Reaching out to others who have been in a narc cycle

[Melonsmelonspears]

I had no idea when I started getting myself involved with "Dave" that he was toxic. He seemed so genuine and into me. His past seemed ok with women. Just three long realtionships in 27 years. He seemed like he had high standards. Especially because he was still on good terms with his ex.

It sort of went like this.
Compliments. Intense contact. So into me and began to talk about the future. Sent me gifts. Love declared within six weeks.
Lots of sex talk but continued to be nice and talk about the future.
Told me about his depression and struggled with drink in the past. Attempted suicide at one point point.
Noticed he started having moody times.
Started talking to me about a woman he had a fling with after his ex stalking him. Started telling me how he attracted unwanted attention from women and only wanted to be friendly.
Continued to say he had no doubts. I was the one. He had never met someone like me. Bla bla bla.
After a few months I experienced my first punishment for offering him space and asking him if he was sure about a future with me. Two days later he barked he would give it another go but I couldn't keep messing his head up.

I was catching on by this point.
His moods were up and down.
Small insults started. My hair, my complexion.
Still really into me. Compliments. Sex. Planning a future. Told me he wanted to take me and my kids (never met them) to the beach this summer. Told me he would always spoil me and I would feel so loved when I was finally with him properly.

More women stories. The fling lady was back bothering him. Ex wife sending him cross messages. Ex girlfriend still in touch with him. I always felt he wasn't over his ex. She just came up to much.

Started adding more women onto his social media and I caught him out. I was noticing old school friend was suddenly allover him. She was clearly into him. Felt strange seeing it as I was his girlfriend apparently. .
Confronted him. It ended. I contacted the stalker who confirmed he's been messing with her life for two years. Broken promises and in and out with her. She's now on anti depressants and miserable because of him.

For two weeks it was silent. Then he came back asking if I missed him. My gut feelings were screaming the second I saw his name. For two days we messaged but I realised nah I don't want this. I felt anxious and stressed just by him speaking to me. So I called him to explain that I couldn't do this due to xyz and unless he could proove to me that he was going to change it was best we walked away.

He got off the phone. Text the fling womsn and called her a sxxt and she blocked him. I told him It was over and I didn't trust him or want him.

It's been 3 weeks. He blocked me a few days ago. Yes I noticed he had because I do still feel weak and look at our old messages to make sense of things. But I've made no contact.

I know he's added new women since deleting me. I know from spying on the first week onto his page a new women was hearting his photos and an old school friend was calling him beautiful. So I know he's already got new people fussing him.

I've done alot of research since to try help myself understand it was not me. It's him. He's mentally ill.

Unless you've been through this I don't think you can appreciate how hard it is to move on. I have very much moved on from him in that way but I can't get over the lies. The games. The way I fell for it.

This guy sent me expensive gifts. Spent every waking hour in contact. He was weakening me and altering me. He has changed me. I was walking on egg shells. Always trying to please him. Putting him before myself. I was distracted. Drained. Yet my wholeself was believing he was worth it because of how he had shaped me to start with.

Please don't reply to this unless you can relate or give advice. I am aware it's a block and move on thing. But anyone's who's been damaged with this will get how tough it is.

So much more than this but I would be here all day.

Gosh, I know it must be compulsive for you, but from an outsider's perspective, you could be doing a Master's in his social media habits. For your own sake come off social media completely. Delete all your accounts and apps for 6 months. Nobody needs social media.
Search for a thread on here from last month about what narcissists are like as children. It was very interesting to hear how the type of family dynamics that creates one. It gave insight into how often they are damaged by parenting and generally stuck at the emotional age of a 4 year old.

It's awful to read other people have gone through this hell for years. I know it won't make any sense but I don't want him back in my life. When he came back for a couple of days I was "playing along" but very aware my feelings were not the same. I pushed him to tell me I was his one and only choice as I knew full well he couldn't commit to that. He was claiming he wanted to meet because he had felt like s**t since we stopped talking. But he still couldn't have that conversation. As soon as I questioned him, he ran. He doesn't like being questioned, told what to do or bossed around. Which means he wants to do as he pleases. I needed to know what he wanted as I have children for a start.

I sometimes want to break down and cry because I "love" him. But I know deep down now I was led to love a fake person capable of a million lies. I think he will die alone and never know what it's like to be a part of a family. I know he spent time with his exes family. I remember asking him once if my children bothered him. He said no,look at me I've got nothing around me it will be nice to be around kids.

I will definitely look at the YouTube videos. Anything to educate me is great. It always gives me a boost when I read up on it etc because it wakes me back up.

I can't believe how many men exsist with these horrible traits. They literally need proffesional help.

I don't want to die at all. But sometimes I think what is the point now. Why did I get out through all that? What did I do to deserve that? How was I so unlucky to attract someone so dark? It's hard for me at the moment to get joy out of my day. I do little things now to push me in the right direction.

I get on well with my children's dad. But I don't feel that way about him now. But I like doing stuff with him and my kids. I've avoided him like the plague since I met Dave. Today I just went for breakfast with him and a drive as mates. I felt abit out of place like I was betraying Dave. But I feel like I've had my life on hold for so long. I enjoyed it. I occasionally found my thoughts drifting off to him when we were driving. But I tried to make today about myself again. Im definitely finding it tough.

I'm really curious about trauma bonding now with his ex. I've never ever been able to understand her still being around. I wished she would clear off and find someone new. I think she half has feelings for him still but she half would never want him back. Very odd. But that makes sense that after 8/9 years with him it's no wonder she's a mess. I don't know if he was loyal to her for a few years but I can't imagine he has suddenly changed into a liar since her. I do think he will never ever be over her though for what it's worth. She's definitely someone who got his heart more then the rest have.

@DianaT1969

I get your point but I use social media for long distance relatives. My son's childminder page. My daughter's school page. My friends. I don't need it but it's a part of how I keep in touch with stuff.

Because of how he made me feel I was very alert with his page. My exes page would never have had me looking. I couldn't have told you any of what he did. But this guy made me that way. He made me anxious. Stressed. Worried and allover. It's ridiculous and I know it is. To be clicking on women and trying to figure out who she is. if Dave has been looking at her photos at 2am. If she is single and if she's likely to steal Dave from me. But that's how he made me think. He messed my head up so I wasn't my normal self. He made me feel awful about myself yet complimented me.

I will look for the thread thank you. Not sure how easily I will find it but I am interested. Seems he adored his mum who has died now but bad memories around his dad. His dad cheated alot on his mother. So he would never be like him apparently. Sadly he's become a clone.

Thanks for the suggestion I will have a look now.

I say this with every kindness, truly! Stop obsessing. You are forensically examining everything. Stop it. Inform yourself, sure, but make sure it’s for your own good, you need to heal.

My story..
Same here married but In a dull marriage, we decided to have an open marriage but stay together for the sake of the kids basically. I met him online. We were messaging back and forth, I tried to just look at it as a bit of chatting, flirting. After a week we swapped numbers. He was messaging all day, like every 10 minutes. He was at work but messaging all the time. Full of compliments, showing an interest. Then a week later we spoke on the phone. Then he would phone 6 or 7 times a day, I noticed early on that he never asked anything about me. I knew he had a son but I didn't tell him I had 3. It just didn't come up so I didn't say. He does know now. Then he kept trying to facetime I wasn't happy with that. Before we even met he was calling me his missus. I knew it wasn't normal. When we met a few weeks later he traveled 4 hours to meet me. I was so nervous. I saw him before he saw me and he looked gorgeous, reminds me of Tom Ellis as Lucifer, should have been a warning then haha. He was even better in person. When he saw me there was basically no emotion. My heart sank I thought he was probably disappointed. I said something along those lines and he said no why would you say that? We went somewhere for a coffee, he sat opposite me with no expression. Looked misrable and juststared at me, with dark souless eyes. At one point I held his hand but he didn't really hold mine back. It was uncomfortable. I thought well this is going well..
Then I sat in his van with him and we kissed. He said your amazing, I wish I could stay longer but I'm on call tonight and need to get back for work, promised me next time we would have longer. .. a couple of weeks later the l bomb was dropped. I knew it was ridiculous but I said it back, it's a clear red flag love you so early on. Soon after all the romantic talk was replaced with vulgar talk about deep throat and facials etc and I'm ashamed to admit I went along with it. Similar to other ladies reply he seems to be a sexual deviant. He started buying me ridiculous size dildos and wanted me to send pictures, and videos. Has a thing about stretching. One night I messaged and said I was fed up with it, and it doesn't make me feel good. He just told me to enjoy my evening and he didn't want a row.
In answer to your questions he's 32 and I'm 39, he's been married very briefly. They have a son he doesn't see very often, I think he's had a number of relationships. I don't think he has many friends, he sees his mum and dad often but is an only child and has told me he's treated as the " black sheep" we message every day but the phone calls are once a week now at most, normally if he wants to rant or just at a loose end. He doesn't compliment me anymore. Well rarely. I don't know why I can't let go. With covid restrictions, travel and him working away for months and started a new job I've not even seen him. I know it's ridiculous being this invested.

Educate yourself on codependency.
Can also be known as empath.
There are two types of narcissistic trait, covert and grandiose.
When I first went into therapy it sent shivers down me how my ex's ticked every box and then I just felt stupid.
I felt like everyone must have been laughing at me because it was so obvious.
I found the more information I got the easier it was to let go and start to heal.
When it comes to healing from narcissism the 'therapy rule' is not to talk about it because if you haven't experienced it people think you're crazy which doesn't help the healing process.

@thecatsarecrazy
Yes I get you with the sex thing. Mine has an obsession with my feet and made out I was the only woman who's feet had turned him on. Turns out he liked stalker ladies feet too! He liked the dirty talk too. Told me his sex drive was low and then he was surprised at how often he had manly urges over Me. Always after pictures. He said my smile was nice and called me beautiful. But I think most compliments were at my feet and other places in the end. I sometimes woke up to videos from him telling me how sexy I was and what he wanted to do. He also called and text throughout the day whilst he worked.

@fearfulexchange

I understand you completely. My ex ticks everybox too.
No empathy
Love bombed
Constantly needed attention.
Selfish.
Liar.
Poor communication when things mattered.
Always had problems.
Recovering alcoholic.
Had used weed but not sure if still does.
Broken relationships.
Money problems.
Nothing in his name.

It definitely helps to read up the information and educate yourself. I know it shouldn't matter whether he's toxic or depressed or commitment phobic or damaged from his past it does matter. Because at least if I can see why he's treated me this way I can take comfort in knowing it wasn't me.but also that he will treat the next girl just as bad.

It sounds stupid but I am jealous of any women getting his attention . I'd hate for any other woman to get closer than me. I hope he doesn't get a girlfriend or a favourite woman before I'm recovered because I couldn't stand it.

Yet I don't trust him or want him. I also know he's got nothing at all to offer me or my kids.

I spent a long time trying to work out the truth from all his lies. There is no point because knowing will not change anything. It is wasted mental energy.

I spent a long time trying to get others to see he was a liar. There is no point as I just come across as obsessed. It is wasted time and energy.

He is messing with other people and telling them lies. I am wasting my time trying to get through to them. They will work it out for themselves eventually.

I wasted so much time trying to understand him and help him. He doesn't want to be helped. He's fine with how he is.

His actions show he cares for others as much as he is capable of caring - not very much at all. It is very shallow and everyone is transient to him. He could be with you for 100% of the time and act completely devoted and then move on the next day with no regrets whatsoever. He is a waste of time.

i also agree with others about the narc being a sex deviant. In my experience, the narc would call it "making love" when he was trying to seduce lovebombing me, but when he was making crude jokes, he would call it fucking and his language would change completely. Like a lot of posters here, I nervously laughed along, as I just wasn't used to men being so forward, but then I guess I hadn't met many narcissists at that point! I had very little sense of boundaries and to be honest, I was getting more and more afraid of calling him out on his behaviour as I had been raged at before for saying no.

You will go round in circles trying to sort the truth from the lies, did he really care about you, why did he behave the way he did etc.

Understanding this helps you validate your experience and makes you feel less alone but it will become an obsession that you need to break away from in order to heal yourself and move on from them because they are not worth your headspace and ruminating about them will mean they still have control over you.

They say that understanding a narcissist will do you no good.

I say that by understanding a narcissist takes away one of their most powerful weapons.......

Confusion

I agree @onthedunes I feel like I'm trying to understand it for my own protection. If I hadn't looked into his behaviour (because it's really not normal!) I'd have been possibly a victim for longer. I have a dad. A brother. Uncles. Cousins. Who all have families and friends around them. They are consistent and protective and make normal choices in life. My children's dad is an absolute decent, genuine big hearted person. So I know that males are in most cases fairly straight forward. Yes cheating has always sadly been a thing.

I think my reading up on things I've learned that the ex is a much deeper issue than he's confirmed. I've also learned that the comments on my hair and stuff were toxic and not just harmless comments. Everyone else says nice things about my hair. It's possibly the main thing I get complimented on from People. He made me feel I had to have it short and up all the time. But I have it down and long alot! So by educating myself on the devaluing stage I have again given myself a boost.

I think I'll be wobbling for quite some time but I know by talking to others I'll be able to keep my head clear.

You ladies have no idea how you have helped me yesterday. I need people to repeat and tell me anything they can. I must never ever get sucked back into him at all.

I never really knew anything about narcissists until I met him. They talk about people posting too many selfies being a narcissist but obviously it's more than that. When he kept phoning me and texting me I learnt of lovebombing. I read up on it all then and sure enough he followed the pattern. I remember being on a Website signs of a narcissist and it was an eye-opener. He was doing it all. Sending selfies and wanting to be praised for them, getting the hump if I didn't say much, never asked anything about me, spoke about himself all the time.. list goes on.

@thecatsarecrazy

What are you going to do about your situation? It sounds like you need to get some help to move away.

I am feeling down again this morning. I've been blocked for a week now and it's nice because I don't have to see his page or be tempted to look at what he's doing. But I feel abit embarassed about the fact I went to someone from his past for answers. I feel like he will be mentally hating me for that and will tell every new woman he meets how bonkers I am looking into his past.

I wish it was enough for me to just walk away. I've kept silent now for three weeks so I've not shown any weakness to him. I am thinking I'm perhaps fully disguarded now? As from what you've said and others they don't like to let you get away and want to keep you as a weak supply.

It's a massively complicated thing. The scariest part about Dave is he continues to lie and will always twist it so the woman is the problem.

I can't understand how his ex has managed to stay on his radar for so long. So much more has happened with them but for some reason he's dropped me completely.

I think there's someone new now and I wonder how long she will last. The thing is he won't be able to give her a relationship anymore than he could me. So she will be another picking up her heart in a few months. Unless he's going to change suddenly.

Just to say how much I feel for you OP.

My narc cycle started as a child of a narcissistic mother.

It eventually ended when I found this lady.

www.melanietoniaevans.com

I have never engaged in any of the paid content, but just the free initial course opened up my understanding to what I had been dealing with for so many years and how I constantly attracted narcissistic people.

I have been narc free now for several years and although there are times when I find myself drawn to someone displaying narcissistic traits, I know how to retreat and avoid.

Have never been happier or had more fulfilling relationships.

I was involved with a narcissist.

I was stunned by him. Handsome. Wealthy. Excessive gifts. Holidays. Declarations of love. Constant calls. All very sudden. I knew it was excessive and unbalanced but i felt amazing.

And just as suddenly, he went off me. No more contact.

I was devastated. For two to three years. I just couldn't move on.

Then it got easier. I left the region. I made other friends. I met other men. I studied again. I truly and actively moved on in every sense. He once tried to invade my new life but I wasn't fooled again.

And I look back with disgust for that man. Incapable of a normal relationship.

op, I wouldn't bother trying to figure your weirdo out. Because there's not a lot to him really.

Try to be proactive and do those things. Even if it just distracts you for half an hour. It's healing.

Please avoid ALL contact with your ex.

My main learning from a toxic relationship was that I’d missed a LOT of early ‘red flags’ early on, and as time went on. I reflected on why I hadn’t avoided dating him originally, or walked away and ended contact after the flags and awful events. To my own detriment.

My ‘shark cage’ needed work. Suggest yours does.

I will look at the link thank you.

I am shattered today. I couldn't sleep last night. I just can't shake of this feeling of I don't like how little I meant.

I lent him money a month before we ended. He paid me back in this last month since we stopped speaking. He never even thanked me. When I said to him thank you was basic manners he said whatever. I just can't believe how ungreatful he was when he only ate and smoked that week because of me!

I feel in a conflict with myself as I know his looks are fading. He's nearly 50. He's underweight. Going grey and getting haggard in his face. He has a horrible personality and his attitude is so childish. He has no respect for women and has broken every family relationship he's ever had too. Missed out on alot on his children being teenagers as he left when they were little. He's got no property in his name. His cars been in the garage for months. He's got no savings. No real goals.

All he has is this power over women. I know I was prepared to share my family with him. He could have been surrounded by love.

I hope I snap out of this soon. I don't know what I miss. But I miss him in a really messed up way. I think I want him to just show me I have it all wrong and be actually really appreciated me and feels lost without me. But that's a joke in itself I know!

Thanks for the replies. It really does help.

@Dozer
What red flags did you miss?

I had Alot of gut feelings and knew he spoke about women too much to be innocent. Someone who isnt a player doesnt have women problems like he did.

Also started putting me down quite early on after being so I tense and using the love word to get closer.

You list a lot of red flags in your OP. I recognised a fair few and, like you, didn’t heed them.

Would focus on yourself and feeling better.

Thank you. Yes I guess it's just feeling the burn and going through the days until it starts to feel easier. I'm getting so fed up of caring now. Each day he comes into my head I just wish he wouldn't. I used to be able to just enjoy my children and my own little life. I know one day I will just click and think omg what a stupid fool I was for even caring. I should be able to laugh about it and laugh about him. I hope one day it does become comedy to me.

I guess it's takes your emotions time to catch up with the sensible part of you carrying all the information.

I don't get any pleasure out of saying this but he will die a very sad lonely man the rate he's going. He will never get to enjoy his grandchildren or anything meaningful.

I have realised more and more that his ex was the love of his life and he can't love anyone else because he's not over loosing her. I'll never know the ins and outs of their relationship but it clearly ended for a reason..she's never had a family because he can no longer have children. Apparently she really wanted one. So she is late 30s and if she doesn't find someone soon she will never have a family of her own. That's one of the biggest wake ups for me when I see her still in his life. She is wasting her own happiness and she's running out of time. .
Sorry for the waffle. Just processing it all still. I'm so glad I've found people who understand.

It does help to keep busy. I watched a documentary on Tele Saturday and got two hours My mind was on something else and I could feel myself relaxing as I was focusing on something else. But he soon takes over my mind. I wake up and within s minute he's in my head

That's why I got therapy - even though I had to grieve the end of a very long relationship I was lighter as soon as he had left, I knew it would be okay, but I could not get the bastard out of my head. I still find he will pop into my head far too easily but it's easier to fuck him right off again.

You'd think by now people who know him from 30 years ago would know how he is!

The only people who know him are his victims. Anyone else sees who he wants them to see.

I understand all that you're going through, Melon, I was very similar at the beginning. It drives me mad that he's probably told everyone who will listen to him, in the kindest possible way because his reputation is everything, that I was mentally unwell and controlled and abused him for years. And he gets all the sympathy. And I was left broken. But I'm happy now - I will always have the scars of being in a narcissistic relationship but I'm not going to let it define me. I'm back to being who I was before I met him, but even better!

I agree with the suggestion of Dr Ramani - she's great. I understand why you want to analyse so much but the end result is that they have a personality disorder that makes no sense, their behaviour makes no sense but it is highly dangerous so we must avoid them at all costs.

There is no understanding, no winning, no beating, no closure. You just have to try and come to terms with what has happened, take time to heal but make a conscious effort to heal too. You are still at the early stages but you need to be finding the strength to not follow what he's doing, try not to wonder what he's thinking about you (he probably isn't - he'll be working on his next victim) and make an effort to do something positive for yourself

Can I ask why you are thinking about his ex so much and her predicament about whether she can have children or not?

Do you feel like she is the one barrier to your being together again?

Would you actually like to reconcile?

Why don't you plan ahead? Occupy some head space with some fantasies and dreams that you would like to pursue? They can be as fantastical as you like. But as long as you focus on you and solely you.

Also I think you have a good writing style. Do you think writing a short story about your experiences would help you at all?

Yes, don’t waste time and energy thinking about him, his ex.

@Orgasmagorical
I totally get you. I will give it a few more weeks and if I can't start to pull myself around I'll go get some help. I don't want to waste my time like this. I feel as though I read into stuff to stop me scrolling through his old stuff or looking at pictures. I feel like I need to be doing something proactive to make sense of it.
I know deep down never know when these issues began. I'm sure his ex wife and his family members have been in alot more pain than me and have been unable to change him to be decent to them. I think I'll be in a much better place soon. I have parts of the day when I just feel so lost. I find going to bed is always peaceful for thinking. I don't know how bonkers this sounds but I've spent so much time looking at the sky in the middle of the night whilst trying to clear my mind I even associate the bluddy sky to him.

@KinseyWinsey
Good question. I think it's because he told me several things about her and the reasons she was still in his life. He would say she was happy for him about me then say she was asking him if he still fancied her. Then claiming she regretted everything. Then other times he would be putting her down or saying she was like a little sister. Their "bond" confused me all the way through and caused me alot of ups and downs. I have always felt like I don't truly understand this women and why she asked him to move out only to not move on herself and stay. Before I knew was a narc he was I just felt frustrated that she was so heavily in his life. I have since been told alot of stuff about her from the other lover and she apparently really wanted a baby. I guess I'm trying to process why she has been single for two years and has not used the time to try and find happiness and have a family. It never occurred to me she could be damaged as she seems to have taken alot of control back.

I guess for me she's a huge part in the way he is. His heads a shed based around her and I am mad at myself for not realising sooner that they had a strange connection.

@KinseyWinsey
I keep drafts in my email folder about how I feel. I have never written it in one solid story though.