Hello MEN of Mumsnet - part 2

[bunglebells]

Had a really interesting thread last week asking to hear from MEN who DON'T use pornography (whether ever, have stopped or reduced). I, and others, found it genuinely interesting as often (including on here) it is claimed these men literally do not exist. Was in response to the numerous threads debating the subject - it did inevitably become an ethical debate but that's to be expected.

So, hello same, or different men!

Is there any of you (or men you know) that WOULD NOT GO TO A STRIP CLUB, BUT YOU HAVE DONE IN THE PAST. I suppose, like the porn question, I am interested to know why you have changed your mind/actions.

Again numerous threads debating it. Not asking the rights or wrongs, or particularly those that do it as a hobby or want to argue it's empowering (is it even allowed at the moment?).

I'm interested in hearing from mumsnet men respectfully. There's some self interest here - can these things be something done when younger, silly, unthinking, drunk, without thought and left in the past....

...again I have been wanting to ask this for some time as it's so polarised in general and am wondering if there is ever really scope for nuance and personal evolution?

I’d be interested in a woman’s view on what is worse, hard core violent porn use or strip club attendence?

Would not knowingly be involved with a man who did either.

From a detached, ethical viewpoint, (depending on the club), I suppose the violent porn is even worse for women.

(I mean women as a class).

Have been to strip clubs three times in my entire life. First occasion was when I was a naive graduate in the city and my peergroup took me along to one. Can't say I particularly enjoyed it, expensive and a bit sad and naff was my take from it. Next two times were on stag bashes, on both those occasions myself and a few mates just propped up the bar and had a few very expensive beers. It's just not my thing, never had a private dance and women pretending to be interested in you or encouraging you to buy drinks is not much of a turn on. The last stag do I went on about 10 years ago was in Amsterdam and I remember later in the evening the group split, bunch of guys went off to see a show and the rest of us stayed in the bar shooting pool and enjoying the music. I just think they are a bit shit and I never understand how some blokes drop hundreds of pounds in them. Each to their own I guess.

In my early 20s I was out drinking with two friends and we walked past a strip club and decided to go in to see what it would be like. We each paid £10 for a private dance. The woman who danced for me was attractive and it was a turn-on at first, but then it sunk in that she was only there for the money and probably viewed me as rather pathetic. That left me with an icky feeling about the whole thing afterwards.

In the years after that I went on three stag dos where we went to a strip club, but I never had a dance myself again and tended to get fed up and leave early. Then in more recent stag dos I've ducked out of that stage of the night entirely. I haven't been to one in more than ten years now and don't expect to go again.

I think part of the appeal in my early 20s was that I wasn't having any success with dating and I was single (and always had been) so it was initially nice to have attention even though it was fake. At this point I've now been in relationships for most of my recent life and it feels much better to get attention from someone who is genuinely interested in me, so a strip club would seem like a very poor substitute for that.

@DillonPanthersTexas

Have been to strip clubs three times in my entire life. First occasion was when I was a naive graduate in the city and my peergroup took me along to one. Can't say I particularly enjoyed it, expensive and a bit sad and naff was my take from it. Next two times were on stag bashes, on both those occasions myself and a few mates just propped up the bar and had a few very expensive beers. It's just not my thing, never had a private dance and women pretending to be interested in you or encouraging you to buy drinks is not much of a turn on. The last stag do I went on about 10 years ago was in Amsterdam and I remember later in the evening the group split, bunch of guys went off to see a show and the rest of us stayed in the bar shooting pool and enjoying the music. I just think they are a bit shit and I never understand how some blokes drop hundreds of pounds in them. Each to their own I guess.

When you've been with mates and there's been the ones in the group that spend money, or are really into it... do you think they're a certain type of person. My colleague went on a drag recently and did end up in one; said a friend of a friend spent a grand, and almost went home with a dancer (was paying for that privilege). Married, kids, but the others said it always ended that was with him on stage nights! My colleague said he would never have expected it from him on first impression.

@MoonbeamsGlittering

In my early 20s I was out drinking with two friends and we walked past a strip club and decided to go in to see what it would be like. We each paid £10 for a private dance. The woman who danced for me was attractive and it was a turn-on at first, but then it sunk in that she was only there for the money and probably viewed me as rather pathetic. That left me with an icky feeling about the whole thing afterwards.

In the years after that I went on three stag dos where we went to a strip club, but I never had a dance myself again and tended to get fed up and leave early. Then in more recent stag dos I've ducked out of that stage of the night entirely. I haven't been to one in more than ten years now and don't expect to go again.

I think part of the appeal in my early 20s was that I wasn't having any success with dating and I was single (and always had been) so it was initially nice to have attention even though it was fake. At this point I've now been in relationships for most of my recent life and it feels much better to get attention from someone who is genuinely interested in me, so a strip club would seem like a very poor substitute for that.

I think it's probably easier on some trips than others to opt out of that stage. Probably depends on the group, and how many others want to exit quickly?

So curiosity for you? And then boredom.

What's your view on them as a phenomenon? Acceptable part of the high street or not?

@Samedaysameshit

Never been or even close to going a d I’m 50. Just never even crossed my path or as far as I know any of my mates, no one has ever mentioned going to one anyway. Maybe it’s a London / big city thing? I’m in the West Country.

Surely there's strippers in ... Somerset?

[quote FabulousMrFifty]@bunglebells
The pub stripper was probably one of the least erotic experiences I’ve ever had, I think my root canal was more enjoyable,[/quote]
That sexy! do you think some men would have found it erotic? Is it actually that, or is it morbid curiosity? Such an odd concept to me, to go to be turned on in public.

@bunglebells "What's your view on them as a phenomenon? Acceptable part of the high street or not?" - I'm not totally sure. I definitely don't want any of the staff to be abused or exploited. Maybe having the clubs be quite visible is better than driving it underground, I don't know.

I do think that it's unacceptable for men to lie to their partners about whether they go. Some men are going to go, and that's their choice, but then at least they should be honest with their partner. Some women really don't want their partners to go, and those women have every right to feel that way, so they deserve to know the truth about whether their man goes and then they can decide whether they still want to be with that man. I have been disgusted by the actions of certain men I've known who clearly went way beyond what their partner would be OK with.

I'm a woman but having read the comments about women and males strippers reminded me of when I used to work behind the bar in the gay club when I was younger.
I didn't used to encounter too many straight men (obviously!) so when a nice looking guy started chatting me up at the start of a shift one Saturday I was quite pleased. After chatting for a bit I got on with sorting the fridges out and it wasn't until later that I realised the handsome man I was chatting to was leaping around the stage covered in baby oil and doing what can only be described as 'the dick out dance' It never even occurred to me why he was in the club before it officially opened!
There was nothing remotely sexy about it and the worst bit was he put an unopened bottle of Newcastle Brown ale in the middle of the stage and then promptly sat down on it and then enthusiastically encouraged one of the onlookers to pull it out of his arse!
Needless to say I was busy when he turned up after his performance asking for my number.

@bunglebells
This was over 20 years ago, when strippers in Pubs was still a thing, thankfully general society has moved on a bit now.

As for going to a strip club, as man in his 50’s, I rather go the a decent gig or weekend away on my motorcycle tbh

@mylovelydd

I'm a woman but having read the comments about women and males strippers reminded me of when I used to work behind the bar in the gay club when I was younger. I didn't used to encounter too many straight men (obviously!) so when a nice looking guy started chatting me up at the start of a shift one Saturday I was quite pleased. After chatting for a bit I got on with sorting the fridges out and it wasn't until later that I realised the handsome man I was chatting to was leaping around the stage covered in baby oil and doing what can only be described as 'the dick out dance' It never even occurred to me why he was in the club before it officially opened! There was nothing remotely sexy about it and the worst bit was he put an unopened bottle of Newcastle Brown ale in the middle of the stage and then promptly sat down on it and then enthusiastically encouraged one of the onlookers to pull it out of his arse! Needless to say I was busy when he turned up after his performance asking for my number.

Oh Lordy. That sounds completely grim. I've accidentally seen one male strippergram and it was totally awful. Just dreadful. I would say what he did to the "hit"... a middle aged unsuspecting woman was sexual assault. She was obviously mortified - picked her up over his shoulders and flashed her knickers to the pub as she was desperately trying to cover up.

Thinking about it... does this still exist. A lot of the old strippergram thing would be assault surely. I saw a female one once at work. Not naked but almost. Again. Just appalling. Couldn't for life of me work out the purpose.

@mylovelydd
I used to like a Newkie Brown, but I think that anecdote has put me right off now., those bottles had metal tops as well, I imagine that would sting a bit on way out !!

I've visited them on holiday before (mostly out of curiousity). I've seen naked women before, so the most interesting thing about them is watching the other men and watching the strippers' facades slip as the night wears on.
I think they're much more interesting if you're young/unfortunate enough
for a naked woman to be a genuine novelty or you're married and sexually bored of your wife, but have a moral objection to cheating.

Now bear in mind I’m not often considered a typical “blokey” bloke…

I’ve only ever been to one once, when I was dragged along with a stag party. I can honestly say I found it as erotic as a fridge (apologies to any fridge fetishists out there…)

It just all seemed so needy and, well, pathetic. And so obvious, if that makes sense. I’m a bit the same with any kind of “tarty” erotic paraphernalia to be honest. I just prefer a bit more sensuality. And the sense everyone’s getting excitement out of it, rather than just me.

Also agree with @BigJeremy - I definitely found observing the men and strippers the most fascinating part. It actually all felt a bit absurd.

When you've been with mates and there's been the ones in the group that spend money, or are really into it... do you think they're a certain type of person. My colleague went on a drag recently and did end up in one; said a friend of a friend spent a grand, and almost went home with a dancer (was paying for that privilege). Married, kids, but the others said it always ended that was with him on stage nights! My colleague said he would never have expected it from him on first impression.

I think it is a certain type of person, never got my head around what the turn on is. You are essentially paying someone to be interested in you. I can perhaps understand someone with low confidence getting bullied by their peer group into getting involved as a one off but truth be told, attached or single, if visiting a strip club is a regular part of your night out I just think you are a bit sad and tragic really.

There is often a school of thought on here that men who go on stag do's will be falling over themselves to go to strip clubs once they are away from the glare of their wives and girlfriends. From my experience of about 15+ stag weekends it has always been a minority of blokes who are up for it. More often then not, the ones who do not want to go to a strip club are not saying no out of some kind of respect for their partners, they are saying no as they find such places utter shit and would rather just stay in the pub.

I would imagine 99% of men or even more do not visit mumsnet so not sure whatever answers you get will be representative of the male population.

@DillonPanthersTexas

When you've been with mates and there's been the ones in the group that spend money, or are really into it... do you think they're a certain type of person. My colleague went on a drag recently and did end up in one; said a friend of a friend spent a grand, and almost went home with a dancer (was paying for that privilege). Married, kids, but the others said it always ended that was with him on stage nights! My colleague said he would never have expected it from him on first impression.

I think it is a certain type of person, never got my head around what the turn on is. You are essentially paying someone to be interested in you. I can perhaps understand someone with low confidence getting bullied by their peer group into getting involved as a one off but truth be told, attached or single, if visiting a strip club is a regular part of your night out I just think you are a bit sad and tragic really.

There is often a school of thought on here that men who go on stag do's will be falling over themselves to go to strip clubs once they are away from the glare of their wives and girlfriends. From my experience of about 15+ stag weekends it has always been a minority of blokes who are up for it. More often then not, the ones who do not want to go to a strip club are not saying no out of some kind of respect for their partners, they are saying no as they find such places utter shit and would rather just stay in the pub.

I think women are interested to read this. A bit like every single man watches porn. Seems like lots of men either think strip clubs are shite, or are ambivalent, even if not anti. And you're right. Stag nights infer a certain terror in many women.

Last query. The ones that are keen to go... any correlation with general attitude to women or not particularly?

I think women are interested to read this. A bit like every single man watches porn. Seems like lots of men either think strip clubs are shite, or are ambivalent, even if not anti. And you're right. Stag nights infer a certain terror in many women.

Well there is obviously a market for them otherwise most towns and cities would not have a strip club. Not sure what the breakdown is with regards to what % of customers are repeat trade or one off visitors.

Last query. The ones that are keen to go... any correlation with general attitude to women or not particularly?

Not that I have noticed, although I am not exactly the best person to ask as my close mates are not exactly regular punters of such places (well they have not admitted as much to me anyway). In the past it has been work colleagues as opposed to mates who saw strip joints as part of their Friday night schedule. It was not spoken about as such, more a case of they would just migrate off to the strip joint when everybody else was heading off home.

A bit like every single man watches porn. Seems like lots of men either think strip clubs are shite, or are ambivalent, even if not anti.

Some men (like me), think that strip clubs and lap dancing bars have that slight Peter Stringfellow feel about them, personally I wouldn’t be caught be dead in one, but that’s not to say I’m anti strip club, but just not for me.

Last query. The ones that are keen to go... any correlation with general attitude to women or not particularly?

Don’t know really, as none one I know would probably admit to going to one on a regular basis

Last query. The ones that are keen to go... any correlation with general attitude to women or not particularly?

Couldn't really say. I genuinely know more men that have admitted to paying for sexual contact than have admitted to visiting a strip club, even out of idle curiousity.
There is a definite aesthetic/vibe to strip clubs (beyond the obvious), so I'm sure there's a specific type of guy that just enjoys that specific type of ambience. Probay mostly the type of man who likes being around naked women though.

@BigJeremy

Last query. The ones that are keen to go... any correlation with general attitude to women or not particularly?

Couldn't really say. I genuinely know more men that have admitted to paying for sexual contact than have admitted to visiting a strip club, even out of idle curiousity.
There is a definite aesthetic/vibe to strip clubs (beyond the obvious), so I'm sure there's a specific type of guy that just enjoys that specific type of ambience. Probay mostly the type of man who likes being around naked women though.

For some reason I used to think that paying for sex was something that very few men had ever done, but recently I saw an estimate that 10% of men in the UK had paid for sex at least once, which really shocked me. My first thought was "that's hard to believe, because I don't know anyone who has paid for sex" but then I realised that I actually do know of at least 3 guys, and I guess there may be more who have but I just don't know about it.

Is that the next thread question then op? How many men have paid for sex?

@Slackbladder22

Is that the next thread question then op? How many men have paid for sex?

It was/is actually going to be my third and final One. Who has but never would again.

But that's for next week. Let's stick to stripping here