Questions about childhood / relationship with mother

[Knitternatter]

Hi, sorry for the long post. I was hoping I could get some perspective on this. I feel that my childhood has greatly impacted my life now, I think it would be fair to class my childhood as abusive but the only other person that would be able to confirm this is my sister and she won’t talk about it. I’ve been doing a lot of thinking recently and feel that my low self esteem and anxiety may well be a result of this (but I’m not sure). Would you class the below as abusive? I also feel so strongly that I don’t want to parent my DS the way I was parented or make him feel the way I did. For info I grew up with just my mum and older sister - no other parent involved.

1. We would be hit with a leather belt as punishment. I don’t remember much of this but I do remember it was my sister that bore the main brunt of it until one day she buried it in the back garden.

1. A lot of what I think is emotional abuse. Being told by my mum that she wished she never had us. I can’t remember her ever telling us she loved us. Locking us out of the house for hours at a time. A regular favourite punishment of hers was to send us to bed for DAYS on end. This meant no books, playing etc just lying in bed all day. We were called down for meals then sent back up again. I actually had to sneak out of the house to sit one of my GCSEs as I had been sent to bed for the day that I had my exam and when I told her she told me I wasn’t allowed to go (I waited for her to go to work and snuck out). I remember spending my 9th birthday in bed. She would also get really cross sometimes and smash picture frames with our pictures in etc on the floor.

1. Just weird punishments really. I remember once I must have been about 11 or 12 and I stole my sisters tampons. I didn’t know what to do with them and so tried using them, then ended up hiding them in my drawer. When she found out she cut all my hair off (she did take me to the hairdresser to rectify it but the only thing they could do was give me a pixie cut as it was so short). I remember once when I was about 5 she had arranged a birthday party for me. My sister did something on the morning (can’t remember what and it wouldn’t have been that bad as we were both terrified of her). She cancelled the party and told me it was my sisters fault. Several times she gave away our pets as a punishment for something. She made my sister go to school in her pyjamas once when she was 14 as a punishment.

1. When I was a teenager she refused to acknowledge me in the mornings quite regularly, I would say good morning and be ignored. She would also pull up at the house after work and end up sitting in the car reading a paper for at least an hour regularly before coming in and would then give me the silent treatment. We could never really afford holidays and had 3 that I remember, but once we went camping in Cornwall (about a 6 hour drive away). I asked if I could set the tent up as I was really excited to do it. I did it but set it facing the wind apparently - she ordered me to pack it up, she packed everything back in the car and drove the 6 hours back home in silence. I once poured sour, mouldy milk on my cereal (didn’t realise it had gone off). She made me eat it. Got a summer job once when I was 16 and got myself an expensive sporty coat with some of my wages - the same day she made me clear up the dogs shit with it so obviously it went in the bin. I wasn’t allowed to brush my teeth for a week once at primary school.

1. Just a lot of random stuff really. I think she got pleasure out of seeing me disappointed. I remember once I asked if I could go out to the youth club with some friends (rarely got to do things like that as I wasn’t allowed to other peoples houses and we weren’t allowed friends over to ours so didn’t see friends out of school). To my surprise she said yes so I got ready and was really excited, then just before I was about to leave she asked how I was going to pay to get in with a smile on her face (I had no pocket money so no way of paying the fee to get in and so couldn’t go).

1. She would send us off on ‘hunts’ for various things around the house for hours as she was sure we had taken them. They never turned up and we had never taken them in the first place.

For reference we were good kids, we didn’t do anything really awful as like I said we were petrified of her. The punishments etc were for things such as bickering with each other or leaving light switches on etc.

Now I’ve read it back it doesn’t actually seem that bad but would appreciate thoughts.

Hope you are feeling ok this morning @Knitternatter.

I can't read without commenting @knitternatter if only to say I'm so sorry about your childhood and really hope you stop thinking it wasn't that bad. Your post made me well up with tears. I hope you and your sister both manage to heal over time

@BlueFlavour morning, I’m ok thank you. I feel a little bit overwhelmed at the responses to be honest. One lovely member has also sent a lovely private message to me which I am going to respond to, I just need a bit of time to process everything I think! I’m just surprised because I thought the responses would be more in support of my mum, I also feel a little bad because I didn’t intend this to turn into a witch hunt or to slate her, I genuinely do think she loved us but had her own trauma to deal with that impacted her parenting of us. Regardless, this thread has really opened my eyes to the fact I would benefit from therapy and I’ve ordered a few books already as recommended on here. Thank you for checking in on me :)

Ah glad you are ok. You can separate the behaviour from the person. She was responsible for what she did, and also responsible for her own healing. You both did nothing to deserve what happened to you, you are blameless. Be clear about that. I truly hope you find a way to honour your own pain, shame and sadness.

I don’t think that having your mother in your life now would help you with that. Focus on yourself.
Wishing you all the very very best.
Your op was absolutely heartbreaking.

She perhaps made a terrible choice here not to love.

Your mother had a choice when it came to you two as her daughters and she chose to abuse you both. She may well have had the same done to her as a child and if that is so she repeated the same with you two. She never sought nor even perhaps wanted to seek the necessary help. I am saddened that seemingly no other adult knew what was going on at "home" and you two slipped through the cracks.

You've had an abusive childhood at her hands yet you do not treat your own child like you were. You've chosen not to do that and to do things differently. You also have qualities that your mother completely lacks; empathy and insight.

What happened to your father?. I ask only as he has not been mentioned.

@BlueFlavour thank you, I never intended to upset people with it or trigger other peoples experiences. It’s bizarre I almost didn’t post it as it sounded trivial when I read it back, but obviously I have got the clarification that it wasn’t ok by the responses which is what I needed. Thanks again it really means a lot ❤️

@AttilaTheMeerkat thank you. This is the thing though, she did have empathy for others, but not for us. She would go out of her way for neighbours etc to the point we used to say to each other that she cared more about the elderly lady down the road than she did for us. He left when I was born. We both have no contact with him / don’t know where he is or if he’s still alive. My sisters friend rang childline once and I think (I was too young to remember properly) that a social worker or someone visited us. It wasn’t taken any further and my sister was massively punished for having told her friends about our home life.

You poor thing. Yes you were abused, physically and psychologically. Your mother sounds cruel and unhinged

Image to abusers is all important; they like to present a wholesome image to those in the outside world.

I am so sorry to read that your father left when you were born. He also failed you.

Am glad your sister's friend tried to help by calling Childline so somebody did notice entailing someone official visiting your home. That visitor was met by your mother who showed said person a tidy home, gave well practiced answers and otherwise behaved impeccibly around that person to make them think there is nothing wrong.

napac.org.uk/

Dreadful behaviour by your mother. She abused those two young and innocent children instead of cherishing and caring for them. Maybe it was learned from her own parents when she was a child, but that's no excuse. Wishing you well for the future OP

That is heartbreaking op and absolutely not trivial. You didn't deserve that childhood and I'm so sorry you went through it.

You've done amazingly well to become the person and mother you are now. Nobody on earth could grow up like that and not be impacted as an adult. You deserve support and love now to try to heal. If it helps you to realise that it isn't trivial, can you try to imagine those things happening to another child and how you'd view that?

.

What Happened to You? Conversations on Trauma, Resilience, and Healing g.co/kgs/nDvCHZ

Read or listen on audible , it will help you to heal and gain understanding, best wishes to you

@Knitternatter
You really haven’t upset me, only in that I feel desperately sorry for the children that you were. You don’t owe me an apology, and I guess most people on this thread feel the same.
You have been brave in posting about your childhood, you really have. I hope it’s the first step towards getting your feelings into the light, and hopefully managing to let go of stuff that was never yours in the first place. You have done so well in stopping the generational abuse.

My mother was emotionally abusive and neglectful, as I think her mother was. It’s taken EVERYTHING I’ve got not to repeat that pattern.
That’s not nothing @Knitternatter, that’s everything. Courage

@Knitternatter

Now I’ve read it back it doesn’t actually seem that bad but would appreciate thoughts.

OP everything you've written in your post shows the actions of a cruel person, who actively planned and enjoyed being cruel to you and your so sister. This is abusive behaviour, to her own children and who had few defences against her, so yes, it is that bad.

She may have had her own problems but she had a responsibility to you and to your sister not to visit those problems on you, but to do the very best she could do for you both. In a way the fact that she's gone NC with you is some type of positive as it gives you some physical and mental space from her. I would add to those suggesting you get some professional counselling, even though it may be difficult for you to talk to them initially. I would also suggest that you write down everything you can remember from your childhood and show her - you have been so articulate here: that may help.

We would be hit with a leather belt as punishment. I don’t remember much of this but I do remember it was my sister that bore the main brunt of it until one day she buried it in the back garden.

This was so sad reading. I know what it's life to be beaten by a parent with a leather belt. In my case, it was my father. Strange - he never beat my brothers.

I hope that one day your sister, as well as you, will find the help and peace you both need. 🌹

Hi, Op, I hope you are well, I'm sitting here in tears as I could have written your post. And added a million other things. My childhood is lost and I have no one to forgive, as my mum died when I was a teen, the abuse didn't, and was just carried on by another family member. She quite definitely had MH issues, and should never have been allowed to have kids.

I have children (grown) who know they are loved and cherished every single day. I made a promise when I finally escaped at 18, that if I ever had kids, I would do time for anyone who ever raised a hand to them. My abuse was horrific, and it continued with abusive relationships until I was 49...
It was only at that age that I sought therapy to find out why I picked the type of relationships that continued that abuse.
I was in therapy weekly for a year, I came out of it with many tools and a greater understanding of my situation. I cried many tears for that lost little girl, who tried her whole life to please everyone, to prove that I deserved to beloved, to stop the abuse. I unfortunately haven't been able to help her, she is the part of me that will always need to prove she is worthy, I've been able to acknowledge that she is there, and when she appears every so often, I am able to comfort her, cry her tears and then tuck her into her safe place, with a kiss and an acknowledgement that she is loved.
My point in this is that my abuse is the reason I am the person I am today, I have never used it as an excuse for my behaviour, so I will never accept that because my mum was abused, that made it inevitable that I would abuse too. I have children who can look back on their childhood, and their every day lives, knowing that their mum loved/loves them unconditionally and always will.

I feel for you but know that you will get there one day, and though the past won't change, your future is yours to carve out, for you and your beautiful children, and when your lost little girl that you were, cries, just tell her that all will be OK, and that she is safe with you now xxx

@Knitternatter you sound like a self reflective, caring and loving mother. That’s amazing given the awful experience your own mother gave you. I am sure that you can really help mother yourself as you mother your child- love and compassion and be kind to yourself. Even if and when you get things wrong, as we all do as people and mothers. But be kind and be your own “mother” as you sound like an amazing person to have overcome this.
Do you have friends or a partner to speak to as well?

You are breaking the cycle OP - I don’t know you but I am proud of you for doing that Toxic Parents by Susan Forward might be useful to read.

I would also recommend any books by Alice Miller. She did a right number on you OP. Please also get therapy so you can face this clearly. That will help your child so much as otherwise you will blindly continue the abuse and neglect. That isn't judgement it's just until we can recognise the mistreatment we are blind to seeing it in other places. You can go back and reclaim your abandoned child though, the work is all your own but you will recover and regain your own life.

Just to add my voice that you experienced horrific, sadistic abuse. None of that was in any way normal, that's some of the most awful stuff I've read about abusive childhoods. But the fact that you've reached out and are breaking the cycle is massive, absolutely huge. Do get therapy, maybe check out the BAPC website for counsellors, but just the fact you are addressing this means you will not repeat it with your child, I'd bet money on that. I went through far less, but therapy helped me let go of the anger that I used as a shield against a frightening world for so many years, maybe that's the flip side of anxiety.

When you are a tiny baby your life was totally dependant on your mother to provide food and shelter so even though she was horribly abusive you would blame yourself rather than your mother as your psyche couldn't cope with the possibility that she was inadequate and might abandon you as that would lead to death.
That part of your psyche will continue to defend your mother but you must try and look beyond that and feel the anger and rage that your infant self had to repress and instead internalised

Reading your first post made me want to cry. What horrible cruelty you've been through

Yes, what you went through is severe abuse: emotional and physical. When we are children, we have no choice but to try to bond with our parents, even if they are abusive, so your confusion and difficulty in naming this as abuse isn’t surprising. I am guessing you also grew up hearing that your mother was wonderful and was run ragged with the burden of having such troublesome children.

I’m glad you are considering talking therapy; I think it will help a great deal. I would recommend finding someone who knows about working with complex relational trauma, sometimes called attachment trauma. Best wishes!

It did shock me most at the end of reading your first post that you read it back and didn't think it was that bad , I honestly felt like crying for the young girls you describe and the you now.
You sound lovely by the way and I'm sorry you had to go through this.