Bastard bingo - full house!!

[helplesshopeless]

Hi everyone, just creating a new thread for those interested as my second is nearly full now! I'll link back to the old one once mumsnet's browser is back up and running

[FantasticButtocks]

And just to add @helplesshopeless given the behaviour he is currently inflicting on your daughter, it's imperative that you separate from him as soon as possible.

As you say, it's one thing doing it to you, but quite another when it's your child.
He is an abuser. Hoping he'll start seeing the error of his ways is absolutely futile.

[freeatlast2021]

OMG I cannot believe this. That he is being such an ashole and ... am I understanding this correctly, his sister has posted this on Facebook?! So she is on his side, being awful just like him? Dear HH, I cannot wait for you to be out of that house and free of him. I wonder if you can go and talk to the police or somebody else about all this. I mean, you are mentioning talking and negotiating with him, dear God, I do not think it is at all possible, I mean he is totally out of his mind!!!

But mind you, people are sometimes horrible, selfish and just mean. My stbx/ex is giving my youngest hard time lately. She is the only one out of three who actually cares enough to go and visit and each time she does he gives her a hard time complaining how "they" do not visit enough. And he is the one who said "kids can visit when they want", and now he is blaming them, but mostly just hurting her. I can see that she is under so much pressure now as she feels responsible for his well being. I want to tell him something but worry that he will again take it on her, as he is selfish and careless, but more then anything I feel like going over and slapping his horrible ass.

Just get out of there as soon as you possible can, my friend and stay strong. Hugs.

[freeatlast2021]

[quote FantasticButtocks]@helplesshopeless

Am dreading telling her though, hope to do it jointly with my husband but I don't trust him to be able to do it in a helpful and positive manner.

Then why do it jointly? You know perfectly well that your instincts on this are correct, and that unless you just get on and tell her yourself, he will ensure it's a trauma for her just so he can illustrate that what you're choosing is bad for your dc.

In my experience, as both the child and the parent in this scenario, this telling the dcs jointly about divorce is something which makes the parents feel they are doing things properly, while actually being uncomfortable at best for the child or children. The emotions from the adults do filter down, however well managed, and these joint stage-managed announcements are destabilising for the dcs as they sense the fakery. Dcs need to feel that the adults have everything under control, it makes them feel safe. The only thing that is important to a child of that age is their own part in it, where they'll sleep, how their life will be. Best way is to speak about it is casually in conversation: "we are going to have two houses now, one mainly daddy's and one mainly ours, and you're going to have a bedroom in each house! You'll still go to your nursery and you'll still do '

No further explanation is needed, apart from answering any questions she has.

Forget telling her jointly with him, as you know how that will go. [/quote]
I agree. Especially the part about doing it casually, try not to make it too dramatic and she will be fine.

[FantasticButtocks]

@FantasticButtocks

And just to add *@helplesshopeless* given the behaviour he is currently inflicting on your daughter, it's imperative that you separate from him as soon as possible.

As you say, it's one thing doing it to you, but quite another when it's your child.
He is an abuser. Hoping he'll start seeing the error of his ways is absolutely futile.

Because when he's doing it to you, you're an adult who has a choice whether to be there or leave, whether to accept his behaviour and make excuses for it. But your daughter doesn't. You have to choose what kind of life your daughter has. She needs protecting from him.

[Justilou1]

You must always assume that his family is 100% on his side and against you. Don’t believe any overtures of kindness or generosity. Disregard any history you have together if it was ever great. They will do their best to turn your child against you as she is older because you will always be the woman who cheated and broke his heart. They will believe everything he says and nothing will change their minds. (Chances are, they brought him up to behave the way he did with you in the first place.)

[Mix56]

I agree, block them all on SM, including your abusive ex.
It will annoy him doubtlessly. But you can tell him exactly why. ie. his sister is slandering you, posting posts including his own daughter, its very fortunate for him, you didn't respond, that he has been reported to the police for domestic abuse.
Please do NOT feel any guilt about moving out. He doesn't have to know the date, just slowly remove your things so he wont notice, (to a friends house)
Do some sorting & say certain things are too small & going to the charity shop.
Remove anything if sentimental value so he doesn't destroy ant more of your things.
Order new bed for dd, & essentials for her delivered to the new house, then one day when he is out, organise friends to come, sling all your things into giant bin bags.& go.

Or, get family & friends over to protect you as you pack & remove all the things you bought/ kitchen appliances, any furniture etc. Its 50% yours.
Take photos before & after to show inventory

[Alcemeg]

Oh Lord, OP, I'm so sorry it's such a shitfest. He really is ghastly, isn't he. Like other PPs, I hope you can get yourself and your daughter out of that toxic environment as soon as possible.

[bigbaggyeyes]

Yes block all of them, i know sometimes blocking can exacerbate a situation as they will use other, more extreme ways, to get to you, but this can also make it more obvious, and as soon as it becomes obvious you can then go back to the police.

I know it's difficult raising issues such as the noises, as he's already conditioned you to be passive so he can continue, but I often (with my ex) started just saying it as soon as it came up, almost like ripping the plaster off, as the alternative is not to say anything and your dd gets caught in his idiocy. I still, even 10 years later finding myself thinking 'oh I won't mention it as he'll kick off' but then have to remind myself that it's not easier in the long run and you sometimes make a rod for your own back.

[Justilou1]

I hate to say it as it’s not entirely ethical… I would get a nannycam and get evidence of this behaviour. It’s probably not going to hold up in court, but it could be used to keep up your sleeve, and get him to back off.

[Mix56]

Thats what I was thinking too,
but last time HH tried to record him he started being speaking nicely, all whilst writing abusive messages.
You do need to denounce the sexual noises, it is completely out of order with a DC present.

[QuentinBunbury]

I think as long as you are factual and objective in what you say he can't do much in the longer term, once you've moved out.
It might get to a difficult point where you have to decide whether DD will be harmed most by no relationship or by him using her to get at you.
You need to tell him in writing though, not least so he knows you aren't just accepting his abuse.

[Mix56]

I think that the sol should get it in writing.
This is not going to end with a simple separation
The guy is poison
Who speaks affably while texting "you are a slut" (whatever)
This goes far beyond "basic" EA.

[InkieNecro]

You are being too passive. He is setting everything up to make you look like a lying, vicious and unfit mother and you aren't doing enough to offset it.

I would suggest a permanent dictaphone on and potentially a nanny cam to capture him making gestures behind your daughters back. Screenshot that Facebook post too.

Do not make the mistake of thinking that you will be believed when he is creating chat logs of false evidence. My chat logs against my ex are being used as evidence in court, and he is falsifying them and will use them against you.

Keep a diary as well, dates and times of everything and back it all up by emailing it to an address he doesn't know of.

[QuentinBunbury]

Well yes- but what does he want? Neither he nor HH are proposing to have DD full time or cut contact - so he gains nothing by making HH appear to be a liar.

HH you need to get into mediation pronto. Not long til your out of the house which will help too x

[Mix56]

HH doesn't know if H is going to pull a blinder, what if ultimately he goes for 50/50 or more ? You cannot trust him.
He has always gone back on his word.
It's gone from how much he loves you, & was going to go do anything to show you his contrition, to pure hatred.
This man will do anything to win,
OP is still being beaten with the EA stick, still feeling guilty for breaking up the family & trying to divorce amiably.
He meanwhile is on the road to vengeance, rewriting the story & out to do you as much harm as possible.

You need to get proof of his abuse.

[Justilou1]

ALWAYS assume that H will go for 50/50 custody in court to avoid paying maintenance. They can’t force them to stick to it.

[Morporkia]

He is a nasty, vicious, selfish abuser who has taken your guilt and weaponised it against you. He will attempt to weaponise your daughter and his vile sister is clearly cut from the same cloth. To reiterate a pp- do not be fooled by any friendly overtures from any of his family. My DD fell into that trap. She allowed his sister to have my GS (2) for the afternoon. When she went to collect him her ex was there, along with his sister, his new gf and her brother. It was basically an ambush and she was lucky to get away with just criminal damage to her car and violent threats towards her and my GS (who was in her arms while his dad and aunt were screaming in my DDs face) she managed to get an emergency non mol order... I say emergency it still took 10 days.. I’m rambling. My point is be wary. Don’t rely on previous good relations with his family and be cynical about every kind word or deed that comes your way from them. Good luck with your move and 💐

[InkieNecro]

He wants her name destroyed, he wants a court to tell him how nasty she is to justify his abuse victim status so he can show everyone.

I wouldn't be surprised if he went for full custody to punish her ad well as forcing her to pay maintenance to him. He's going to say he tried to be reasonable but look how difficult evil HH is making it and he needs to be the hero and save his daughter from the abuse HH is giving her.

You are being passive, you need to document everything including his lies, preferably by showing he makes gestures behind her back as well as stopping any contact with him except via solicitors. You have grounds for an emergency non molestation order, do it. It will help and don't give any head space to the shit about feeling guilty.

[billy1966]

OP,
So sorry things as still so awful.

I agree with above.

His abuse needs to be documented.

I fear that you are not taking him seriously.

He is capable of anything in his delusion thst you are at fault.

He can't care about his daughter genuinely and behave so dreadfully.

I think it all has to be documented.
Great news about the rental.

[helplesshopeless]

Thank you lovely ladies

I have a little key fob thing that records now, audio only though - I think it would be too risky to attempt to get something that also recorded visuals, would also be impossible to keep it in position all the time anyway. At least this little fob I can just keep in my pocket. Already have a few snips of him being very rude to me while we were at the park with my daughter! (Was not an intentional joint activity, I was meant to be seeing her and he'd whisked her off to the park, so I met them there so I could see her before he took her off for the day).

He's indicated that he's backing down on the extra night for now and that his solicitor's letter will confirm that. Expecting that response this week. I fully expect that he will say he wants the extra night by the new year or something. But I guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it - I just want to focus on the next few months for now and get my daughter settled.

Meanwhile I've tried to meet him in the middle with working out a transitional 'building up' pattern, but he's insistent that we absolutely have to be in that 6/14 pattern by the time I move out. Clearly that inflexibility is not in her best interests. In the same email he said he 'requires my confirmation that if she is struggling without him, she moves back to his house and we build up to her seeing me in my new home on a gradual basis.' So it seems he's happy to think of how she's managing with it all but only if it works in his favour!

For those of you mentioning mediation, I thought it wasn't recommended in dealing with people like this? I did ask my solicitor if she thought it would help and she said she'd advise against it for someone like him. I guess though the only alternative is to do it through solicitor correspondence which will only draw it out further and stop us from getting any sort of transitional plans in place before I move out. Do not sure what to do there.

Apparently his solicitor has told him I'm controlling 🙄 and that he will be addressing my arrogance and false allegations in his next response.

Meanwhile he says he is organising her birthday party and 'will let me know the details in due course'. He is apparently inviting all of his friends who hate me and think I'm a whore (as he put it), but I'm not allowed to invite any of mine (who actually have children who are friends with her) because apparently they are 'enablers' in encouraging me to leave him.

It's just all very blahhhh

[Mix56]

he 'requires my confirmation that if she is struggling without him, she moves back to his house and we build up to her seeing me in my new home on a gradual basis.'

Fuck that shit.

Re birthday, invite who you want, the more the merrier !!!!!
He is not the boss of you

[InkieNecro]

Have your own birthday party for her with HER friends as it is her birthday and all about her and not an opportunity for him to publicly humiliate you, be nice if you had that as evidence of him saying that though. You aren't together, you don't need to do joint parties or consult him on it.

Never believe anything he says or indicates. I know it sounds like I'm being patronising, but I'm telling you because I believed everything I was told and I was so wrong I still can't believe it.

[SunnyDayOut]

Hello, I have name changed.

Mediation is not recommended for abusive situations by for example Women’s Aid, but the alternative is court or protracted solicitor’s’ correspondence, which to be frank, Women’s Aid don’t pay for, you do. Having experienced all three, if you have a good mediator, then you have someone whose job it is, at a fraction of the cost, to negotiate between you. But you need a mediator who is experienced in dealing with high conflict (read abusive) situations, and possibly also to consider team mediation (by this I don’t mean collaborative law, but where there are two mediators in the room, this means they can use break out rooms with each of you in one if it gets too fraught, costs about twice the price). I found it a horrendously stressful experience, BUT no less stressful than court and a good deal cheaper than both court (most expensive) and solicitor’s letter (middle in terms of cost). What you don’t want, however, is multiple levels of communication - whatever you decide, there needs to be one way of communicating things.

What you have going on at the moment is a power play and I expect that it will be his way or court proceedings.

I agree just do two birthday parties - my DD’s father and I have always been fairly amicable, but she has always had two birthdays and two Christmases. That way you get to enjoy the special time without any conflict. He is trying to control the situation, but whatever you decide finally, it should have turn about for birthdays and Christmases, or the days split (and Morher’s Day for you, Father’s Day for him).

[QuentinBunbury]

Apparently his solicitor has told him I'm controlling 🙄 and that he will be addressing my arrogance and false allegations in his next response.
Haha what a knob
Honestly. As if his solicitor would say that. IME solicitors want to talk about you and are reluctant to get into the other person any more than strictly necessary. Just ignore him.
Roll on the 10th eh, then you won't have to listen to his absolute bollocks.

[QuentinBunbury]

The fact he said he will be addressing your "arrogance " speaks volumes though. He can't stand it that you are leaving him. I'd love to see how the solicitor communicates that. Its possible he's going to fall out with then you know, if he insists they write this guff.