Relationship with son - advice appreciated

[Advice2021]

We are both in our 70s and have been married for 50 years. We have a lovely caring 45 year old daughter who has 2 beautiful children, a nice house and a very good job. She lives about 50 miles from us.
We also have a son who is 50 this year and is a disappointment to us. The main reason is that he appears to be very uncaring , immature and selfish with no sense of responsibility. He has lived in Bangkok for the last 16 years and has never been married and now has no assets whatsoever after losing all his money on bitcoin (so we were told).

He went travelling the world in his 20s and ended up living in Bangkok. In his 20s we helped get onto the housing ladder in the UK and when the house was sold the £30,000 he received he squandered whilst travelling. He has had a number of girlfriends but they have all been from the Far East. He was renting an apartment in Bangkok with a Thai girlfriend but split up with her about a year ago, he now lives in a guest house in Bangkok and does not have a steady girlfriend but has quite a few mates.
Our concerns are that we do not understand his values in life and we wonder if he takes drugs, he works in IT and is very knowledgeable and has had some good jobs. He is currently doing contract work for a Thai company which is developing a Covid-19 app for the Thai government.
So in summary our concerns are:

1. his uncaring and selfish attitude e.g. he never sends greeting cards or presents to our daughter and her children, he has often forgotten Mothers Day and for our birthdays and festive events we may get a belated phone call and sometimes an e-card. At no time when we have been together has he ever offered to pay for anything. When confronted with any these issues he is always defensive and can get aggressive and self indulgent/self pitying. We have not seen him for about 4 years and whilst he phones us every couple of weeks he is reluctant to FaceTime us. The conversations go on for about an hour and 75% of the discussion is about his work.
2. his lack of concern for his future troubles us, he has no assets at all and no pension. In 2019 he received about £15/£20k in a redundancy payment, he did not work for over a year and told us that he was making money working from home through Bitcoin. But letters in 2019 from his bank to our address showed that he was regularly withdrawing £2500 per month. In early 2020 he told us that he had lost all of his money gambling on Bitcoin and had no money to live. We offered to pay for a flight home but he wanted to stay in Bangkok as he thought the job prospects were better given the COVID situation. Over a 3 month period in 2020 we lent him £5000 to tide him over. I said that was the maximum we would loan him otherwise he would have to come home. So for now he has a job which is not that secure and he is still looking for a better job in Bangkok. We are at our wits end because he is 50 this year and lives from day to day with no desire to settle down and move from Bangkok.

Totally understand your concerns, but am unsure as to your question.

He is an adult. Based on what you've said he sounds selfish and financially unstable. If he comes cap in hand again, you don't have to enable him.

You're not going to suddenly change his mindset Re Mother's Day, contact etc. My sister in law who lives in another country is like this. I used to get upset on behalf of my in-laws as they'd put off doing nice things on important dates in order to wait by the phone "just in case" she called. Of course she Never did.

Why were you opening his letters from the bank?

Whatever money he has, or removes, from his bank account is none of your business; that's a terrible invasion of his privacy.

He's a 50 year old man stop treating him like a teenager. Stop giving him money. And you really told a 50 year old man that he'll have to 'come home' if he can't manage.

He is living the life he wants to live and there's nothing you can or should do about it.

His future is his to live and yes, you care for him, but if he wants to live from day to day and not settle down and end up with nothing that's what he entitled to do.

His life clearly isn't what you would like for him but it's his life and he must live it for himself not for you.

There’s really not much you can do - he’s 50! He’s not likely to change now and doesn’t sound like he wants to. He’s living his life the way he wants.

I’m not sure why you are at your “wits end”. Just accept that’s the way things are. Of course , you don’t need to finance him either.

What does

To be blunt, so what.
Stop sending him money and let him live his life his way, and stop comparing him to your daughter, that are clearly different people with different values

Did you always see him as a disappointment snd his sister as the perfect child? Be honest

I know it must be difficult for you. It’s not easy stepping back from your child, however old they are, when you see them making a bit of a mess of their life, but you just need to leave him to get on with the life he has created for himself, and stop bailing him out. Obviously keep contact with him, but just dont get too invested in what he’s doing. He’s 50, and this is who he is - he’s not going to change unless he has no other option. You bailing him out all the time is enabling him to take risks financially.

He is an adult let him manage is his own life, your expectations are not his?

Don’t give him any more money then. You’ve only got yourself to blame for that.
Not everyone wants to live a lifestyle like yours. Maybe he likes being away from the pressure and criticism and snobbery.

Let him live his own life. You can't change him and shouldn't try to. Don't send him money... he is 50 not a child.

Is this written by his mother or his sister ??

Not everyone wants to buy into the house/kids/steady job UK norm. I think that’s ok, there’s more than one way to live a life.

You shouldn’t support him but neither should you judge him.

Yes I can see why this all upsets you but you need to step back now and stop worrying. It's his life and if he wants to live on the edge with no security or planning then let him crack on. Stop bailing him out and stop getting involved in his finances. He can make all the mistakes he likes - and live with the consequences.

As for the selfishness and self absorption, well sadly thats just who he is, it won't change. So accept that and don't get upset about it.

Enjoy your daughter and grandkids, you are very lucky to have them near you.

And yes I have adult kids so I do get that they are always your kids no matter how old.

@Advice2021

Stop giving him money. He is not taking things seriously as you keep bailing him out.
No more.

So to be blunt but it’s clear .

Meant sorry to be blunt

Given his command of money and assuming you’ve worked hard to have a decent pension, your wills can always reflect your wishes which don’t have to be 50/50 between him and his sister.

Should I find myself in your position one day I would direct a higher percentage to the more deserving child so that she can give her children a better start. Rather than it being spent like he is entitled to waste his parents’ money.

I understand you must be very frustrated but I presume you have made your views clear to him and he hadn't been persuaded? He's an adult and entitled to make his own life choices, regardless of what you think of them. Don't bail him out any more and try to accept his decisions. One day he might change if something happens to convince him he needs to be more prudent and financially acute, but it won't be your nagging, sorry, advice. He's happy presumably, so try to relax about it all - it will be better for your peace of mind..

@Advice2021
To be honest, a lot of the problem seems to stem from you both enabling him throughout his life e.g. getting him on the housing ladder without him needing to scrimp and save for a deposit, and giving him a huge undeserved amount of money £5000 even though he's a grown middle aged man. So he's become used to not taking responsibility for himself and others, and taking his family for granted.

From experience, some men can be very selfish, and unlike women who are naturally more empathetic and therefore appreciative of the sacrifices of others, enabling such men, when they already have selfish dispositions, is a recipe for disaster.

It's nice your daughter is loving and caring but why on earth is it relevant she has a "nice house " and a "very good job" We all want our kids to be stable in life but that you sound overly materialistic and superficial. I bet your "very good" job definition means high paying/high status but that's not what always others prioritise in their lives and there are many jobs which have a huge positive impact on others that are very low status.

You sound as judgemental and horrible as my parents.

I daresay he doesn't want to see you because you are disapproving and make it clear you are 'disappointed' in him. I avoid going to see my parents because they always manage to make me feel shit about myself.

I imagine you do the same to your son. You repeatedly go on about what a disappointment he is and how 'uncaring' he is - yet you don't sound in the slightest bit caring or loving towards him. You're at your wits end because he doesn't want to move from Bangkok?

Why should he live his life the way you think he should?

@Longsight2019

Given his command of money and assuming you’ve worked hard to have a decent pension, your wills can always reflect your wishes which don’t have to be 50/50 between him and his sister.

Should I find myself in your position one day I would direct a higher percentage to the more deserving child so that she can give her children a better start. Rather than it being spent like he is entitled to waste his parents’ money.

This. Though obviously you may still wish to give him 50/50. Your son may be expecting (and waiting) to get a windfall that will bail him out once you both pass away.

Apart from the money lending (and really if you resent it that much just don't lend him any) I don't see what your issue is.

So what if he's not married/has kids - that's a valid choice and doesn't make him immature. And you mentioning his girlfriends as all being from the far east 1. no shit he's in Thailand and 2. makes you seem like a racist. Do you only want him to have white girlfriends?

Surely most people only remember mothers day because they see the tv adverts in the run up to it.

@user1471457751

Apart from the money lending (and really if you resent it that much just don't lend him any) I don't see what your issue is.

So what if he's not married/has kids - that's a valid choice and doesn't make him immature. And you mentioning his girlfriends as all being from the far east 1. no shit he's in Thailand and 2. makes you seem like a racist. Do you only want him to have white girlfriends?

Yes I was also curious as to the relevance of his previous girlfriends being from the Far East.

Also why, in your mind, does he have to move away from Bangkok and back to the UK? Why does it matter that he's not married and that he's had girlfriends from the area he has built his life.

Most of your post just screams "why oh why can't he find a nice white woman who will bring him home to his nice middle class family and make him fit in"

If you don't want to lend him money then just don't lend him money. He is 50, you're talking about him like he's a 20 year old. He has built his own life in Bangkok and he's presumably happy there so why the disappointment?

Yes I'm sure it would be nice if you were close and he called a lot and remembered family events but he clearly doesn't so either have that out with him or get used to it.

He has had a number of girlfriends but they have all been from the Far East.

What does this mean?

When you say his girlfriends are all from the Far East, are you implying that hes your stereotypical middle aged British bloke in Bangkok dating 19 year olds?