, accusing you of being off with him or thinking unpleasant/unfair things about him. Like, "When you asked me how work was, you sounded like you were accusing me of taking the day off work." No such thought may have occurred to you, but now you feel prevented from thinking that what he's said is true (and it probably is).

Another version is "You think you're so perfect, don't you? You think you're so much better than me." This can be an especially confusing one because although you don't think you're perfect at all, after he's been acting like an asshole for years, you may well feel as though he's not really the great person he makes himself out to be. So there's a grain of truth twisted in with a harsh and unfair accusation.

I’m just scared of the whole divorce process and splitting of assets and being blamed for the failure of the marriage.

Having been through the wringer of an abusive relationship with a narcissist, I can assure you that there is a lot of freedom in embracing 'blame' and being the 'bad guy'.

My ex hid hundreds of thousands of dollars from me, gaslighted and criticised me for years, and blamed me for anything he could. When I figured all this out and told him I wanted to separate, of course the divorce was "my fault" because he "knew he'd made mistakes and truly wanted to change and go to counselling to fix things but I just refused".

Yep, I did refuse. I knew counselling would be pointless because I'd seen the same patterns from him over and over again. I knew he'd been in counselling before with previous partners and hadn't learned anything, I knew he regularly 'forgot' what actually happened and revised the past to recast himself as the hero or the victim. I knew his big promises would be followed by a brief burst of effort that rapidly tailed off and if I remarked on this, I'd be moaned at that "change takes time" and "you can't expect me to be perfect" until I was worn down enough to stop. Of course, he didn't accept any of this and insisted that I was mistaken in my view of him and 'everything was different now'.

When you stop hoping that your husband will validate your experience, you are free to make choices that work for you. Accept the 'blame' for the end of your relationship. Agree that you simply can't see things the same way as he does and that's called 'having irreconcilable differences'. Admit that you cannot be as forgiving as he wants you to be. Acknowledge that you're not a big enough person to get over the various ways you feel he's betrayed you or let you down.

Take the blame. Because in the end, the 'blame' is as light as a feather compared to the crushing weight of confusion, self-doubt and despair that is part of being in a relationship with a narcissist.

Thank you cheekyhobson, your detailed reply was really really helpful in helping me to see my situation clearly and make sense of things.
I feel I have taken the first step by recognising by this as gaslighting and realising that I don’t want to put up with this for the rest of my life.

Its not failure to walk away from something that causes you suffering. It's strength and wisdom.

His sort like to make you feel that any kind of self care or desire to have your needs met - is weakness. Because they want you only focused on their needs.

They paint your hurt at their horrible behaviour as 'hysteria', 'oversensitity' or straight up crazy (this is an example of gaslighting btw) so that you feel you don't have a right to your perfectly valid feelings.

It is one of the sickest things one human can do to another.

Please know that your feelings are valid.
AAnd this cage he has trapped you in, should be destroyed.

I feel I have taken the first step by recognising by this as gaslighting and realising that I don’t want to put up with this for the rest of my life

This is very, very good, OP. You may have some complicated practical steps ahead of you, but emotionally, this is a massive hurdle you've put behind you.

@Whatsinaname321 I'm so glad to hear it was helpful. I found reading up on narcissism and even borderline personality disorder (there is often crossover between mental disorders) was very helpful in learning to identify and name my partner's specific behaviours, understand what was behind them and so see the patterns much more clearly.

It's also helpful to read up on how partners of people with serious mental health or addiction issues can become co-dependent or act as 'caretakers'. You will likely start to identify and name behaviours in yourself that are designed to 'manage' your difficult partner (eg soothing them, de-escalating conflict by taking responsibility for problems that aren't yours to solve (like them experiencing uncomfortable feelings), avoiding conflict by becoming hypervigilant about their moods and needs, denying reality and/or your own feelings, reducing contact with your friends and family because your partner is negative about them behind their backs or behaves in embarrassing/rude ways in social situations, etc).

I think the journal is a great idea. It can be a sense check for you, and a reminder to help you keep focussed on leaving. It may be helpful in the divorce process, and in the future. When you worry about being blamed for the divorce, remind yourself of the things in that journal. (Keep it ultra safe from him won't you).

And don't worry about being blamed for the divorce. You already know that he deflects and gas lights as he can't ever be on the wrong, so he will blame you of course. But you know the truth. And you can confide in those close to you so they know the truth as well. Noone else's opinion matters. And it will be over soon enough an 'yesterday's news' to most people.

You deserve so much better. Don't let this vile man stop you leaving because you're worried what people will think.

I’ve been and had a free half an hour with a solicitor. I had one a couple of years ago but it wasn’t very helpful so I have been to see another.
basically, it is unlikely I am going to come out of this with enough money to house my children. There is not enough money in the pot to house both me and my husband separately. If I get 60% -70% in a divorce settlement it won’t be enough to buy a property.
of course I don’t want to leave him penniless and take it all but I do want to put a roof over the Childrens heads.
I feel like I am destined to be stuck in this horrible situation forever.

Owning a property is not the be all and end all of everything. It would be better to sell the house and rent than to continue to live a half life with this man. Also, you are entitled to include any funds in pensions etc in the marital pot so it is worth knowing what he has in his pension and what you do too. If he has a much bigger pension you might be able to hold on to more of the house equity in exchange. Do you work? Could you take over the mortgage payments etc

No, I don’t want a relationship with him. I’m just scared of the whole divorce process and splitting of assets and being blamed for the failure of the marriage

He had taught you to care what he thinks. Honestly, it doesn't matter

Yes I do work but would probably be unable to continue working as a single parent. I could afford to take on the mortgage payments based on my current income but I wouldn’t be able to take on a bigger mortgage to buy him out of his share of the equity.
renting is not really an option anywhere nearby where we currently live. Rental prices are ridiculous, there is a massive shortage of available rental properties and those that do come onto the market get snapped up by people who are in full time well paid employment.

And yes he has a bigger pension pot that me. But it isn’t huge. I know what we both have in pensions and have factored it in as advised by the solicitor.

Why can't you continue working as a single parent? You say your child is getting ready for GCSE exams so they must be in their mid-teens at least. Are there younger children too?

Yes there are younger children and we have been unable to find childcare locally and are currently just about able to manage my juggling school runs and school holidays between me and my husband. Some of my shifts are unsociable hours so wraparound care wouldn’t be feasible.

And I don’t want to get into a situation where I am separated from my husband but still at his mercy to assist with the kids so I can work.
I need to be independent.

So I have been thinking all night. I just need to get out of this situation. I don’t know how I will make it work financially but I will find a way.
Im ready for the blame game.
my husbands behaviour is impacting on our youngest children. Whilst I can tolerate a lot of crap for myself, it’s horrible watching my children be upset by the person who is their dad.
only a few more months until GCSEs are complete.