Putting my happiness before my children’s? No abuse

[grease212]

We have two very young children. There is no abuse but I really really dislike my husband. He doesn’t cook or clean, watches a lot of porn and spends a vast amount of time on his phone especially on WhatsApp receiving inappropriate pictures and videos of women from his male friends in group chats. He’s not the most hands on father but as they get older he does contribute more. He is sometimes cold in nature and can bring a negative atmosphere to the house which I hate. I have emotionally checked out and I do not share my thoughts or feelings with him nor do I want to. We just have somewhat pleasant conversation about trivial things or things related to the children. We go on holidays and days out with the kids which is quite nice and I do find him to be very funny too. He does work very hard at his job and has a good work ethic but I am financially independent anyway. If I were to leave I wouldn’t want another relationship, I am content on my own.

I have become a shell of my former self since being in this marriage. I do barely anything for myself, it is all for the children and the household. I’ve lost my confidence and drifted from friends because I’ve been so emotionally tired and drained from the marriage. I do wonder if I started taking care of me for once, that perhaps the marriage wouldn’t seem so bad? I know that if I left him I would change a hundred things about my life, so I’m not sure why I don’t just do that now?

I dream of living without him and having my own home full of peace and little things bringing me joy, but it’s not just about me and it would absolutely kill me not to have the kids full time. I think I can get myself to a place of being at peace with us living alongside each other kind of like flat mates with raising the children being our priority. But I think I would always feel a sadness at not living my life how I truly want to. But I think that me leaving him is more what is best for me and not what is best for the children. I feel a huge responsibility for bringing them into this world and doing what is best for them. Perhaps my life will always have that tinge of sadness and life is rarely perfect and we often suffer one way or another?

Your house currently is not a home nor the sanctuary it should be for your children. And what do you yourself get out of your relationship with your husband?. Nothing worth having.

What is there for you to really work on with your marriage?. You’ve already checked out of it in an emotional sense.

What your husband does works for him, why should he want to change that?. Besides which telling or otherwise asking someone else to change their behaviour is impossible. You cannot save this on your own, he has to want to do his bit here.

My MIL left my FIL after 20yrs marriage. DH and his brother were 8 and 10 at the time. Her decision & no abuse. She was just unhappy and couldn't stand the thought of another 20yrs with him.
They still had a happy childhood and are well rounded and successful individuals now. They really admire and respect their mum. They also completely understand why she left their Father. He's a misery! Honestly you can't spend your life being miserable.

In my humble view there should be a study of children of parents who should have separated but didn't.

Those 'studies' are bollocks
You deserve a happy life.

I think I'd want my kids growing up to know that need ri make choices for their own happiness. Because life is short.

As opposed to growing up thibkingvrhey should just put up and shut up in marriages they are not happy in.

Plus I think divorce is only as big a deal as you make it. 'Mummy and daddy have decided we would rather have our own houses and be friends instead of partners. So now you guys can have two bedrooms! And maybe that dog you wanted that daddy didnt want'.

Present it as a new adventure. Yes change can be a bit sad but it also sounds like an opportunity for some new fun things.

I would separate while they're still young and I wouldn't agree to anything like 50:50 with a man who doesn't cook or clean and who is addicted to porn. No way.

It's the part where I've read countless studies on the impact of divorce on children which continues on into adulthood, and they say that providing there is no abuse, it is recommended to stay together. I think I'm probably ok with sacrificing my happiness for theirs.

The problem with this is that you can't do a controlled study on divorce. On average, the couples who chose to divorce would have had more serious problems than the couples who chose not to. Those problems would have affected the children whether they'd divorced or not, so I don't think you can conclude that the divorce - rather than the parents' problems - was the reason for those children having more issues than those whose parents remained married.

Obviously it's easier for you just to stay together but it's not good for the children to grow up with a horrible relationship as a role model so it's best for them if you separate.

I wouldn't dream of living with a man like this children or no children. Thank God you are financially independent.
The porn and shared pictures would be the final straw.

@Wanderlusto

I think I'd want my kids growing up to know that need ri make choices for their own happiness. Because life is short.

As opposed to growing up thibkingvrhey should just put up and shut up in marriages they are not happy in.

Plus I think divorce is only as big a deal as you make it. 'Mummy and daddy have decided we would rather have our own houses and be friends instead of partners. So now you guys can have two bedrooms! And maybe that dog you wanted that daddy didnt want'.

Present it as a new adventure. Yes change can be a bit sad but it also sounds like an opportunity for some new fun things.

Don’t underestimate this, my mum got me a cat when my dad moved out and honestly I felt like it was a fair swap

I'd leave him because of the porn and sharing filth with other men. Such an awful mindset to have around children.

OP - I have been where you are right now. The reasons why I disliked my H were different, but the way I felt and how we were was similar. It also felt like I have lost myself and just lived for the children.
We also did nice holidays and talked mostly about practical things and kids.
And I used to fantasise about just being in my own, my own place and the kids.
Looking at this now that I am further along and divorced - I think par of it was the issues with the relationship, part was kids being small and needing me to be there, and part of it was being me. Just like you I have neglected myself and prioritised everything else.

It’s easy for strangers on MN to tell others - divorce if your marriage is less then perfect. But - in itself - divorce will not make your life any better, but will make it harder and sadder in many ways. (Obv provided there is no abuse).

I think - in situations like yours (and mine s it had been) - it’s better to start with yourself. Pick yourself up first. Rediscover what makes you happy, reconnect with friends. Carve out a life for you that will give you bit more happiness and fulfilment - irrespective of whether you are in our outside of the marriage.

The desire to run away and be by yourself now is more a desire for different life, I feel. Or at least it was largely for me.
Reality of living on your own, with your kids away for half of the time is very different.
If you are down and depressed now, with not much desire or a drive to do anything for yourself - it won’t magically change if your H lives somewhere else.
If you were eager to start another relationship - then it’s a little different and you are wasting time by staying. But since you said you aren’t looking for another partner - then you aren’t losing anything by staying and figuring out your life.

And then, once you are in a better and stronger place - then you can decide what you do. Maybe, as you said - you will be happier to coparent and live alongside each other. Or maybe you separate.

In my case I had no choice at some point and had to make a move. My kids were older by then, so it was a little easier.
But still - having them go away to their dad isn’t easy, I find.

All of that, as I said - is based on the assumption the relationship isn’t abusive and you are amicable around kids.
MN may tell you it’s not the best example for the kids to not see loving happy parents - but in reality - how many marriages are that picture perfect?

I wish, wish, wish my mother had left my father as soon as my brothers had arrived. He did nothing but take from the family. He contributed nothing, would have told you that he was always there - yes he was but never present and never doing anything for his family.

I think she bitterly regrets not kicking him out, her fear of stigma/bring up kids on her own (which she was anyway) kept him there till we were all young adults. Much, much too late.

Don't delay, OP. Your children are young, they're not stupid and they have all the time in the world to pick up on your feelings and their homelife situation.

He is sometimes cold in nature and can bring a negative atmosphere to the house which I hate.

In what way is forcing your children to live in an environment like this for their benefit or their happiness?

If you hate it, why do you think they don't too? You're kidding yourself there. Children mask well.

He doesn’t cook or clean, watches a lot of porn and spends a vast amount of time on his phone especially on WhatsApp receiving inappropriate pictures and videos of women from his male friends in group chats.

I think you're setting the bar pretty low if you're saying there's no trace of abuse in this behaviour combined with creating a hostile environment for his family.

Alongside your reading on the impact of divorce on children, what reading have you done on developmental trauma and the impact of being raised in an environment like you describe? Or have you only read material to support your bias?

From reading your description about him your children I think will at least be no worse off if you leave and I suspect once it is sorted actually better for them to have a happy mum and get to know the real you.

That is the sadness my mum had with my nan that years of a toxic relationship meant she only got to know her really for the 5 years she had her after her Dad died

OP my mom left my dad when I was about ten years old and I was really glad - couldn't stand him anyway.

Much preferred being raised by my mother and do not feel disadvantaged in the slightest she should have left him sooner.

Don't miss him either!

Maybe a little different as he was abusive physically towards he but still, you have to think about your own life not always your children's IMO

Op leave. You are not a happy person, which means that you are not a happy mum. Your children will benefit more from a happier mum than a home where there is a unhealthy atmosphere. As they grow up, they notice this more and more. You don't want this to be their example. You deserve a good life, not existing as a shell of a person.

It's the part where I've read countless studies on the impact of divorce on children which continues on into adulthood, and they say that providing there is no abuse, it is recommended to stay together

OP have you heard of confirmation bias? I suspect you are reading articles which support your own beliefs.

I can’t advise on what to do or what not to do, but if there are changes which would make you happier, I strongly suggest you make them. Leaving your husband doesn’t have to be the first one - I’d start finding yourself and see where that takes you in your relationship.

You do sound so down. Jsku gave you some good advice I think. Being on your own with children is not the same as without. It is hard in ways you wouldn’t expect. You can’t count on your H to act in a decent way. He may want the kids full time or not at all, may make your life easy or difficult. He is also likely to move on, and your DC may love or hate the new partner. You are going to be connected to your H via your DC until one of you dies, he will not be out of your life completely. Even if he disappears he’s there as a potential.
Your DC are young and if you are going it probably is easier on them to go sooner rather than later. You are important and deserve to be happy. The porn is bad but a lot of men do it. This is an important decision for you, but seismic for your kids. Are you sure that it is him that is the issue or is it your life in general and you are focusing on him because he’s there? I agree with jsku to try doing some of the things that you dream of doing on your own, and look into marriage guidance with him. Then if you do go, you know, and you can tell your DC if they ask, that you gave it your best shot.

Can you get over disliking your husband and rekindle affection for him? Has he changed or does it feel worse because you have children and his lack of chores means you are stuck with the drudgery?

What would you do differently if you separated? I would first try to see if he is open to change and also focus on rediscovering who you are. That might not be possible in your marriage but I think you need to go through the cycle of trying to make changes. You mention young children, how old?

Without abuse I think there is a responsibility to try to make a marriage work but both parties have to be motivated, open to change and prepare to make the changes.

My dc are thriving post divorce, why? Because I provide the emotional stability. If you dislike your husband that will show up in interactions and the children will learn from that. How do you hide your dislike? it isn't possible so perhaps you are fooling yourself if you think there is no impact.

You mentioned that you can learn to live alongside him and find peace in that. I wonder if you could apply that to living apart, but co-parenting peacefully together? So for example on his day to take the children could you tag along on a day out so that you aren’t without them? Especially if your children are very young, at least initially.
As you become more comfortable with the situation you could gradually reduce the amount of time you spend together allowing you to have some child free time perhaps?

“I think you're setting the bar pretty low if you're saying there's no trace of abuse in this behaviour combined with creating a hostile environment for his family.

Alongside your reading on the impact of divorce on children, what reading have you done on developmental trauma and the impact of being raised in an environment like you describe? Or have you only read material to support your bias?”

This with bells on. Some of the most functional families I know are separated but co-parenting amicably and some of my most sorted adult friends grew up with divorced parents. I do wonder what studies you’re looking at. I’d also be interested in the dates of those studies and who the authors are and what their biases might be. Remember that for centuries, millennia even, the institution has been primarily economic because women could not earn their own living. Even the ones who could were expected to give up work when they started having children. A lot of women couldn’t get away because the odds were stacked against them achieving financial independence. That’s not the case any more. Women don’t have to stay in shit relationships because they can’t go it alone.

And abuse doesn’t have to be physical. Neglect is a form of abuse. Indeed, I would say excessive watching of porn and sending inappropriate communications to other women is a form of abuse. It’s certainly not how a responsible and caring partner or father behaves.

And yes, like some PP have flagged, I think you may be looking at articles which support your view of the position. Like the OP who posted asking advice on how to stay in her miserable marriage and remained in that position despite 23 pages of posters advising her (based on her posts) that it really wouldn’t be good idea for her children. She made out she was doing it for her children but really it just suited her. There may be completely valid reasons why it suits you to stay but if so - own that. Don’t put it on your DCs.

Look up Prof Tanya Byron (clinical psychologist who specialises in working with adolescents and families). She does a podcast with Claudia Winkleman. In one of those, she was very clear that children do better outside a toxic marriage. And if you don’t like your H, then it is toxic.

Op - don't read the studies. I wish my mother had left my father but she waited until we'd left home. My childhood would have been much better if she'd been able to leave much earlier. All sorts of shit stuff happens to people on life. Your children would be okay and no different to so many others.