Elderly neighbour phoned to ask what she’s done to upset me?

[MojAlone]

Not sure quite how to manage this situation - so advice would be appreciated! Back story is that we moved to a semi detached bungalow 2 years ago with a view to converting the loft space. Most of the bungalows along our road have been converted, our semi-detached neighbours have also extended to the back. We need a party wall agreement, and the neighbours instructed a surveyor. They also asked us to change our plans - which we did, even though they had already been passed. It’s caused us a lot of delay, we are still living out of packing boxes, and 2 year old still has to sleep in our room. We could move but I’d say it’s highly likely that a new owner here would renovate as bungalow is tatty, roof underlay has perished etc.

Elderly neighbours husband passed away before xmas. We’ve tried to be very supportive as she has no family. DP recently fixed her gate - but I’d say her behaviour was ‘odd’ - she kept saying she couldn’t open the gate, even though - when DP went round - she clearly could. But he continued to do little repairs etc to help.
She phones me regularly to complain about her tradesman etc e.g the postman is taking her post, the window cleaner has scratched her car, the gardener has covered her conservatory in dust etc.

She’s also phoned me on 2 occasions (1 was a Sunday morning early when it was snowing) to say there is a surveyor in the loft, and apologised for the noise. I don’t actually think anyone was there - no car outside, but the same happened this week. No car outside, she also said people have been in her house and been taking things - but it’s ok because her niece’s husband is a police officer (I’m 100 percent sure she has no family).
Yesterday she phoned again - and I really had to calm her down - and she said she was very upset because she thinks she has upset me. Followed by a 2 minute rant about a gardener.
I am ‘slightly’ backing away from communicating with her, but I do want to support her.
We’ve decided to leave our building work until potentially 2022 - as we feel very sorry for her, and don’t want to cause her additional trauma. We’ve put things on hold for about a year now. A surveyor has not been instructed yet - we’ve communicated with the surveyor they chose over a year ago, but as we pay all costs - no surveyor would survey her house until they’ve been officially instructed. I did email the surveyor about 6 months ago to say we are putting the project on hold due to Covid and to be considerate to our neighbour. But that’s all!

It's not your job to manage this lady's possible dementia and you likely don't have the skills for it. Please call social services as recommended.

I wouldn't be phoning her once a week. She's your neighbour, you don't need a phone relationship. Just speak to her when you see her. Bring up your concerns with her family or adult social services.

As soon as I saw your thread title I thought of an old flat mate of mine. This may well be dementia or it may be, like my flat mate, an unfortunate situation of a servers persecution complex. I was constantly cornered in the kitchen to ask ‘what she had done to upset me’ (when as far as I knew I was just going about my life and showing no signs of grievance) and over a period of months it became clear every one of her stories about everywhere she had lived/worked were about people who were ‘out to get her’. It culminated in her fixating on the idea an ex-flat mate was returning to the property at night and plotting with friends under her bedroom window to get her evicted.
This flatmate seemed totally normal at first, I felt sorry for the tough breaks she had had, but over time I was drawn into her neuroses and there was no good way out - you either facilitated her delusions or you were (in her eyes) just another person out to ‘get’ her.
Based on this experience, I would distance yourself as much as possible (whilst informing adult SS as PPs have suggested)

Sounds like the paranoia caused by dementia.

Social Services need to be informed and the rest of her family tracked down.

As someone who is unrelated to her, you will be in a hiding to nothing trying to get involved.

What sticks out to me is that she is elderly, has no family and her husband passed recently.

Her world has completely fallen apart.

She might have dementia but she also is grieving and likely feeling very vulnerable to be alone at this stage of her life.

@MojAlone

I think I may just keep social services in mind, and see if I can provide enough support without using their resources. I think - when I contact the surveyor again - I’ll discuss her social needs, and if the surveyor has any advice. But I think, if things continue to escalate - it’s good to know they are there. It hadn’t really crossed my mind until last night, but your comments have really helped secure my thoughts.

Please don't delay with social services, they will be able to assess what support she needs. You can't hope to be able to give her all she needs and you won't know what's really going on next door. She may be forgetting essential medication, for instance? Hard as it is, she isn't your responsibility and, if you are not careful, you will find yourself being sucked in and even being asked to help by social services. Refer her to the experts and just keep on being a good neighbour.

Sorry I also agree it sounds like dementia - maybe phone the GP surgery and ask what to do?

@MojAlone

I think I may just keep social services in mind, and see if I can provide enough support without using their resources. I think - when I contact the surveyor again - I’ll discuss her social needs, and if the surveyor has any advice. But I think, if things continue to escalate - it’s good to know they are there. It hadn’t really crossed my mind until last night, but your comments have really helped secure my thoughts.

But you're not family and you're not experienced or knowledgeable. And you could do more harm than good not getting it on the radar as soon as possible.

They're not going to go in with sledgehammers. They know what they're doing.

Hi, please call about your concerns. Yes, it could be dementia in which case an assessment would be needed. Perhaps when her husband was "covering" for her and with him gone it is becoming more apparent. Or, it could be a delirium from a uti or other condition. This responds well to treatment but it is really important she is assessed and treated if necessary. The other thing that can look like dementia in an older person can be from alcohol. If she is drinking this could be something to do with it but all need an assessment. You are great to have been looking out for and I know it can feel a bit odd to make the call, but I think she really needs it. All the best

You sound lovely OP, but there is only so much you can do. It sounds like professional intervention is required. Very sad.
I'm glad she has you though

@saraclara

I'm astounded that you've put the work on hold for the sake of a neighbour in the first place. I'd definitely be going ahead on this, because if she does have the beginnings of dementia or if she eventually needs care, getting the permission is going to be even more complicated. There is no ned in sight to this problem.

Get your surveyor organised and phone social services or Age Concern for advice re her welfare.

This.

Also I would be very wary of her allegation of stealing etc, as these can be directed at the closest person and that presently is you.

I would not only report her concerning behaviour to the relevant medical authorities for her sake, I would do so in email also to cover yourself off should she start claiming you are speaking from her or worse.

It's an appalling situation for her, but I think you do need to also protect yourself here.

*stealing from her

This sounds very much like she has dementia to me . Both of my parents had dementia and the same sort of things were happening to them that you describe. I had phone calls from them at odd times . My dad said his car had been stolen but when I arrived at the house it was still there . My mum told me that someone had stolen her hair cutting scissors . You could try calling adult social services but I am not sure that they would do a lot in the first instance. The impression I got when my parents were like this is that they will only act if the person is a risk to themselves or others . There is a lot of issues with regards to people’s human rights . Good luck . I do sympathise with you .

@Purplewithred

Ok, you see it here often, but for once - this does sound as if she may have the beginnings of dementia. Or it may be a lingering uti (better) or some other form of ill health. She has no family you say? Check your council website and call the duty safeguarding team with your concerns.

Came to say the same. It's said on here with every post about an older person, but it really sounds like the case here. For her sake and yours you need to involve social services.

Lockdown is over soon op - she may be vulnerable to 'tradesmen' knocking to do make believe necessary jobs and get ripped off... Or letting dodgy people into her home. You can't be watching out for her 24/7.
.getting authorities in is the best for her...

Can I just say, event though I have no advice on your situation, how lovely of you to be concerned like you are about your neighbour. I wish there were many more people like you in this world

Please don't just handle this on your own. She's having some sort of hallucinations? - could be a water infection. She's confused about who is and isn't there - Could be the inset of something like dementia. Please please speak to your GP / SS and get her help

Thank you! Just filled out the online SS form - and guess what - it’s not working! I’ll try the PC later.

Yes - i think the phone call yesterday alarmed me, because it was very accusatory. What has she done to upset me? It came from nowhere.

It is lovely that you are concerned and want to help, but you seem a bit reluctant to contact social services. Perhaps you see this as negative in some way? The thing is, not contacting them is potentially doing her a disservice. If it is the onset of dementia, then early intervention can get supports in place that will help her to manage in her own environment for longer, rather than things reaching a crisis point and services who don’t know her having to step in.

Has she had her covid jab? Maybe you could use that to find out who her GP is? She sounds as though she needs professional help, even medication. Whilst it's lovely if you to try and support her, you might actually be stopping her from having the real help she needs by not contacting GP/social services.

Exactly the sort of behaviour my DM exhibited before the diagnosis of dementia.
Age UK might be more helpful than SS.

Not sure what you really want here OP. You had another thread about helping her fixing the gate where people advised you not to but it seems you ignored the advice and, surprise surprise, it's panning out exactly how posters said it would. It might give you a nice glow to be able to say that you're not doing building to avoid upsetting her, that you will be he support, that you will ask your surveyor what s/he thinks but you are potentially making your future life very difficult.

This actually sounds like my mother who is elderly but has always been like this due to her mental health, not dementia. My dad absorbed a lot of her anger, over-thinking, suspicions, accusations and neediness but after he passed away, these went outwards to neighbours (she starts feuds and thinks they turned against her) , the doctors (all useless), tradesmen (thieves, incompetent), friends (her neediness and demands become too much for normal friendships), me and my siblings (awful, never phone or visit - 3 times a week actually).

Given her recent bereavement, she is probably struggling as she has no support network. This can be an exceptionally hard and may be why she's inventing reasons for your DH to go round - she just needs the human contact. Maybe there are telephone befriending or counselling services? My DM found these helpful, although I don't know how you might tactfully suggest them.

I've been in touch with mother's LA adult social services and GP and even after she made suicide threats, they were not prepared to do anything until after she'd actually made a suicide attempt. It may be different in other LA's but their resources are severely stretched and as a functioning adult and without her consent, there is little they will do. If I were in your situation I would perhaps contact adult social care anyway but I expect they will do little unless the person is at significant risk and it doesn't sound like she is.

You sound really kind, but from my experience I'd try to get on with my life and keep her at arm's length as she may well fall out with you or accuse you of something anyway. You don't want to become de facto social services / family for her as unless you know how to deal with someone like this, it could become very difficult and awkward for you and for her too.

It's admirable to want to help but I'd be more worried about her burning down the place or accusing you of stealing from her. How is she getting food in? Is she still cooking? Is she still driving? She probably is a danger on the roads if she is still driving.

She has no family, just lost her husband, and something is definitely not 'right' with her. You've known her two years. You absolutely cannot take responsibility for this situation on your own, you must alert social services to her plight ASAP, otherwise if she deteriorates rapidly you might find yourself with all kinds of unmanageable situations on your hands and no swift solution. The support from authorities needs to be in place before that happens OP.
You sound really lovely, but you can't let this go on as it is. She sounds at the very least very fearful - and who wouldn't be in her situation? It sounds like she hasn't got anyone except you, is that right?