Marriage advice

[MaryPoppinsChildminding]

Hi,
I'm sorry this could be a long one.
Here's some background on my relationship with my husband. We're both 39. We've known each other since we were babies. We grew up together, went to the same school, lived round the corner from each other. He was my first proper boyfriend at 16. My first love. At the same time, aged 15, my mental health issues first began. I suffered with anxiety, depression and anorexia. We separated. He went off to uni to become a teacher. I was very intelligent and was told I could make Oxbridge, however, my declining health meant that I couldn't go.
I spent the next 4 years barely leaving the house. I was agoraphobic.
He came home from uni. He came to see me at my parents house. We hit it off again. We fell back in love. I told him all of my problems and he said he would support me. He got a job in Bedford.... We lived in Yorkshire and he asked me to move with him. I did. I got my first job there and I felt well.
However, not long after we got there, he started going out alot and ignoring me. He had a very close relationship with a work colleague but I never found anything out. He'd go out alot without me. I found messages on his phone from a girl he'd been meeting when out with his friends. She was saying we need to meet alone next time. I confronted him and he was very sorry.
We kept going and I became pregnant which was a shock. I was 23. When I have birth to our son, he proposed to me.
We moved back to Yorkshire to be around our families and we bought our first house.
A year later we got married. However, on our wedding day his mum suffered a brain heomarriage (sp) and sadly died. It was an enormous shock. It knocked him sideways. After this he started gambling and this has been a problem ever since. He is a gambling addict and at one point lost over 20,000 pounds of our money.
Ever since this event, 13 years ago, we have been up and down.
His drinking got worse.... He is an alcoholic and he has admitted this.
He's had help for gambling but he never stuck to it.
After I had our daughter in 2010, I became a full time mum. We made that decision together, but he's thrown it back in my face for years. I had our third child in 2013 and our fourth in 2017.
Over the years, he has been quite emotionally abusive towards me. It got so bad that I rung women's aid as I never believed that what he was doing was abuse, but my close friends said it was. I wanted clarification from those who know and they said in fact, it was abuse.
He once absolutely laid into me verbally on a bus full of people, saying a was a lazy bitch, a fat cow etc etc.... Also in front of our children. He told me he hoped our third daughter would die in the womb. Hesxsaud such vicious things and made me feel so unloved and bad about myself. I've suffered mentally on and off since I was 15, and he constantly gets on at me for it. There's no understanding.
Anyway, during the pandemic, I was declining. I was focused on the kids and home schooling. He was sat every evening texting a woman from work. He would phone her when I went to bed.
He had an emotional affair. His stinking got worse, his gambling got worse. March last year, he left me. He told me he was moving in with her after two weeks. My whole world fell apart. I was so, so I'll and heartbroken. I begged him not to go.
He came back but did so on the agreement he would do whatever he wants, not do anything with the kids, have all Co trol of the money etc....
The past year, he sits and watches football every evening and every weekend. I'm not allowed to watch anything to relax on an evening. He says he should do this as he works and I don't. He doesn't realise how busy I am. I'm also setting up my own business right now. His dad died of cancer in October and his drinking and gambling are again worse. He gambles every day. He sits in pubs all day on his own, drinking and watching horse racing. He still sees her every day at work and told me he would never stop being her friend as they're very close. He moans at me if I spend any money and it's rarely anything for me other than medical things.
He told me he doesn't want to be a dad. He would rather leave so he can suit himself.
I'm so scared to be left alone.
But I can't cope like this anymore.
My friends tell me I need to let him go.
I just want some outside advice.
He's not a bad man. Deep down he's a decent bloke. But he has addictions, and unless he stopped those, I can see him always being like this.
I love my children so much. He can't stand them being my priority. He says he should come first. My eldest is now started to play up and I think it's because of how his dad is as he feels he doesn't care about him....
I really need some outside input please.

He's not a bad man. Deep down he's a decent bloke.

He is a bad man. He's not a decent bloke, on any level.

Your children are and always will be affected by is behaviour and how he treats you.

You say you're scared to be left alone. How about turning it round and seeing the potential peace and calmness you'll have from choosing not to have him in your life? The prospect of things are usually a lot more scary than the reality.

He's not going to get any better. His abuse will probably get worse and your self esteem and health will deteriorate further.

Do you think you could speak to Women's Aid again?

Sorry you are going through this. Maybe you could start mentally detaching from him week by week to become strong enough to leave with an exit plan? Seek advice from your GP or counselling support if you feel you are not coping perhaps. It’ sounds like an awful environment for the children also

He is an abusive shit, and your children are learning that this is what a relationship looks like.
Your friends told you he is abusive, Women’s Aid told you he is abusive, yet you stay.
You need to make the move, no one can do it for you.

He's not a bad man. Deep down he's a decent bloke. But he has addictions, and unless he stopped those, I can see him always being like this

Good grief! Are you kidding? He sounds like an absolute nightmare of a man. If you won a million pounds on the lottery tomorrow, and could buy a lovely house for you and your children, would you do that, or would you stay in this hell?

• He gambles
• He loses family money
• He's an alcoholic
• He doesn't want to be a Dad to your children - his own kids!!
• He emotionally abuses you
• He financially abuses you
• He sleeps with other women
• He doesn't love you

In my opinion, he's the only man you've ever really known, so you don't have any other men to compare him to.

But this is not normal on any level.

Because you've only known him, you are minimising what are divorce warranting behaviours.

He sounds like an absolute Pig, and if you were my daughter, I would be pleading you to escape this hell hole of a life.

This is easily one of the absolute worst posts I've ever read on here, and that's saying something.

Any normal, loving, family man would worship your feet, for giving him 4 children, and for raising them and holding the fort at home. All money would be shared. He would treat you. He would arrange a babysitter and take you on dates. He would help with childcare and household chores on the weekends. You would have family time
together in the evenings and weekends, doing fun stuff together, like cinema, bowling, meals out etc. He would arrange holidays for you all. He would bring you flowers. He would put the kids to bed sometimes, and cook you a candlelit dinner to thank you for all the graft you are doing for his children.

But in your case, he leaves you alone and pisses off to the pub to drink, gamble and flirt with other women. It's all very "1970".

Fuck him off. How dare he?

Start looking at your finances. Can you afford to leave? You are entitled to half his pension. You will be entitled to some benefits. You (as the woman) get all Child benefit. What maintenance would he need to pay you if you split? I doubt he'd want the kids over much, so you'd get the maximum amount. What does he earn? Make copies of his payslips (because he will lie to CMS about his earnings).

Start to build a picture of what leaving looks like to you financially. Can you do it? Can your parents help? I would get in there first, because this fucker is going to leave you anyway, so best to be well informed.

Start getting angry! How is your relationship with your Mum? A sit down conversation would be good.

I can hear that you are scared. It sounds like you are scared of being alone. What I’d ask is, what does he bring to your relationship? He is unfaithful, he scares you (and I assume the DC) he rules the house and you can’t choose anything, he is (as alcoholics and gamblers are) unreliable and unpredictable. You love him, but if he left what is it that you will miss?

The thing is, your love and your fear mean nothing changes, he gets to do what he wants, to be abusive and threatening and scary, as and when he chooses (and it is a choice). If nothing changes, nothing will change. For your sake, for your children’s sake, get our. Go back to Womens Aid, get legal advice, see your GP and talk this through with anyone who can give you real life support. He is nasty and dangerous. And your life is short-is this what you want it to be? Is it what you want your kids to have modelled?

And, I just wanted to say, I have been in a semi-abusive relationship. Nowhere near as bad as yours, but he used to drink and fawn over other women. Some low level violence, like grabbing my hair or kicking me under the table. I was with him for 20 years, but walked away. Me and my kids were fine. I now have a lovely DH. Let's compare the list :

Does he gamble? No

Does he lose family money? No

Is he an alcoholic? - drinks on the weekends, but then so do I - we end up being silly and laughing a lot.

Is he a good Dad? - He doesn't have children of his own, but he is a good stepdad to mine. Helped raise them. They are now adults.

Does he emotionally abuse me? No. And if he tried he'd get a fuck off from me.

Does he financially abuse me? - No, I have my own money and he has his (both earn similar).

Does he sleep with other women? Hell no.

Does he flirt or text with other women? No! Or he'd be out on his arse!

Does he love me? Tells me that he does every day, so I guess so.

I should have added another question - Is he present? Your DH is not psychically present, he's always at the pub. He's not emotionally present either, for you or your poor kids.

It's Friday today. What are your plans for tonight? Has he planned family time for you and your children, as a family?

My DH went shopping after work yesterday, and bought everything we need for a romantic meal tonight. He left this morning with a kiss and an "I love you" saying how much he was looking forward to our evening together, and that he would do all the cooking when he got home from work.

My DD is 23, and has a lovely OH. He meets her from work if it's dark and walks her home. He often has a cooked meal ready for her, and on Friday nights, she gets greeted with a cocktail after work. He takes her for dinner most weekends. He's always buying her little gifts and leaving her lovely little notes.

I'm not saying any of this to be smug, btw. I'm trying to give you a comparison. He should be worshiping the very ground you walk on. Of course me and my DH have rows, as does DD and her OH. Life isn't all roses, but the foundations need to be good. I don't think your DH s building those foundations with you.

What did you learn about relationships when you were growing up?.

What are you getting out of this relationship now?. And you're afraid of being alone; truth be told you're alone now within this marriage and that is truly a dark place to be in.

Feel the fear and do it anyway. Free yourself and your kids from this terrible half existence. You still have a choice here re this man, your children do not. Like BlondeDogLady has written I have also seen many such similar posts over the years and yours is right up there as one of the worst I've ever read. He targeted you deliberately also as you were very vulnerable and in a bad place yourself when you met. In his eyes that made you all the more attractive for he to get his claws into.

What do you want to teach your children about relationships and what are they learning here?. This is patently no model to be showing them and for them to potentially emulate as adults.

If your children as adults were describing this to you, what would your advice be?. Would you say it would be to stay with their abuser because its somehow "easier" or because they'd be alone?. No you would not say that to them.

You are likely confusing love here also with codependency; a feeling which you have anyway and he has further engendered in this dysfunctional and abusive relationship. Codependency and alcoholism for instance go hand in hand. His needs are NOT more important than your own. Make yourself heard now and make better choices for you and your kids going forward. Staying as you are now is not an option.

AttilaTheMeerkat speaks great sense, as always.

I grew up in a similar family dynamic. My Dad was an alcoholic (although highly functioning). He was very verbally abusive towards my Mum. Always throwing things, or threatening violence. Although he never did hit her (I know this). But there were never any other women, and no gambling. But, even the disrespect and constant shouting at my Mum, and the regular boozy sessions at the pub were awful enough. It took me a long time to make peace with it, and even though I'm 52 now, I absolutely hate to be shouted at, it makes me cry.

My Dad's drinking, over the years, just got worse and worse and worse, and when he retired, he started drinking earlier and earlier in the day, and ramped up the volume of drinks. My parents spent their latter years not going out together or travelling, because my Dad's drinking always came first. My poor Mum didn't have a great retirement because of this - my Dad was either drunk, or thinking of when it would be acceptable to start drinking, or - he was asleep because he'd been drinking or was hungover. Any family gatherings he ended up passed out by about 8pm and missed all of the best parts of the night. Is that what you have to look forward to in retirement?

Consequently, I have suffered with drink related problems over the years. Completely high functioning, but recently I just stopped, as I do not want to follow in his footsteps.

He is still alive. Drinks every day. He has mellowed and I do love him. But he can't really do much for himself, as he is a half shut knife most of the time. What a bloody way to live.

I guess what I'm saying is, that it will most likely only go downwards from here - not much to look forward to, is it?

He isn't a decent man. He might have been once upon a time, but that man is long gone if so.

I am so shocked to read your Op. I can't imagine why you've stayed with him all these years. Why you begged him to come back. Why you want to stay with him now. I've rarely read such an awful account of a marriage.

He is telling you and showing you that he doesn't love or care for you one jot. He doesn't care much for his children. He doesn't respect you. He doesn't care for your feelings or your wellbeing. He wants to treat you as a housekeeper, to serve him and make his life easier. He wants you to give up your life and your happiness in service to him. This man who treats you like the dirt on his shoe.

And your poor children - they will see this as 'normal'. They will think that women are there to serve men, to be downtrodden and disrespected. They will take from this that having any man (no matter how vile he is) is better than being single.

When in fact, being single would be 1000 times better. Imagine a life where you live in a house filled with love with your children. Where you choose how you spend your time and your money. Where you feel only love and respect and support. You can choose what you watch on the TV! Noone criticises you. Heaven.

You gain nothing at all from living with this man. You lose an awful lot. Control of your finances, of your time, your self respect. your security, your future.

You can gain all these things back. Please please please listen to your friends, and to people on here, and to the professionals. This man is horribly abusive. He doesn't care about you. He is happy to see you suffer. To make you unhappy.

Your DH should be the person who has your back. Who supports you through thick and thin. He loves the bones of you. Respects your opinons and wishes. Loves spending time with you. Encourages you to follow your dreams. Wants you to be happy.

You deserve so much better than him. Your children deserve better.

I think I needed those replies to help me to see that it's not all in my head. Sometimes I start thinking it is all me, and it's not as bad as I think, and women's aid told me that he has made me doubt myself and that it's, all my mental health issues that make me think it's abuse and that it's not.
I know I can't go on like this. For me, I could.. But now my 14 year old is seeing it and it's affecting him, I've got to change something. I just don't know what to do.
If he leaves, he will go to her. That will destroy my self esteem even more. My kids will have to stay at her house. They will turn all the blame onto me with their respected careers and false image to everyone in public.
I'll be left on benefits. At the moment I have no income and to be totally honest, with how ill I feel right now, I don't even know if I'm fit for work right now. That would make me feel shameful. I'm scared my kids will choose him when he's got loads of money to spread around. I'm scared people will see me as unfit due to mental health issues, even though I've never let my children down. Other than allowing them to see this, and I know that's not good for them.
It's really, really hard.

It sounds like you both got married way too young, haven't had any freedom and now he resents you for it so deeply but doesn't have the courage or character to do anything about it.

I think you should set each other free. Honestly, I do.

I think you should absolutely make a clean break for all your sake. I grew up with a family dynamic like this -mentally Ill mother and alcoholic father. Life was much better when they had divorced.

While things must be difficult for you, you can’t expect him to “look after” you. You need to support yourself and your dcs as much as you can. If you can’t, they may be better off at their dads.

Ultimately you have a toxic relationship and it’s awful for the kids. You need to do something about that asap.

and that women's aid told me that he has made me doubt myself

I have a feeling that you have completely misunderstood this and taken it in the exact opposite way to which it was intended.

Your suffering and mental health issues are directly caused by his decades of abuse of you. He has made you doubt yourself so much that you think that everything must be your fault.

It's not your fault. He is an evil despicable character who abuses you and your children, and you need to get away from him.

Hi OP. I’m so sorry to hear about your situation, it sounds so hard. I’ve created an account to reply so please excuse if I don’t write it or link in the correct way. I think you know that you and your children would be better off without your husband, but it can be incredibly stressful and difficult to leave a marriage, especially an abusive one such as you are in. I recommend you talk again to Women’s Aid and think through your plan, how you would leave, where you would go, what you would do for money etc. Take a month or two to plan it out properly. A fantastic book that I think will help you is ‘Why does he do that? Inside the minds of angry and controlling men’ by Lundy Bancroft. I think it will be a very hard year once you leave, it will be very emotional and difficult; but after that initial period it is so worth it. It’s worth it for you, and for your children. Your self esteem might be quite low at the moment as that’s what happens to people in abusive relationships. And that makes it all the harder to think that you are worth doing this for. But you definitely are, even if it takes some time and is very difficult. I truly wish you all the best x

@CayrolBaaaskin

I think you should absolutely make a clean break for all your sake. I grew up with a family dynamic like this -mentally Ill mother and alcoholic father. Life was much better when they had divorced.

While things must be difficult for you, you can’t expect him to “look after” you. You need to support yourself and your dcs as much as you can. If you can’t, they may be better off at their dads.

Ultimately you have a toxic relationship and it’s awful for the kids. You need to do something about that asap.

They may be better off at their dad's?! With an alcoholic, gambling father who does nothing for them other than provide for them financially? I understand what predicament we are in. I do. But it's hard and I've been ground down emotionally. However, I know I'm a good mum, and I do everything for these kids other than earn cash.

Put it this way...

He is either screwing her while living with you
Or
He will be screwing her, living with her

Either way, he doesn't love you, abuses you, it's affecting the children.

Any life is better than this one.

See a solicitor, get out of this hell

Do you not think he chose you because of your poor mental health issues?
Like everyone said, this is awful. Check what you’re entitled to in terms of child tax credits and child maintenance. I think you’ll be better off than you think.
You have one life. Don’t put up with this horrendous abuse. You will be able to cope on your own. He doesn’t do anything now!

@MaryPoppinsChildminding - I don’t know your or your dh situation or circumstances so it’s hard to say. You do say that you struggle with mental health to the extent you can’t work at all (abs have been unable ever to work). That would indicate a serious problem which would certainly impact on looking after 4 children. As a child of a mentally ill mother (abs alcoholic father) I can certainly tell you that both have a significant impact on your children.

I think I have ended up very fiercely independent because of my parents and their toxic relationship. In a way they were both codependent in an unhealthy way.

I have mental health issues myself but never ever share them with my dds and always make sure they know I am there to support them and not vice versa. My dm still says things to dds that they will have to “look after her” or “help her” with things (they are in primary school). I always intervene and tell them, no. It’s for granny to take care of you.

Anyway I’m sure you don’t do any of that (parentification) op as you say you’re a good parent. Watch out for it though and be sure that your dcs understand you are there to support them.

[quote CayrolBaaaskin]@MaryPoppinsChildminding - I don’t know your or your dh situation or circumstances so it’s hard to say. You do say that you struggle with mental health to the extent you can’t work at all (abs have been unable ever to work). That would indicate a serious problem which would certainly impact on looking after 4 children. As a child of a mentally ill mother (abs alcoholic father) I can certainly tell you that both have a significant impact on your children.[/quote]
I'm not that ill now that I can't work. I haven't been that ill for 20 years.
I have anxiety. My mental illness doesn't affect my ability to care for my children in any way at all. Doctors and therapists have both told me this.
Even when he left me for another woman and my mental health took a major dive... I was on my arse emotionally, but I still pulled myself around every single day for my children.
One of the big reasons that I darent tell him to fuck off is because people like you judging that I can't look after my kids because I am prone to mental illness. So thankyou for reinforcing that worry.

@MaryPoppinsChildminding - great to hear you can take good care of your kids despite your mental health. Your mental health (or me giving you my perspective from my own childhood) is no reason not to leave him. You say you take care of the kids yourself now anyway.

If you are well enough to work, you absolutely should get a job. It’s a good example for your kids too. It’s hard being a single parent (I am one) but much much better than being in a bad relationship.

Can I just respectfully suggest that a lot of your mental health and anxiety is down to this awful abusive marriage that you've grown up in.

You will feel so much stronger, so much better, more peaceful and free when you have left him - or even better he's left to save you the upheaval.

I know how scary it can seem, but I promise you, you WILL feel better.

Imagine the kids coming home from school and no one needs to worry about what mood he's in, what he's got to say about toys, your cooking, what you're watching on tv.

There's no dramas, arguments, football obsessions, put downs.

You can sleep when you want, the bed to yourself, have long baths, see your family and friends, enjoy the time with your children - all knowing that he's not around to make it a misery.

That poor woman he's going to, she will find out the hard way the true man he is.

@madroid - I don’t know if that’s helpful to blame her dh for her mental health issues. She said she had quite severe problems from a young age including during a period where she didn’t see her dh for many years. There is no easy solution to mental health problems as severe as that.

That being said, it doesn’t sound as if her marriage is anything other than toxic so things would likely improve if she left him. Also if he does drink and is abusive as she reports, she must remove her kids from that.

You and your husband are modelling to your children what a home, family and relationship look like. If you don't get out your children will either accept the same behaviour from someone else or be the perpetrators of it.

Yes, he'll go to the OW-let him! Maybe he'll be as awful to her, maybe he'll be happier and nicer-ultimately you are living with a man who will be abusive to you, you can't worry about what he'll do if he leaves, you just need to get rid of him.

Plan ahead, get support from professional services, family and friends in place then tell him to go.

Mate, I've just read both of your threads. Sending hugs x