Why do (some) men think women owe them pretty?

[CateBlanchettsHair]

Feel quite taken aback after attending a largely male function recently. I’m a young woman and have had attention before at events for being the only woman at an event of older men. Have also been apparently dismissed or not taken seriously for looking too young and equally I imagine, not pretty enough.

I recently went somewhere and was pretty shocked at the casual misogyny. Someone who I previously respected talked a lot about going to strip clubs, his type being a certain race of women known for their beauty and suggested flying out to this country to meet someone younger to get married to (this last bit said as a joke but still). I’m really struggling to still have respect.

I know women also judge on looks but it’s so boring that this kind of shite still happens.

@Bluntness100

To be honest I’ve attended predominantly female events and heard them discuss men like this. I’m afraid both genders can be guilty I’m afraid, it’s not a male only thing and very naive to think it is

Have you also seen stats where women sexually harass, are routinely paid more , are the majority of sexually exploitative porn industry designed and geared towards their pleasure even where men and boys or explored trafficked or have images posted without consent ? where women assault and rape men on anywhere NEAR the scale that men do to women ?

You will no

You can say that’s not what this thread is about but it absolutely is about the double standards
I note that you often defend men as if there’s anywhere close to the levels of discrimination against them as there is to women which is completely false . These things I mentioned. Above stem from the privelige men have .

Yes OP in my industry there's plenty of this sort of stuff and always has been.

Ii find it easier to say something now older but when young/ junior it's. Well if you do say something then it won't go down well.

A lot of events seem to be aimed at het men as well eg women dancing at Xmas party as entertainment.

So yes it's depressing but not uncommon. I think it's a bit better than I used to be. But I still had a colleague randomly start talking to me about hiring a prostitute when loads of men were around sort of half involved. In that case it was an aggressive/ put in place thing. I said well let me know when you want to talk about work and walked off.

And yes there are some women usually ones who are the 'I'm not a feminist I can stand up for myself I'm not see weak' types who do it to sort of join in on reverse I suppose.

Also a certain type of middle aged woman with young men being overly flirty.

Yes that's also bad and yes men on the receiving end can feel very uncomfortable etc.

The dynamics are totally different though. Completely different.

That sounds like a rerun of a conversation at my last IT conference before covid hit. The sales team, all men, were openly discussing how Russian women were all gorgeous and British women let themselves go as soon as they had dcs, get fat and can't be bothered with their appearance.

I was fuming because at least three of them have lovely intelligent hard working, beautiful wives.

@Mintjulia

That sounds like a rerun of a conversation at my last IT conference before covid hit. The sales team, all men, were openly discussing how Russian women were all gorgeous and British women let themselves go as soon as they had dcs, get fat and can't be bothered with their appearance.

I was fuming because at least three of them have lovely intelligent hard working, beautiful wives.

Ugh... Sales Teams. Apologies for anyone who's a member of one who I am about to unfairly tar with the same brush, however in my experience they tend to be some of the absolute worse. Tend to attract the wannabe-Alpha, wideboy types who see themselves as some sort of silver-tongued casanovas. Quite what the lovely, intelligent, hard-working wives saw in them I dunno. But I guess the culture of seeing yourself as a "hustler" probably doesn't help.

To be honest I’ve attended predominantly female events and heard them discuss men like this.

I've attended plenty of predominantly female professional events and I have literally never heard women discuss men like this. They don't tend to talk about men at all, to be honest. Could this just be the circles you move in?

The difference is that women ultimately see men as human beings and feel uncomfortable taking someone’s humanity away from them and judging them purely based on their looks.

I learned quite early on, from my DB in fact, that boys didn’t need to like a girl as a person to want to fuck her.

SWALT and NAMALT and all that but it’s a general rule.

@Lessthanaballpark

The difference is that women ultimately see men as human beings and feel uncomfortable taking someone’s humanity away from them and judging them purely based on their looks.

I learned quite early on, from my DB in fact, that boys didn’t need to like a girl as a person to want to fuck her.

SWALT and NAMALT and all that but it’s a general rule.

This is spit on . I think a lot of this is supported by the porn industry too which presents women as a series of body parts , ages , nationalities etc . Women physical qualities are broken down in literally dozens of ways and men spend time clicking from image to image , clicking women based on the size of their body parts or ages etc Go to any porn sure and you might see one part of the male body catagorised , the few activities focussing on make body parts are often aimed at men . There’s nothing like the way women are presented for men , to be used by men and swapped out when that’s boring for the next exciting body part Big titties boring you, try small ones , how about tall women , short women , Swedish woman big hugs small butts , old , young it goes on and on …. This absolutely filters through into how many men see women in the everyday world.

@doingnothing

Your title has nothing to do with your OP, did you miss some of it out?

Women Don’t Owe You Pretty is a term used by Chidera Eggerue and then (stolen some might say) by Florence Given.

I had an experience recently where I met my friend (male) out for a drink. He had a friend with him (also male). Both men were married. Pleasant enough experience, we went our separate ways. My friend contacted me the following day to tell me how his friend had commented on how 'lovely' I was and how 'attractive'. Whilst my friend thought he was passing on a compliment, it really annoyed me. It felt like I'd passed some sort of test. If I'd have been a man would my looks been commented on, as if my worth is based on it.

What I hate is when I wear dresses and male acquaintances have felt the need to advise me that I should wear dresses more often because it makes me look feminine!

@Lessthanaballpark

What I hate is when I wear dresses and male acquaintances have felt the need to advise me that I should wear dresses more often because it makes me look feminine!

Or to smile Or never cut your hair Or whatever other ‘advice ‘ they like to offer to make us more pleasant for them to look at !

I used to work for the NHS.
The women regularly made remarks about male colleagues/visitors looks or bodies. Very openly too.
I never once heard a male staff member do the same.

@Debetswell

I used to work for the NHS. The women regularly made remarks about male colleagues/visitors looks or bodies. Very openly too. I never once heard a male staff member do the same.

What’s your point . There’s mountains more people here saying plenty more men do it and not only that, men sexually harrass and abuse women in far greater numbers every single day all over the planet You can look at the statistics for who’s assaulting who and I promise you women are not the main offenders . When women objectify and targeting men they may feel uncomfortable and worry for their embarrassment . When men objectify women they often feel threatened and literally have to worry for their safety and lives So what exactly is your point ? Why would it even be relevant if in your one industry yoh heard that In the industry me and it seems most of the other women posting here are in they have heard the opposite I’d also challenge you to find a woman who hasn’t felt unsafe at some stage when a man has sexualised and objectified her . Often this starts for girls at a very young age which is even more disturbing .

All the misogyny apologists are out in force on this thread!

The men that are predatory and won't take no for an answer. Women aren't human to them. We're either fuckable or nothing.

Have you ever heard your female NHS colleagues taking about hiring prostitutes for their night away from home for the Xmas do?

Or had them regularly go to whatever the male equivalent of a 't*try bar' is after drinks?

Boak. Glad I'm single, but doesn't make me hopeful about finding love.

I've been on the receiving end of this sort of talk (and behaviour) before. As a result I disassociated myself with the sleazeballs completely or as far as possible.

Tbf

Most of it is dick swing nasty types misogynists obv.

Usually it's one man talking shit and the others just going along with it. Which is really usually and really unhelpful.

With the strip clubs etc it's been so normalised. Still some never go.

In the end the fact that male bonding is about asserting dominance/ superiority over women is not unusual.

I wouldn't bother struggling to have respect for them as a person, I couldn't after that. They might be very good in the field in which case you can respect their skills while still finding them a failure at being a decent human being.

Bring pretty or hot isn’t remotely an advantage with these kind of men. It certainly doesn’t confer human status in their eyes.

Can I add TMMALT to the conversation - Too Many Men ARE Like That

I worked with a woman in her 40s who behaved exactly like this - leching on teenage boys, shouting sexual innuendo out of the car window, asking the young men to hold the ladder for her as she climbed up in her mini skirt. It was awful. But while I’d agree that some women do act like this, I’ve only encountered one but I’ve met scores of men like this. And many more men who present as decent until the mask slips.

Never met a lechy female lawyer have to say. Plenty of men though 🙄. Remember as a junior associate going to a meeting with the extremely senior partner in the Magic Circle firm I then worked in. As we left the meeting he said “May I say” I thought a Pearl of legal wisdom was coming but no an approving assessment of my arse 🙄. I was about 25 he must have been 50.

It is disrespectful.

I wonder why you feel you need to still 'respect' him?

Call it out next time ' I am not sure we should be talking about your private life here' that sort of comment. Shut it down and let him know it is inappropriate.

I call out sexist behaviour every single time now. I did last night at a drinks party, and I will continue to do so. We should all be taking this much more seriously. How are the idiots going to learn unless we point it out?