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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Pass Agg brother. Opinions

38 replies

Atalune · 24/10/2021 20:50

Dbro and I are not particularly close emotionally or geographically. He has form for “falling out” with me and giving me the silent treatment and won’t tell me why. This has happened alot over the years.

He has 2 grown adult children. 18 and 23.

For background I am terrible with dates and forget everyone’s birthdays. Everyone’s. It’s not personal. I’m usually a few days early (good) or a couple
Of days late (bad)

This year I forgot the 18 y.olds birthday. I texted as soon as I realised. Apologised. Then sent them some expensive and sentimental jewellery. Wrote a heartfelt card. Texted back and forth with the 18 year old. Heard nothing from brother. That’s ok. I cocked up.

It’s my sons birthday today. He’s much younger. In previous years Dbro has sent expensive gifts/toys. This year it was £10 in a card. I texted with a pic of him beaming and said thank you. No reply. He’s been on and off WhatsApp and is ignoring me.

So….

He’s punishing me/my son. He’s waiting for me to do something but what?

I know he’s pissed off but all this game playing is very annoying. Dh says leave him to stew and he’ll get over it. He’s tricky. Him and his wife routinely fall out with everyone. They are estranged from all family on both sides. Have never managed to hold on to long term friends.

I don’t know what to do. Maybe nothing. Gah!

And yes forgetting birthdays is bad. I know. I have air of anxiety around it due to dbro going mad that presents were never good enough/expensive enough in the past.

OP posts:
Glindaswand · 24/10/2021 20:57

As you say, they have form for this behaviour, unlikely that they will change.
I wouldn’t engage and keep things low key - it’s horrible to have to deal with this. I have the same with some of my siblings - I’ve just backed right off from them & relationships have improved as I don’t spend my time worrying about no replies.
As you’ve said, you text his children who are now adults - keep the relationship with them.

2pinkginsplease · 24/10/2021 21:04

Oh he would love me, I’ve stopped sending cards and gifts to one set of nephews/nieces as they don’t communicate, reply to messages or thank you for any gifts and never had. So I’ve stopped making an effort.

Their loss!

The fact they are like this with everyone would tell me more about them!

Bonbon21 · 24/10/2021 21:07

You've played nice and said thank you.
Let him get on with it.
Do not reward bad behaviour... at any age.

Original poster
Atalune · 24/10/2021 21:08

Thanks for the kind comments. It makes me feel weird and that everything is sort of messy and unresolved.

OP posts:
TheMadGardener · 24/10/2021 21:30

Your DH is absolutely right. Leave DB to sulk. Don't waste headspace on it. Your niece is not sulking because her present was late, so her dad has no business to.

My DM sulks and takes offence and usually we have no idea what we've done, so we leave her alone and pretend we haven't noticed that we're being given the cold shoulder, and after a few weeks she gets bored with being ignored and starts normal contact again, by which time she's probably forgotten what we did to cause offence!

ChargingBuck · 25/10/2021 03:00

Dh says leave him to stew and he’ll get over it. He’s tricky. Him and his wife routinely fall out with everyone. They are estranged from all family on both sides. Have never managed to hold on to long term friends.

DH is right.

Continue your nice breezy communications with your brother's DC, & don't allow his ridiculousness to affect you. He can only manipulate you if you respond to it! - & imagine the quiet satisfaction you will take in ... not giving him the satisfaction of doing anything.

As you say - maybe nothing. Gah!
Yup! That is precisely what to do when dealing with tantrumming manchildren.

Wiredforsound · 25/10/2021 06:44

Stop trying to please people like this. If people want to get their knickers in a twist about every little thing then let them get on with it. The silent treatment is about them trying to control your behaviour so you will do what they want to avoid feeling bad. It’s coercive and manipulative. The good news is that you appear to have moved to £10 in a card presents which is much better and easier.

LivingLaVidaBabyShower · 25/10/2021 06:46

@Bonbon21

You've played nice and said thank you. Let him get on with it. Do not reward bad behaviour... at any age.
This. He is looking for a reaction. Dont engage
category12 · 25/10/2021 07:00

If you're bad at birthdays, set up reminders on your phone, or with funky pigeon or something - I don't really understand why you wouldn't, when this is a recurring thing. (Although I guess if your brother has made it into a drama about presents over the years, maybe it's your passive aggressive response to that?).

As the nephews are adults, I'd maintain your own relationship with them separate from dbro.

And just don't ruse to it with dbro.

Random789 · 25/10/2021 07:03

Agree with others that he is being unfair and you should just ignore his sulk completely.

I also wondered if you had become (understandably) over-sensitive to his reactions/non-reactions. When you sent a gift to his 18-year-old you got texts acknowledging it from the receipient . Why do you also need acknowledgement from your brother? And despite your brother's irritability, your son still received a gift - just not so imaginative a gift as usual. So what? That's fine.
Your reaction to your brother seems over sensitive, in a way that mirrors your brother's over-sensitivity. His silence only amounts to a sulk if you are anxiously attentive to it -- without that anxious attention it is just a quiet period in your relationship.
It feels like you are both holding on to the past and re-enacting it through your children. Just relax., both of you, about forgetfulness (on your part) and frostiness (on his part).

Auroreforet · 25/10/2021 07:15

25 years ago both dsil and I both forgot our niece’s birthday, I actually got the date wrong. Very embarrassing, other dsil was furious on her dd’s behalf.
Niece’s dm has never sent us or our dc a card on time since.
No offence here.
It’s a family joke.

Life’s too short, you apologised. I’m in my 60’s and it’s taken me 30 years not to feel responsible for how other people behave.
In your head just tell your brother to F off.
An then get on with more important things.

Original poster
Atalune · 25/10/2021 08:03

Thanks all for the advice and input.

I have reminders set up. They don’t work. It I will look into funky pigeon- that’s a good idea. My mum used to remind me. But both parents are dead. I know you’re right, my behaviour isn’t great either.

OP posts:
ChargingBuck · 25/10/2021 08:29

I know you’re right, my behaviour isn’t great either.

Stop that nonsense.
Your niece didn't mind about the belated card & present, she doesn't see an issue that her aunt is slightly scatty about dates. She thanked you, chatted with you, & knows you value her.

Your brother has decided to create an issue out of a nothing that isn't even his business.
If it weren't the belated birthday greetings, he'd have found something else.

As above, just refuse to rise to his ridiculous little performances.

thevassal · 25/10/2021 08:36

Agree with everyone else that you just need to draw a line under your brother and his passive aggressiveness. At the end of the day your dn is happy because they got a lovely present, your dc is happy because they got money so why bother wasting head space when those involved aren't even aware there's a "thing" going on?

However I do wonder why if you know you have an issue with birthdays you haven't done anything to sort it. I dont think most people actually "remember" birthdays off the top of their head because it's not easy to remember random dates - but they put a system in place to remind them- alet on phone, calendar, whatever works. As a pp said you can even set alerts on card website for them to go automatically now so there's really not an excuse particularly as you understand its not nice for people to feel forgotten about.

Waahingwashingwashing · 25/10/2021 08:41

I would do a moonpig reminder and I would not read anything into a tenner in a card.

Why did you want acknowledgement from your brier when you’d had it from your adult niece?

Original poster
Atalune · 25/10/2021 11:12

It’s not so much the acknowledgement more that him not reading the text o sent means that he WAS in a mood with me. And now this is punishment.

It’s a toxic dynamic. That’s for sure.

I guess I posted because I wanted some reassurance that I’m dealing with it the best way now.

OP posts:
ChargingBuck · 25/10/2021 11:14

You are dealing with it in the best way now, & it's only 'punishment' if you allow it any headspace.

Your DB is being a toddler, let him contact you when he's feeling a bit more grown up.

Original poster
Atalune · 25/10/2021 11:50

Thanks @ChargingBuck Smile

OP posts:
Buggritbuggrit · 25/10/2021 11:50

Why do you care so much, OP? If he’s cross with you, then he’s cross with you. So what? You’re not close, this isn’t some great relationship that’s at risk.

Stop tying yourself in knots trying to cater to an overgrown toddler having a tantrum. Just keep it civil and keep it moving. He’ll get over it when he gets over it. Or not.

Lana07 · 25/10/2021 11:55

@Atalune

Dbro and I are not particularly close emotionally or geographically. He has form for “falling out” with me and giving me the silent treatment and won’t tell me why. This has happened alot over the years.

He has 2 grown adult children. 18 and 23.

For background I am terrible with dates and forget everyone’s birthdays. Everyone’s. It’s not personal. I’m usually a few days early (good) or a couple
Of days late (bad)

This year I forgot the 18 y.olds birthday. I texted as soon as I realised. Apologised. Then sent them some expensive and sentimental jewellery. Wrote a heartfelt card. Texted back and forth with the 18 year old. Heard nothing from brother. That’s ok. I cocked up.

It’s my sons birthday today. He’s much younger. In previous years Dbro has sent expensive gifts/toys. This year it was £10 in a card. I texted with a pic of him beaming and said thank you. No reply. He’s been on and off WhatsApp and is ignoring me.

So….

He’s punishing me/my son. He’s waiting for me to do something but what?

I know he’s pissed off but all this game playing is very annoying. Dh says leave him to stew and he’ll get over it. He’s tricky. Him and his wife routinely fall out with everyone. They are estranged from all family on both sides. Have never managed to hold on to long term friends.

I don’t know what to do. Maybe nothing. Gah!

And yes forgetting birthdays is bad. I know. I have air of anxiety around it due to dbro going mad that presents were never good enough/expensive enough in the past.

Not to forget my & my husband's friend's & family's birthdays I put them in my diary in January for the whole year.
Lana07 · 25/10/2021 11:57

@Buggritbuggrit

Why do you care so much, OP? If he’s cross with you, then he’s cross with you. So what? You’re not close, this isn’t some great relationship that’s at risk.

Stop tying yourself in knots trying to cater to an overgrown toddler having a tantrum. Just keep it civil and keep it moving. He’ll get over it when he gets over it. Or not.

I agree.

He has a problem forgiving. It's not such a big or huge deal. His choice, his loss.

Lana07 · 25/10/2021 11:58

Ignoring is a form of emotional ABUSE!

Lana07 · 25/10/2021 12:00

Mature adults TALK and solve all the disagreements peacefully by respectful communication.

ChargingBuck · 25/10/2021 12:03

@Lana07

Ignoring is a form of emotional ABUSE!
It can be, & often is ... but in this case, from a brother OP is not close to & who has form for Performance Stonewalling, it's healthier to turn the thing on its head. Look at it as the eccentric performance it is, & decide it can't possibly be emotional abuse, because you don't have a particular emotional connection to the stonewaller, so their antics just aren't going to fly with you ...
reader12 · 25/10/2021 12:08

I have lots of siblings who have lots of kids, some of us get presents there on time, some never do presents, some do presents sometimes on time and sometimes late. Nobody cares or keeps score either way.

He’s being weird, just don’t join in and don’t absorb his judgement of you and turn it into self judgement. Forgetting a birthday for a couple of days is no big deal at all and a normal person would barely notice it let alone sulk. Just leave him be to do whatever nonsense makes him happy.