Am I being unreasonable or is he a (insert profanity here)

[Drift101]

Hi all,

I’m looking for honest advice here please.

My partner and I argue all the time. Essentially it boils down to the same pattern of behaviour:

I’ll say something innocently, the latest being “I’m doing the gardening today if you want to help but don’t worry if you’re busy - no pressure”

He takes offence and blames it on my voice, my body language, my words, my face - anything.

I then defend myself “no I was genuinely just saying if you want to help I’d like that but no worries if you’ve got plans”

It then becomes an argument and we fall out.

He’s agreed with the pattern of behaviour and said he needs to stop being so sensitive and thinking I’m being horrible but so far he hasn’t.

He’s now decided not to speak to me properly in case I get offended! This has thrown me completely as I don’t really get offended by things and I’m a really positive person.

When it’s good it’s great but when he’s like this it drives me to despair.

Should I just let it go when he gets offended all the time? Is it just me and am I really horrible without realising? I’ve always been told I’m quite a lovely person and very positive so it’d be news to me but I’m open to it. Even when he’s said it all stems from me I haven’t got offended, I just see that he’s very defensive.

Thing is I’m 35, I want a family and I’m scared of being on my own and becoming a spinster who gets eaten by her cats.

If I was 25 then I probably would leave. As it is, I’m not sure. Maybe this is what relationships are? Maybe they do take work and I just need to let it go and not react when he has his moments. It’s just hard.

He said he’ll work on it so I suppose time will tell, I’d just like to hear others thoughts on it as I’m completely thrown for a loop at the moment.

OP I was single and 35 when I met the love of my life after spending years in a relationship that made me miserable and constantly anxious. I wake up every morning and thank the stars that we separated and I found happiness. Relationships should bring good things to your life not misery. He’s not being nice to you.

My DH does this and I hate it. I’m quite animated when I speak whereas he can be quite monotone. So he says that I’m “having a go” or infers emotions that I don’t have. It means that if I wasn’t pissed off at the start of a conversation I am by the end of it 😫

I’m married to someone like this OP— an example is he will spend half an hour ranting on about something and then when I jump in with a comment or suggestion, puts his hand up and says ‘I dont want to talk about it’ !! It gets very very wearing and 25 years later I’m trying to work out ways to separate financially when we don’t own a house and I’m not far off retirement age. It’s not that I don’t care about him and in some ways love him but I actually dont like living with him and feel on edge. If he goes away with work for a few days and it’s just phone chats then I’m fine— personally I would like the relationship to be separate houses and see him a couple of evenings a week!! Bit difficult to suggest that after you’ve had your silver wedding!! My advice is to end it now, these behavioural patterns are part of their personality, part of who they are and whilst they can change it for a while if they fear you living, the behaviour will come back — maybe some women can put up with it if they love someone enough but I realise I’m not one of them as I have got older.

Your posts are deeply alarming, OP. You are pussyfooting around someone who is supposed to love you, monitoring your language, body language, and responses so as not to piss him off — and despite all this effort to appease him, it’s not working.

Imagine being in a relationship with someone to whom you could just say ‘We need to do X in the garden today. When’s best for you—- morning or afternoon?’ or to whom the closed or open position of the kitchen door was not a personal insult? Or who, indeed, was in the habit of putting away the groceries himself?

@Crikeyalmighty It's never too late to suggest living apart, lots of couples do it.

Buy sperm online rather than deal with this pratt for the rest of your life

How could this man be in any way shape or form a decent parent?

If that is the only reason you are staying IMO it's just no where near enough.

It's the most important thing about having a child, who you have it with.

@NoSquirrels

I’ll say something innocently, the latest being “I’m doing the gardening today if you want to help but don’t worry if you’re busy - no pressure”

I’ve got to be honest, I’d find this an irrationally irritating way of communicating. Do you want my help? If you do, ask me clearly. To me, this would come across as an attempt to make me feel guilty for choosing not to help you, rather than feeling that the choice not to help was really there.

However.

A massive however.

If he ALWAYS says it’s you - it’s your fault because of how you ask/say/act/behave - then he’s an exhausting twat and you should probably move on.

It's an awkward way of communicating because he's trained her- he's already rejected all the usual ways, so she's tying herself in knots to avoid him finding a way to accuse her of pressuring him.

He may not realise just how avoidant he is, but he never will when he has someone like you who'll just toe the line. He needs to recognise he's the issue AND address it. He won't. He doesn't want to. You need to move on.

@SortingItOut. I don’t think he would go for it - however it may come to that and I may offer it as an option to ‘splitting up’ . We could just about afford it. I don’t want another relationship if I am honest , so my mental reasoning is that it’s like a FWB , except you are married!! My gut feeling though is that he would be contacting me all the time saying can I come round, do you want the day out to xxx and not sure if he could cope with me not always being ‘available’ - but guess you never know till you try— We have a lot in common and I do like many things, he is just not nice to live with day to day, erratic, anxious and a bit controlling in some ways — has got far worse as he’s got older. (Now 57)

I think the 'you can come and help with the garden' comment would annoy me. If I wanted to garden I'd be out there spade in hand. My DH always ropes others to 'help' , even if I'm only MNetting I may not at that precise time want to clean the car with him or whatever.
But annoyed about door closing??? I would say as that is petty there is some other underlying issue (could be anything, his work,money,you) that he is finding excuses to take out on you.
Straightforward talk , taking turns to speak, no one can leave, no interruptions and see if you can get to the bottom of this which might be you need to split up.

I also thought the garden comment was a bit annoying and passive aggressive but was deeply deeply NOT shocked when OP then clarified that this has been going on for ages and she is constantly walking on eggshells. It had the ring of a sentence designed to try NOT to irritate the person, who is easily irritated, and then nonetheless does irritate them.

OP, I bet if you wrote down here how this all started and what's been going on for however long you've been in this relationship it will have been a constant drip drip from him to you.

To be clear, what he wants is to get to the point where a) you do all the drudge work and effort and b) you do it in exactly the way he wants and c) he decides exactly what you do, when and where in all situations.

I'd be very surprised if t hasn't already started. friends you no longer see because he does't like them. Activities you no longer take part in because he thinks they're inappropriate or inconvenient. Even work - perhaps you've lost out on interesting projects or promotions because you realised that if you worked longer/with that colleague etc he would make your life difficult?

SIL could have written your post 10 years ago. Today, she's in a situation with two children with a man who has convinced her and almost everyone else that SHE is a nagging, moody bitch and that HE is the victim.

Christ, if you have dc with this guy, you will be doing everything.

He's training you to have zero expectations of him and to be afraid to ask for him to do his share.

I’ll say something innocently, the latest being “I’m doing the gardening today if you want to help but don’t worry if you’re busy - no pressure

It isn’t ‘innocent’ it’s passive aggressive and / or guilt trippy.

If you are happy to get in with the job just say “I’m doing the gardening “. If you think it is a task you should tackle together say “I think we need to overhaul the garden, what do you think? Is there a day we can do it together?”. If you need specific help say “I’m doing the garden, I need help to lift the slabs, is there a time you could give me a hand?”.

However, if you cannot be direct because of his reaction, then you are walking on eggshells and it is not healthy.

He is unable to communicate properly: he could ask you to simply ask for help, or tell him what you are up to. Snapping, whining, huffing and especially the silent treatment is horrible.

If you are stuck in a loop or pattern of bad communication it is possible that couples counselling could help you resolve it and move forwards.

Being partners means shared goals, shared pleasures, enjoying being a team, understanding each other … being on a wavelength.

If you haven’t got that don’t spend the rest of your life tied to him. LOL at ‘at this stage’. You are young! And no stage is the right time to write off your life.

Look up sunk costs fallacy.

I’m married to someone like this and it has ruined my life. Having kids with somebody like this is unbearable. I get no help or if I do ask it’s an issue. Everything’s a battle. He’s patronising and condescending calling me bad names if I react but he can’t ever ever be told anything about his behaviour. After many years it’s now led to him giving me days and weeks of silent treatment if anything like you’ve described happens. Right now he’s keeping himself in some kind of check because you could just leave. When you’ve got kids you can’t. You’re then tied to him forever and this will be your daily life. Forever. Imagine that. How you feel right now will be your life every single day and worse because when you’re tied to him there is no brake and he can do this every single day. Do not be me. Get out now. You say “time will tell”. You don’t have time for him to have a personality transplant. He is a sulky, bad communicator who needs to be on his own. You can and will do better. Don’t you want someone kind and positive? Rip the band aid off. You’ll have a shit year but this time next year you won’t have to deal with him ever again! I wish I was you and could do it. Please please don’t waste your life. This behaviour will not change. It’s who he’s is. No more chances.

OP it shouldn't be this much hard work. It sounds so draining - no matter what you do you'll never be able to win with him. Parenting with him would be a nightmare - get out while you can!!

He's a controlling, emotionally abusive arsehole.

The constant criticism of you for any perceived slight, the putdowns, constantly moving the goal posts, silent treatment etc. are all part of his control and abuse. Walking on eggshells is a massive sign of emotional abuse.

He is slowly chipping away at your self esteem by constant gaslighting, making you doubt your own reality and ability to communicate.

It's definitely him, look up covert narcissistic abuse. Better to get rid now before children, they make terrible partners and even worse fathers.

I want to know why you think it’s normal in what is supposed to be a loving caring relationship to feel like you’re walking on eggshells most of the time and having to think so hard about what you say and how you say it to please someone who will find fault when there is none.

That’s not what a loving caring relationship looks like, it’s what an emotionally abusive relationship looks like.

This is well beyond a different way of speaking or communicating. It’s deliberate manipulation on his part to make you feel that you must run around in circles trying to appease him and get his approval. How messed up is that?

I’d recommend reading the sticky thread at the top of this board called “listen up” or similar.

Here you go, you don’t even need to find it now. Read the OP, think about it.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/698029-Right-listen-up-everybody

@Crikeyalmighty What you are suggesting has a name - Living Apart Together.

There is a Facebook group called Apartners (Living Apart Together) which is full of useful information.

If you went ahead with this you would set boundaries so you didn't have to see or speak to him everyday.
He would soon get used to it and as an alternative to splitting up hopefully he would ne amenable.

Its never too late to do what makes you happy.

So what if you are asking him to pull his weight? Sometimes you've just got to tell them to get on with it.

He's manipulating you so he never has to do anything. I bet he asks you to do your part when it suits.

Don't put up with it. Why are you even talking about how he feels about doing his share is beyond me.

I was tired just reading your post, OP, and I agree with PP that it sounds like you are already couching your requests in offense-free language in order to avoid setting him off.

Maybe the example is just an example. I am a fan of the more direct "can you help me with the gardening," or "do you want to do some gardening?" myself. BUT I also get the feeling that you might be saying it that way to say "I really don't expect anything of you, although if you want to help that'd be nice, but I'm not imposing it, whatever you like..." Which is draining.

Someone mentioned that it might be resolvable with a change in cmmunication styles, but I am fresh off of a break up of a 2.5 year relationship and it was caused largely by communication styles. People do not change unless they are really forced to. A willing partner can consider what they are saying and how, and try to better control their reactions,. However, an ignorant, bolshy or manipulative partner can have a fucking field day with your genuine intentions. I'd just walk away.

Thing is I’m 35, I want a family and I’m scared of being on my own and becoming a spinster who gets eaten by her cats.

Being single is better than being in a shit relationship.

The gardening comment was incredibly passive aggressive and being in a relationship with someone who communicates that way is maddening.

You don’t sound suited at all.

@HadaVerde

The gardening comment was incredibly passive aggressive and being in a relationship with someone who communicates that way is maddening.

You don’t sound suited at all.

This misses the point. Her awkwardness in asking is learned. He’s so aggressive and undermining she’s devolved into desperately trying to ask him things in the ‘right’ way.