Being vulnerable in a relationship. What does it mean? What does it look like?

[SmallSilverElephant]

OK I've posted here before about dire relationship history and I need some information please 🙂.

Brief background -

I'm nearly 47. Have a history of emotional and physical abuse. One parent is dead and the other I've had no contact with for 10 years.

Prior to this, I had 'boyfriends' but they were all very short term and abusive including one long term 'relationship' with a man who was my best friend at school - very compatible as friends, no compatibility as a partner. Relationship was loveless and sexless (aside from functional sex to conceive). We lived as friends/housemates until this itself became toxic and he fell in love with someone and we split up. We've always remained amicable and have co parented well.

Losing one parent/going no contact with the other and my relationship ending all happened with a few weeks of each other 10 years ago. It gave me a real chance to start again and I felt so free and light!

When I was a teen/young adult, I had no idea what a relationship looked like. I would argue and verbally fight with boyfriends. I was always on the defensive. If they weren't cruel or unkind, I felt apprehensive and on edge, like I was waiting for it to happen because that's all 'love' had looked like to me. For many years, I believe that if someone was shouting, hitting, snarling at me it meant they felt something but I knew it wasn't love at the same time. I think I was just seeking proof that i was unlovable to everyone. Kind, gentle, 'loving' men made me feel a bit angry and repulsed because it meant they didn't care. I treated them with contempt because I didn't believe anyone could love me or have feelings for me so I believed they were almost mocking me by being with me and had no self respect. I felt shame and embarrassment for them. I ended up completely internalising the idea that I was fundamentally unlovable and behaved and treated others accordingly. I had no empathy. Being in a 'relationship' with my best friend worked because there were no 'feelings' attached to it. Through therapy I've learnt that 'love' can be problematic - we can end up craving it but also be repulsed by the idea of it.

When it all ended 10 years ago, I realised things had to change. I'd previously had counselling and therapy but I was always looking for answers they were never going to give me (eg why was I unlovable? How could I become loveable?) It hadn't occurred to me that I'd become that way through life experience. Nothing they said made sense to me and I felt frustrated by it. I decided that needed to change.

I had therapy. I've had several lots of therapy since. It's helped a lot but there are somethings I've still not managed to overcome.

And I've still not become loveable!

I'm kinder than i was, to myself and others. I've learnt and developed empathy. Many people have described me as the kindest and loveliest person they know. My children are hugely empathetic and have been recognised for their kindness and emotional maturity many times so I know I've got that sorted.

I take time for myself. I have hobbies and interests now - i have self care sorted.

I overhauled my appearance. Physically, I'm attractive. I see that and it's recognised by others - I have that sorted.

I'm sociable and approachable now - I have friends, I go out, I talk to people. I appear/am (?) confident and self assured. People warm to me - I think I have that sorted.

I still get asked out by men. But I've never had a fulfilling or successful relationship.

I understand part of that is because I'm older and there are fewer men out there but I meet single men, I get asked out, I date... but i still haven't managed to progress to a relationship. And no one has ever fallen in love with me.

I keep being told I need to let myself be vulnerable. And, tbh, I don't know what that means or would look like. Being vulnerable when i was younger meant weak. It meant people (my parents) having ammunition against me. I battened down the hatches and have fought my way through life. In the past 10 years, not aggressively. But quietly. Raised voices terrify me. I don't 'argue' with anyone.

I find it difficult to express my needs because my needs were never important and it feels demanding. But most importantly, I don't know how to be vulnerable. Or what it means.

I'm no longer in survival mode. But it's like i don't know how to 'live'.

What does being vulnerable look like?

Don't know who / what situation / by whom had told you to be more vulnerable ? However , it sounds like you have spent some time analysing yourself . Being honest , perhaps too much . You sound very self aware and almost proud of yourself, there is an awful amount of ' I ' in your post !

A relationship is about two people .

That's not really helpful!

I'm not in a relationship - there aren't 2 people! I can only talk abut what I've done in terms of self improvement - which is fundamentally about the self. Or I.

Therapy and people on here have consistently told me to be more vulnerable.

I've been able to make improvements elsewhere but I haven't been able to do that that.

I suppose part of being vulnerable could mean being less defensive?

But you don't sound defensive. You sound like someone who has been through a lot and worked hard to get to where you are now.

What is it you're looking for from a relationship?

You talk of someone falling in love with you - do you also want to be in love? Do you feel you're missing out from not having this?

Your life sounds really positive. It's natural to miss what you haven't had or 'got' though.

For me, I think (and I'm not an expert and could easily be wrong) that being vulnerable is being honest about feelings even if you could get hurt. It's being open and trusting that even if someone doesn't reciprocate then you'll be OK and not emotionally scarred for someone not liking you back. Being vulnerable is actually being strong.

People who get angry instead of expressing that their feelings are hurt think they're being strong and protecting themselves, when actually being strong (IMO) is being vulnerable and saying - this has hurt me can we talk it out please. But you also have to be careful that you don't control someone by making it all about your feelings on something.

The word missing for me from what you describe OP is trust. I think being vulnerable in a relationship means putting your trust in someone else to have your back. Trust is earned so that takes time.

You might want to read some Brene Brown - she talks a lot about the importance of being vunerable, and how if we can't be vunerable we are never being our authentic self. What she has to say about shame is incredibly powerful too

You should be congratulated on your progress. You have worked on on your evolution and shown courage. Being vulnerable is another egoic identity badge. Don't go back to something the universe has already rescued you from. You have reached a level that some cannot reach.
Sometimes if the train doesn't stop at your station then it is not your train. Time to relax after all your hard work and be patient. The right one will come along. Remain as your True self!

@CMOTDibbler

You might want to read some Brene Brown - she talks a lot about the importance of being vunerable, and how if we can't be vunerable we are never being our authentic self. What she has to say about shame is incredibly powerful too

I second this, she has a Netflix talk too

I think you need to stop fixing things OP. You have made tremendous progress and I hope feel happier in yourself now than before. Just chill out a bit.

At the end of the day people are imperfect, they will never respond exactly how you want them to. That's OK. You can love them anyway, or set boundaries, or whatever you want to really.

"Being vulnerable" is a really unhelpful phrase IMO. "Chilling out" has helped me much more. Just to relax a bit, stop trying to manage everything, improve everything, fix everything. You might find MBTI or the Enneagram helpful to conceptually give yourself a box to relax into.

For me, being vulnerable meant accepting that he might cheat or be awful or that I might end up back at square one, but to do it anyway, because when I imagined “the worst that could happen” I was still ok. If he cheated then fine, I’d finish it and be ok on my own, or meet someone else. There was no point in getting het up and jealous and being highly strung about everything because in any relationship by loving someone and accepting that they might not love you back quite as much you’re being vulnerable. But if you constantly have a guard up, worry that things won’t work out, or control your partner in a bid to keep things from going wrong, you’ll still get hurt if they do, you’ve just made yourself miserable along the way.

So to me, I think being vulnerable is almost being strong, because I accept that I may get hurt and love wholeheartedly anyway. I know I won’t always come first (he has kids and an unreliable ex) and that used to make me feel angry and sad and unimportant, but I’ve learned to let that feeling go and to be ok with not always getting my needs met because someone else needs him too. And I can tell him that I miss him without needing him to do anything about it. It also took some changes for him to realise that good communication made a big difference.

If you’re not meeting the right men, even though you’re going on dates and doing all the right things, are you feeling that the faults are with them, or with you?

And yes, maybe it’s chilling out or “not sweating the small stuff” rather than vulnerability that has helped me.

FWIW the men you’re meeting won’t have done half the amount of work on themselves that you have, they’ll be imperfect too, so you don’t need to have it all together to be able to date.

If you can accept your own flaws and theirs too, it might help.

I watched a good YouTube video the other day by Alain De Botton called

I sent it to DP as I found it really useful, but he didn’t really like it, as he likes to think he’s perfect!! The gist of it is that none of us are perfect, we’re going to drive each other mad sometimes but that’s ok, it’s just part of being human, and finding someone “good enough” should be the goal. The standout quote for me was that “the most dangerous man in Hollywood is Walt Disney” for peddling the idea of happily ever after!

Watching Bene Brown on vulnerability - it's daring to be yourself, authentic and risking getting hurt.

She has a talk on Netflix - call to courage, it's about being vulnerable.

Well done on all your growth, OP.

Being vulnerable in a relationship can mean all sorts of things. To me the most important thing is Sharing with your partner your vulnerable feelings, and even more allowing them to support you or take care of you in some ways. For example, you have had a bad day and feel sad. A non-vulnerable way to deal with this would be to hibernate/ stay away from your partner until you felt better. A vulnerable way would be to tell them how sad you feel.... maybe let them cuddle you, and 'be the strong one' for a little, and actually give you comfort. There is a sharing and a willingness to let your defences down and rely on the other person. You don't need to be in a relationship to practice this. You can equally do it with friends. Often if we are afraid of being vulnerable we expect the other person to be burdened by this, but actually people are often happy to feel needed and to be 'let in'. It helps them feel valued and close to you.

It is also simply about allowing yourself to need somebody. If you need somebody you are inevitably vulnerable, because they might not deliver, and therefore you might end up with your needs unmet. So that means opening up and loving to the point that you would be pretty darn miserable, at least for a while, if they let you down. It's basically increasing the stakes of the game - it can make love deeper, it can mean you receive wonderful things, but it also means you are vulnerable to loss. It makes the potential to be hurt greater, but it also allows you to live life more fully.

That's my perspective anyway - hope it is useful.

Thank you for the responses!

OK.

So it seems that I do make myself vulnerable. At least in some respects.

So if I've had a bad day at work, or I'm worried about something, I will talk about it. It doesn't happen often but I don't feel the need to present a 'I'm perfect and nothing gets me down' face to the world. I've not ever had the experience of being given a hug though. But I don't shy away from talking about how I feel.

I'm OK. I'm OK single and I have good enough stuff going on to know that I'll be OK if I split up with someone. I've mostly been single. I'm not needy, I don't get jealous. My position is that I don't get jealous so I don't express fears but I won't tolerate disrespect. So if a man meets up with a female friend for lunch, or goes out with his friends or goes out for the night with a mixed group of friends without me because it doesn't bother me. I know that worrying about it isn't going to change whether he does or not. But equally, I wouldnt tolerate cheating or finding out they were messaging others etc. There's be no tears, no pleading, no promises, I'd just be gone.

I know that being insecure and 'needy' and seeking reassurance is unattractive so I don't do it. But part of this is because I have no expectations. I suppose I trust men to behave with integrity until they prove that they don't! I know that if someone treats me badly it's about them and nothing to do with me.

I don't always tell someone if they have upset me but usually I do. It depends what it is and how I think they would respond from what I know of them already. Sometimes this makes me realise there is no future in it and I end it. Sometimes I put it on my little mental blackboard and operate a three strikes and you're out policy. Sometimes I've spoken to them about it. Sometimes, when I've spoken to them about it, they've dumped me because they don't want to be challenged or have their bad behaviour reflected back to them. Sometimes they've apologised and explained it and it's been a misunderstanding. But i don't think anyone has ever reassured me or hugged me. No one has ever been scared to lose me.

I'll have a look at the Brene Brown stuff. Thanks.

As for what do I want from a relationship. Someone who can meet me halfway I suppose. Someone who wants their own space and will allow me mine; someone who has hobbies and interests they want to pursue; someone who wants to share their life with me and be interested in mine; mutual support; fun - someone I can laugh and be a bit silly with at times but someone who doesn't shy away from the serious stuff. I have no aspirations to marry or cohabit. I want someone who is proud to be seen with me who looks at me and smiles with a bit of a "she's mine, she is!" And wants me to feel that way about them. Someone who can be emotionally open and honest and who appreciates that in return. Someone who isn't constantly hoping they'll meet someone 'better'!

Am I just looking for a unicorn?

Some things I've learned............

If you don't love yourself, you'll always be chasing people who don't love you either.

It's not your job to detox people. It's your job to detox the part of you that resonates with their toxicity.

i won't let people walk through my mind with their dirty feet (Gandhi)

Love that quote.

I don't know if I love myself. I like and value myself though. I don't chase anyone.

Eg I went on a date last week. He said he'd like to see me again but hasn't been forthcoming in arranging a second date. I told him when I was free. He wasn't free then but hasn't suggested an alternative date. He messages me almost daily. I've no problem with being friendly (I've known him for a few years and we have mutual friends) but I won't be suggesting another date and I won't be messaging first. Neither am I seeing the contact we do have as a positive sign. It's been a week. I'll give it another and if nothing else has been arranged then I'll let it drift.

I don't know if I love myself. I like and value myself though. I don't chase anyone

You do!! probably don't say it to yourself enough.

Another quote...............

To love yourself is to understand you don't need to be perfect to be good!

@SmallSilverElephant

Love that quote.

I don't know if I love myself. I like and value myself though. I don't chase anyone.

Eg I went on a date last week. He said he'd like to see me again but hasn't been forthcoming in arranging a second date. I told him when I was free. He wasn't free then but hasn't suggested an alternative date. He messages me almost daily. I've no problem with being friendly (I've known him for a few years and we have mutual friends) but I won't be suggesting another date and I won't be messaging first. Neither am I seeing the contact we do have as a positive sign. It's been a week. I'll give it another and if nothing else has been arranged then I'll let it drift.

Do you want to see him again? If so, why aren’t you suggesting dates as well? The leave it to him to do all the work is sending a message that you are not interested in him. You have to reciprocate to progress to a relationship.

Thanks.

This is what I find difficult.

We are all flawed. None of us are perfect. I don't feel the need to be perfect and I don't expect or perceive perfection in others.

But this isn't reflected in experiences of others.

So I often think there's be sethkg really fundamental that I'm missing. Maybe about myself, maybe about others.

I see my flawed friends meeting people, falling in love, being loved in return.

Maybe I'm expecting too much? Maybe I am just fundamentally unlovable?

Do you want to see him again? If so, why aren’t you suggesting dates as well? The leave it to him to do all the work is sending a message that you are not interested in him. You have to reciprocate to progress to a relationship.

I have suggested another date. He wasn't available and didn't suggest another.

He messaged around 5pm yesterday and asked what I was doing that evening. I told him (I was busy) and he replied "Oh we could have done something." He's done that twice now. That's easy to say isn't it? Easy to look like you were going to invite someone round when they've already said they're not free.

He's done that twice now.

He's busier than I am socially. I have a child at home to work around. I've already told him I can be free but need a bit of notice.

He plans in advance. He will know when his free nights are.

Sorry, didn’t realise you had suggested dates too. In which case, I think you are doing the right things. He’s the one not reciprocating so I think he’s either going slow or not interested.

You’ve done a ton of self care so I don’t think you are unlovable at all. Think of it as you have high standards.

@PlanDeRaccordement

Sorry, didn’t realise you had suggested dates too. In which case, I think you are doing the right things. He’s the one not reciprocating so I think he’s either going slow or not interested.

You’ve done a ton of self care so I don’t think you are unlovable at all. Think of it as you have high standards.

Thank you.

I would think of it as having high standards but it's not that simple.

Fucking hell OP, are you me?

Will write more later.

@crackofdoom

Fucking hell OP, are you me?

Will write more later.

Please do!!

OP you're very articulate and have got to a great place in life through determination. A couple of things stand out for me:

1. Self acceptance and self compassion. Accept that you are okay just as you are, right now. Tara Brach is good on this. You are loveable. Nobody else needs to see this except you.

1. What are you hoping a man will bring to the party? You've said what you want in a man, but what is he actually going to bring for you ?

1. As for why has no-one fallen in love with you? You haven't met the right man for you yet, that's all. Try to relax about it if you can. You might meet someone amazing in two years and then be glad you weren't with someone else iyswim.