Ruining relationship - Debt

[moovinon]

When I met my partner 10 years ago, I was about 2/3 grand in debt. I couldn't get a loan out due to bad credit history and he offered to take out a loan for me. I paid it all off, then a few years later I started going in to my overdraft again. Once I start, it's like I can't stop. A few months in, I was back to 2 grand in debt again. I set up a loan and paid it all off. A year or so down the line, I did the same thing again.

I tried to hide it from my partner as I was embarrassed and clearly have issues with money. I have been paying off the most recent debt for a couple of years and took out a new loan to cover it all to ensure it was paid off within a shorter time period.

My partner has found out and I'm absolutely mortified. He says he is really shocked that I have been so sly as to hide it from him, and he can't believe we have secrets like that. He thought he knew me after so long and we have kids together and yet he doesn't really know me at all etc.

I understand it looks sly, but I was just so embarrassed that I didn't want to tell him. I would have paid it all off without mentioning anything to him, and I also pay halves on mortgage, bills etc so he isn't paying any extra due to me getting in to debt.

I obviously need help with my spending, and I obviously need help in how I can stop this messing up my relationship. I think he might be ready to leave.

Why would he leave over a couple of grand of debt that you have no trouble paying off?

We constantly have debt, we pay it off, we rack it up again. I know most of my friends are the same. Low or no interest debt makes more sense to me than trying to build up savings before buying things we want/need.

So long as it’s being paid, what’s the big deal?

I think he's more annoyed at the fact that I hadn't told him. He thinks I was trying to be really sly about it, when I genuinely just was embarrassed and it is something that I can, and do sort out myself.

He feels like the trust is completely gone because I tried to hide it etc from him for the last couple of years.

I don’t think he will leave, I think he’s just really disappointed that you lied to him about it. He knows you need his help. First step would be canceling your overdraft and any credit cards.
Have you thought about why you’re doing it? When I had counselling my therapist asked what I do when I’m feeling anxious/overwhelmed and/or feeling down.. as soon as she asked the question I knew instantly. I spend money like it’s going out of fashion. So now I check myself every time I'm spending online, do I really need this or is it a reaction?

You're not paying it off if you're doing so by taking out another debt.

It's the lies that would make me leave, that's not on at all. Look at the debt management boards on the MSE forum, to get some ideas of how you can get out of this cycle.

I wouldn't be happy to know my other half was racking up debts. I think lay your cards on the table so DP can see how much is left and your plan to clear it. Once that is done get a budget and stick to it. I find it helpful to take money out as soon as I get paid and put it in a different account. Then you don't have the chance to spend it, or fritter it! away.

What's the division of bills at home? What are you overspending on?

I think you both have different ideas of money. I personally would be very unhappy with debt. I've previously been in debt and worked to get out of it. Same as you op, are there any under lying issues as to why you keep going back into debt? Is being debt free a goal of yours? Or are you happy to incorporate small amounts of low interest or ideally interest free debt.

Are you overspending on household bills? Or non-essentials OP?
I think if it's the former, then the division of bills needs addressing.

To answer some of the questions:

@Blahblahblah40 I have often wondered why I do it. It's so impulsive and once I start, I just can't stop. I will be debt free for a year or so and then I start thinking that I need a couple of outfits, so I might take out a £100 overdraft and it just spirals out of control from there. I think it probably stems a bit from my upbringing, but can't totally blame it on that. From about 11 years old, my parents would say if I wanted clothes then I could borrow money off them and pay them back. We never had any money growing up and myDad would always tell me to take an overdraft or a loan out if I needed money when I was older. My parents basically lived in their overdraft.

@Orf1abc I do pay off the whole debt and then a year or so later, I then take out another one. I will definitely look on the debt management forum. Thank you!

@Shmithecat2 We pay halves on the mortgage, bills, food and then I get in to debt spending money on clothing, which is so pointless.

@inmyslippers I would love to be debt free again, and I am so proud of myself every time I pay the whole loan off and I promise myself I will never get in debt again, and then a year later I start overspending and again it spirals out of control. Ideally I would never get in to debt again but I can't trust myself.

Op do you invest at all? Maybe switch shopping high to watching your money grow

Is money too tight for you to be able to do things like buy clothes normally?

Could you start saving up little pots of money for things like this instead of going into debt for it?

I don't think "being embarrassed" is a good enough reason - you have been deceitful and it's not surprising he's disappointed and angry.

@moovinon

To answer some of the questions:

@Blahblahblah40 I have often wondered why I do it. It's so impulsive and once I start, I just can't stop. I will be debt free for a year or so and then I start thinking that I need a couple of outfits, so I might take out a £100 overdraft and it just spirals out of control from there. I think it probably stems a bit from my upbringing, but can't totally blame it on that. From about 11 years old, my parents would say if I wanted clothes then I could borrow money off them and pay them back. We never had any money growing up and myDad would always tell me to take an overdraft or a loan out if I needed money when I was older. My parents basically lived in their overdraft.

@Orf1abc I do pay off the whole debt and then a year or so later, I then take out another one. I will definitely look on the debt management forum. Thank you!

@Shmithecat2 We pay halves on the mortgage, bills, food and then I get in to debt spending money on clothing, which is so pointless.

@inmyslippers I would love to be debt free again, and I am so proud of myself every time I pay the whole loan off and I promise myself I will never get in debt again, and then a year later I start overspending and again it spirals out of control. Ideally I would never get in to debt again but I can't trust myself.

Do you both earn equally?

It is a really big betrayal. I would offer transparency into your finances so he can see that you are not acquiring debt.

Your overdraft is for accidental transactional problems like your paycheck being delayed by a few hours and your water bill going through early, not for actual overspending,

Perhaps going forward, you could get rid of your overdraft facility to get rid of the temptation?

I too would be unhappy with the lies. I was in a lot of debt when myself and DH got together. It I told him a few months in when we became official and before we got too serious as I wanted to be transparent with him. Anecdotally, I have just refused to lend a good friend money to pay debt as he won’t tell his wife, I refuse to enable him. As I tell my 6 year old all the time, honesty is always the best policy!

Whilst I can see a massive issue if this was huge amounts and you were not paying it down— I couldn’t get excited about this — a good idea though to think why you splurge OP —-but I think it’s wellOTT if someone says they are going to leave because of it. I’m sure plenty of women on here have been married to guys who suddenly come home having bought something on credit for £2k or so without any consultation. I do think people speaking like headmistresses to the OP and appear to control every penny in the household must be a bundle of joy to live with or they just enjoy making others feel less perfect specimens.

I’m sure plenty of women on here have been married to guys who suddenly come home having bought something on credit for £2k or so without any consultation

^^Not at all. People have different attitudes towards money. I wouldn't be compatible with someone so comfortable with debt.

Whilst I can see a massive issue if this was huge amounts and you were not paying it down— I couldn’t get excited about this

Yet you get people throwing fits over someone spending £3k out of £200k savings without consultation in another thread.

The point isn't really the amounts involved (although to some of us £3k is huge), it's the lack of openness and deception.

Op's husband is blithely thinking he helped her out of debt previously, she's learnt from it and all is tickety-boo.

But actually, she's got a habit of doing this repeatedly, now hiding it.

Whilst I can see a massive issue if this was huge amounts and you were not paying it down— I couldn’t get excited about this

It's not about the amount it's the constant lies - how can they make financial decisions as a family if she has a debt that her husband is blissfully unaware of. It's irrelevant that she is still paying her share of the bills.

OP, but if you can afford to pay bac the debt over time then you can afford to save that money to buy the clothes when you have enough.

You need to get past this “need to have it now” mentality. Reality is that you can’t afford it if you’re going into debt. And if you’re lying to your partner about it then he has no reason to trust you about anything. This month it might be a grand or so on clothes, but how does he know you’re not going to keep borrowing more and more.

My DP was absolutely shocking with money when we got together. I remember him telling me he went into his overdraft every month and I was horrified, I had no idea this was what some people did.

But over time he’s paid it down, in fact the pandemic was a good point because he wasn’t spending money travelling to see me, he was paying off his debt instead, and has managed to do so. And he too is very proud of the fact that he’s done it, and he now pretty much has the same attitude to debt as I do.

It’s very easy to get into debt, because once you start borrowing the interest starts accumulating, and you get to a point where you’re not paying off the capital you’ve borrowed but are only paying off the interest, and so the cycle continues.

But once you’re out of debt you should be able to see that, and lying about it just isn’t on.

Having been in debt once and paying it down is one thing, continually going into debt as if it’s your right and then lying about it to your partner is a major betrayal and I would leave over that.

It’s like an addiction. I wouldn’t stay with someone who was an alcoholic and kept drying out and then kept falling off the waggon again and started hiding drink in the house etc. Equally I wouldn’t stay with someone who kept paying back debts then taking out more and hiding them. It’s the same thing.

I would have a big issues if my partner had issues with debt and was not transparent about it. For me, I don't know if I could continue the relationship.

I agree there seems to be an emotional undercurrent to this behaviour, have you looked into counselling? That would be a non negotiable requirement if my partner were in this position.

Around managing and spending money, a great start point is the Barefoot Investor. Very easy to read and really simple solutions. Number one will be to get rid of your overdraft and cut up any credit cards! Then start pots of money.

Debt and spending is like an addiction or self-destructive behaviour; this may be your low point in recognising you need help and seeking the help you need?

Op's husband is blithely thinking he helped her out of debt previously, she's learnt from it and all is tickety-boo.

But actually, she's got a habit of doing this repeatedly, now hiding it.

Bang on. Can you see this OP?

Yes I was maybe being a bit unfair- I think though everyone has different attitudes to debt and I personally wouldn’t have an issue at these amounts unless someone really wasn’t in a position to pay it down—probably because I’ve frequently had a couple of grand on a credit card at various points that I paid down

I understand why your partner feels deceived and worried. But I also understand why you would be embarrassed.

I think many people are like this. Get this spending rush and overspend and then get into their overdraft.

How much is the loan and overdraft costing you? I had to get a loan a few years ago and it annoys me what I could buy with the interest I'm paying on it.

OP, you might find the Debt Free Forums on Money Saving expert.com helpful as it's a specialist forum for debt issues.

They are full of people who have been in the same boat, sometimes having confess much larger debts to partners and spend a long time repaying them). They are always lovely and supportive though do expect honest feedback on your spending as well.

People here are right that it is the deceit of your partner that is the issue along with your relationship to money and spending that needs to be addressed.