It is him, right?

[Countrystrife]

I have been with my DH for 18 years. We have two DC.

He is a career man, very driven by status and wealth. However, for all of the 18 years he has hated whatever job he has, works stupid hours because he "has" to and is generally always stressed about work.
Weekends he sulks. If I ask what is wrong the answer is always "work".

He has had 4 jobs in those 18 years and with each job comes the promise that it will be different this time. Especially since DC came along. It never changes. It is who he is. It is him, not the job. I am sure he could work in a newsagent but turn it into a 60hr week job because it wouldn't run smoothly without him there (to him, anyway).

He insists it is the job but it isn't, is it? By now it must be him. I have had two jobs in the same time and, yes, there are bits of both I dislike(d) neither were bone crushingly awful that they ruined my life. We started out in the same industry so I do know the pressures but surely he should have learned to deal with them by now.

I have suggested counselling but he refuses as to him all will be well in the world if he just had a different job. He then procrastinates about finding a new job, he is often approached by head hunters and recruitment agencies but never follows up.

It feels to me that the last 18 years have been spent listening to him complain about work, talking about finding a new job or a completely different career (all my suggestions met with a negative) or in the recruitment process (which is just brutal with what feels like 15 rounds of hoops to jump through).

He gets a new job - sometimes it starts out ok and he is positive for a while (longest about 2yrs) but then the cycle starts again.

We always end up back where we started.

I am tired of it. Bored of it. He will not see that maybe, just maybe the problem lies within himself. That perhaps working on himself might lead to more fulfilment.

I have actually started to avoid him because I cannot bear another sad sack conversation where he laments not being able to have an easy 9-5 job, that he "has" to work long hours etc when he will not work towards any other alternative.

We moved house 2yrs ago (during a positive phase) and at the time I asked him if he really wanted to do this as it meant we would need his wage for the next 15 years. He agreed. Now he complains about being stuck forever in this job to pay for the house.

It is exhausting.

He just sounds like a moaner to be fair. Have you told him he's moaning all the time?

Well, you can’t change him, OP. You can only change how you react to him.
You can either:

1. spend the rest of your life listening to his whining. Or 2) divorce him. Or 3) deliver an ultimatum: he goes to counselling, and engages with it properly, or you initiate option 2. Good luck!

I don't really want to divorce him over it - during positive phases (and even recruitment when he is gee'd up over it) he is great but it is wearing when he gets into the doldrums.

Does anyone else feel like this or have experienced it as a spouse/ partner?

I have got to the point where I have nothing new to say. We have been here so many times. In the end, I end up saying the wrong thing. I think he wants me to tell him just to quit but we need his wage (I work too but earn nowhere near what he earns).

Not really sure what to do. Divorce seems really harsh because other than this things are good.

Not really sure what to do.

Well, what have you tried so far?

Is it possible he’s just in the wrong career altogether? Has he ever considered retraining or changing the type of work he does? You say he is driven by wealth and status but you also say that ‘we need his wage’ so is it both of you that are financially driven?

Or do you think he just likes to moan?

Honestly after that long I'd probably just tell him that I don't want to hear about it any more. That moaning to me won't change anything and it's exhausting listening to him. He either does something to change things or he just needs to suck it up.

Its him for sure but if you want to stay in the marriage I would call his bluff. Book an estate agent to come value the house and tell him your downsizing end of story. You refuse to listen to another 15 years of him hating his job. See what happens

What did he learn from his parents about work and relationships?

You have dc - please get out before they absorb this damaging message.

God I couldn’t tolerate that, especially for that long, so I’m not sure what to suggest. Could you maybe just start telling him you don’t want to hear it, every time he starts acting like a sadsack? Just refuse to listen to it anymore?

Start calling him Victor..
What a bloody martyr...
And a miserable old git!

Is downsizing your house so he can have a complete change of job/career an option?

Why don't you swap? We were in the same situation and I now work the 60hrs and partner is part time.

He'll never change. Ever.

One thing which jumps out is that you have had issue with this for a long time, yet never taken any real action to improve the situation for yourself, which is somewhat similar to the complaining yet inertia of your husband. Indeed, the house purchase bound you closer to him, and him to an employer.

What do you want for the rest of your life? You do have choices here.

Personally, life's too short and I'd divorce.

@Countrystrife

I have been with my DH for 18 years. We have two DC.

He is a career man, very driven by status and wealth. However, for all of the 18 years he has hated whatever job he has, works stupid hours because he "has" to and is generally always stressed about work.
Weekends he sulks. If I ask what is wrong the answer is always "work".

He has had 4 jobs in those 18 years and with each job comes the promise that it will be different this time. Especially since DC came along. It never changes. It is who he is. It is him, not the job. I am sure he could work in a newsagent but turn it into a 60hr week job because it wouldn't run smoothly without him there (to him, anyway).

He insists it is the job but it isn't, is it? By now it must be him. I have had two jobs in the same time and, yes, there are bits of both I dislike(d) neither were bone crushingly awful that they ruined my life. We started out in the same industry so I do know the pressures but surely he should have learned to deal with them by now.

I have suggested counselling but he refuses as to him all will be well in the world if he just had a different job. He then procrastinates about finding a new job, he is often approached by head hunters and recruitment agencies but never follows up.

It feels to me that the last 18 years have been spent listening to him complain about work, talking about finding a new job or a completely different career (all my suggestions met with a negative) or in the recruitment process (which is just brutal with what feels like 15 rounds of hoops to jump through).

He gets a new job - sometimes it starts out ok and he is positive for a while (longest about 2yrs) but then the cycle starts again.

We always end up back where we started.

I am tired of it. Bored of it. He will not see that maybe, just maybe the problem lies within himself. That perhaps working on himself might lead to more fulfilment.

I have actually started to avoid him because I cannot bear another sad sack conversation where he laments not being able to have an easy 9-5 job, that he "has" to work long hours etc when he will not work towards any other alternative.

We moved house 2yrs ago (during a positive phase) and at the time I asked him if he really wanted to do this as it meant we would need his wage for the next 15 years. He agreed. Now he complains about being stuck forever in this job to pay for the house.

It is exhausting.

He sounds exactly like my Ex. Me and the kids were expected to be eternally grateful to him for doing his 'big job' because of it wasn't for him and his martyrdom we would have nothing (not true). If we bought a new car, booked a holiday or moved house, it was all because of his hard work (I worked too and fully raised the kids as he was too busy with his big job)

The higher he climbed and more he earned, the worse he got.

I lost count of the number of times I suggested he step down from his big job and we scale back the lifestyle....because then he wouldn't have been able to be a martyr and the big man.

I divorced him in the end as I realised that he was an absolutely awfully abusive narcissist. Sulking, silent treatment, blah, blah, blah.

He now has nothing in his life - we are all NC with him - except for his big job.

Is he depressed. My dh was constantly complaining abut his job. Changed loads of times
Always got good jobs as well qualified, happy for a while then off he went complaining again. He was depressed and didn't realise so had this fantasy that the ideal job would make him feel better. Dealing with the depression helped.
If he refuses to deal with it just find one sentence, :
I'm sure you will work it out..and then walk off.
Does he blame his coworkers or is it the actual work?

There are some people who are never really happy. If you gave them a million pounds they're still be moaning.

Accept he is what he is, he won't change, or leave him.

"I think he wants me to tell him just to quit but we need his wage (I work too but earn nowhere near what he earns)."

Honestly, I'd try this. You moved, you can move again. My DH had a 'big' high earning job, retrained, will pretty much never earn a fraction of what he did before. Its fine. He still has workaholic tendencies but nothing like what he did previously, he's around, he's an involved engaged parent - to be fair, I wouldn't have had kids with him in his previous job.

So... sit him down and say, what would you like to do if you quit? Think seriously about ways you could support him to retrain in something else. Take six months off. There will be a way its financially possible, even if it means a smaller house/different area. Then put it to him, ask him to think about it, and give him a bit of an ultimatum: you either make a change or you stop complaining constantly. I'd also suggest some form of counselling.

There is a big pressure in being the breadwinner. But it sounds like he's not just imagining that. moving jobs hasn't done anything, but if its been financially impossible for him to consider moving sectors maybe that's what he needs?

I think 3 options:

1. Leave him

1. Downsize house and he gets less pressured job

1. Deal with depression eg. Antidepressants (at least try them) and / or counseling

I'd work backwards on this. You may need to threaten 1 on order to get 3 in motion, but so be it. You only have 1 life and it's too short to listen to negativity.

@Secretsout oh god, this does sound familiar. I don't think he would ever ever give up his job. There is a lot of sighing and wringing of hands over spending any money and any big financial decision is made by him.
The house was his decision because at the time we had just paid off our mortgage on the old house (2 bedrooms, tiny terraced house) and he decided that he needed something to "work for".
I am not that materialistic and like having a savings buffer because I always feel he is on the precipice of melting down and quitting work.
I was looking at houses much cheaper than this one but he was determined to have the four bed detached with big garden. A three bed semi was all I was looking for with a mortgage I could cover with my wage.

I work 0.6 FTE, if I went full time (which wouldn't be immediate as I would potentially have to get a new job) I would earn £50-£60k tops. Our basic expenses are almost £3k a month. We would just scrape by on my FT salary and he would not be happy with having no extra money to spend.

I have tried so many things but he refuses to take any action himself:
I offered shared parental leave both times - "career suicide" apparently
Suggested we both went to 0.8FTE contracts so we could share part time working - he laughed at me, again "career suicide" for a man (ok for me to torpedo my career though).
I have begged him to go to the GP about depression but he absolutely refuses to go and refuses medication (he refuses to take paracetamol even when he has a headache - he would rather just moan at me) so I know he wouldn't take anti depressants.
His boss is quite high profile in terms of promoting mental health - I am tempted at times to contact him to ask for help but DH would divorce me if I did that. Clearly, his boss does not practice what he preaches.

He has changed career in the past, his qualifications are transferable - I have the same ones and have suggested more than once that we both do 0.8FTE contracts for my (large, solid but not exactly exciting) employer which would give us a joint income of at least £80k a year (he earns £100k) which would be absolutely fine but he belittles my job and employer and says that he would be embarrassed to take such a step down (but, again, fine for me to take the hit for our family).

Our mortgage is fixed for another 3 years, we would have to pay a penalty to leave now and I am not sure I would want to buy anywhere else straightaway with him if he is going through some kind of crisis.

Currently he enjoys the title and the kudos of his job and I think he enjoys the work - I think it is the office politics that get to him. Perhaps the people, I do wonder if he is autistic (we are currently having our DS assessed and so many things resonate with DH), he has no work "friends" and never socialises with work except maybe a Christmas drink. He always has to be seen to be the hardest working though and complains that others are lazy/ stupid etc.

He is a glass half full person, a bit of an eeyore at times but at the moment I can't even bare to read his texts.

Maybe I will have to lay it out for him that I can't carry on like this but I know he will just accuse me of not supporting him. He thinks all of my suggestions are useless, that I am not helpful and I live a life of luxury (in a job which would be too demeaning for him).

Half empty, definitely not half full.

Just received a text from him "below average day. Not sure when I will be home."

I can almost hear the sad sack voice, it irritates me. I am not even sure if it is his boss keeping him at work or whether he chooses to stay. Like I say, I have worked in that industry (a long time ago now) and at his level he should be able to manage his hours better than this. As trainees/ newly qualified we would have to work long hours but he is quite senior now.

Jeeeeeezzzzzzz.....just reading your last update has had me exhausted. How on earth have you managed to sustain living with someone like this. Where is your enjoyment OP? What gives you laughter and happiness? I really could never be with someone like your husband for 5 minutes...it must be absolutely hell at times for you. You really must stop this and look inward to find a way out of this mess. He needs help and you need rest and peace. How you are going to find this I just dont know. Big hug to you by the way, you deserve a medal x

I'm so sorry. This is no way to live. I would suggest a trial separation for six months so that you can see what life is like without being shackled to a constant misery.

Also, search for a poster called "StuckInPollyMode" who is divorcing her horrible, fun-sucking husband. It's very instructive.

You have no idea if his boss doesn't practice what he preaches - you could just have a moany husband who stretches out work and pretends he's fine in the office

What leaps out at me is that he chooses to moan at you and won't take paracetamol - he just wants to bring you down with him

Don't listen to any moaning, leave the room - go and watch tv on your own - entirely ignore him - this is NO WAY to live

Better yet, leave when you feel ready

For fucks sake, I've done 40 years in the NHS full time most of it a single parent. I've worked my arse off but never complain because I have my own home, provided for my family and have a good pension, it's easy to moan but it takes work to see the good in your job, I love mine because it's never boring.
Nobody wants to hear the constant moaning, he needs to understand that, if he won't work towards what he really wants to do then he needs to shut up.
i can't stand people who moan all the time.