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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

Unwanted house guest

44 replies

Snowstorm543 · 09/02/2021 09:06

Hello, I'm a regular on here but have name changed for this. Not sure if I've posted in the right section or if anyone can even advise me on this impossible situation.
My mil moved in with DH and I about 3 months ago. I knew it wouldn't work and warned DH but had to go along with it for various reasons that I can't go into without identifying myself. She has money and has a house of her own which is currently rented out. No health issues and could live on her own.
Anyway, as expected it didn't take long for things to go wrong and her and DH just can't get along and I can't stand her. She's said some awful things whilst staying here. Now as well as me, DH wants her out too. They had a huge argument where he told her it's best if she leaves and that we will support her and look out for her even if she lives alone nearby.
The problem we have now is that she refuses to go saying it's our job to look after her and that she has every right to be here. I just don't understand why anyone would want to stay somewhere they are not wanted. What can we do about this mess?

OP posts:

Sssloou · 09/02/2021 09:18

Give a deadline.

Rinse and repeat - calmly and gently.

Can you support the logistics?

What options are there?

How old is she? Has she lived alone before?
Is she unwell mentally?

EvenMoreFuriousVexation · 09/02/2021 09:22

Give her a letter with 7 days' notice to leave the property. She's obviously going to dig her heels in and the relationship between her and your DH has already broken down, so it's not going to make it any worse.

All the letter needs to say is "You need to leave the property by X date" - you don't have to give reasons.

What she then does is up to her, but if you've given her the letter you can legally get her removed if she refuses to go on the date. It will be fucking horrible and I'd hope she'd see sense before that and make other arrangements.

Don't listen to "but lockdown!" from her - she can go back to her own house, move in with other family, or get a short-term rental herself. Not your problem.

I'd get your DH to lead this as it's his mum (and also you told him it wouldn't work!)

Sssloou · 09/02/2021 09:22

Just keep moving on with actions around the logistics - and avoid engaging with circular arguments.

Are there family or friends who could support - she may be a bit embarrassed or considered in her approach if it was outside the dynamic with her son.

What are they rowing about?

Original poster

Snowstorm543 · 09/02/2021 10:45

Thanks for the helpful advice. I couldn't even think straight. Will just carry on with moving her things and she can't very well stay here without her things! If that goes wrong then will involve family or go via the letter route which will turn things very nasty. They argue about everything - she bags, interferes, is nosy, makes awful comments about how useless DH is and how everything we do is wrong. The list goes on.

OP posts:

Sssloou · 09/02/2021 10:54

Yes actions not words.

Detach emotionally and just keep doing stuff.

It sounds a horrendous situation for you to be in.

Sssloou · 09/02/2021 10:57

Encourage and support your DH to intercept his emotions when she triggers him.

Can he choose to be indifferent, calm, disengaged and walk away?

giletrouge · 09/02/2021 11:03

How old is she? Is she in any way ill, vulnerable, or disabled?
Can she give notice to the person living in her house - or is that impossible because of Covid at the moment?
This is a very tricky situation but you're not responsible for her, and you do both need to stay as calm as possible otherwise the fire keeps being fed. So what if she criticises - that's in her head - you know if it's not valid - the best thing is to hardly even listen to her!

Original poster

Snowstorm543 · 09/02/2021 11:31

She's 65, no health issues but just acts a bit old for her age if you see what I mean. Late fil used to handle all her affairs, paperwork etc so she needs help with that sort of thing. Low confidence, no friends etc. Will make sure we stay calm and zone out her comments, it's the only way. DH's sister is going to intervene to help calm things too.

OP posts:

Puzzledandpissedoff · 09/02/2021 11:39

She refuses to go saying it's our job to look after her and that she has every right to be here

It's an unusual position to take, and I wonder if there are cultural issues involved here?

The good news of course is that you and DH are on the same page with this, and basically if you want her to go then she goes - just as well, since she was obviously expecting this to be for life
If it helps, maybe remember that you'll be doing her a favour too, in encouraging her into an independent life rather than a gradual decline as a result of doing almost nothing for herself

AttilaTheMeerkat · 09/02/2021 11:47

You did warn him so in future he will need to determine exactly why he did not listen. His mother just wanted you people to carry on in the same enabler type role as her late DH (she perhaps treated him with overall contempt).

There are good reasons why such people have no friends OP, she has likely not wanted them or has driven them all away because of her behaviours.

What does your DHs sister think of all this from her mother?.

YoniAndGuy · 09/02/2021 12:03

I'm not sure about the letter. It makes it a bit 'official' - as if you're trying to end some sort of tenancy? I wouldn't write anything down - as it stands, she's no 'proof' at all that she has any right to be there or has ever been there at all. Don't give her a bit of paper that she could theoretically take to a solicitor and say 'Look they're trying to evict me'.

Ignore. Move every single one of her things. Involve family. Don't make meals for her. Put a lock on the door of the room she's been sleeping in once all her things are gone.

REignbow · 09/02/2021 12:35

As the PP stated, you warned your DH and he didn’t listen.

I’d be inclined, to change the locks once you have removed all her items and possibly rent her a place in a sheltered apartment.

However, she’ll probably call on some flying monkeys to try and guilt him into letting her stay (she’s your mum, you can’t do this etc). Or she’ll just keep turning up.

LemonTT · 09/02/2021 12:56

I think you all need to come down a few ladders here before it escalates into a deep family rift. I expect there are other relatives who will have views on what happens next and make judgements about all concerned. Don’t expect that to be in your favour.

Whilst the situation needs to come to an end, she doesn’t have a home to return to as she has rented out hers. This isn’t going to resolve itself quickly. Your husband played a part in causing the problem and can’t just wash his hands of that problem.

Original poster

Snowstorm543 · 09/02/2021 13:43

Thanks. I should have made it clear that DH isn't planning on just throwing her out with nowhere to go. He's finding her another place nearby to rent and the rental income from her house will subsidise the rent on the new place. DH and DSIL have agreed to jointly cover any shortfall. So he's trying to do it as amicably as he can and we would still help her out. It's just that she's refusing to leave.
Agree now that a letter isn't a good idea after all and will just make things too official and cause rift.

OP posts:

HollowTalk · 09/02/2021 13:45

Why can't she just give notice to the tenants in her own place?

timetest · 09/02/2021 13:58

Just seen she’s 65 and healthy. It would never occur to the average woman of that age with her own home to impose herself in that way. Give her tenants notice and move her back as quickly as possible.

LookItsMeAgain · 09/02/2021 14:03

While it's not ideal for the tenants in the house your MiL owns, you should give them notice (perhaps 3 months would be generous under current circumstances), and for those 3 months your MiL rents in this other house.
After that, she moves back to her house.
As you mentioned that your DH and his sister will jointly cover any shortfall on the rent on the house your MiL is going to be renting, you want that to be a short term thing too, so time limit all of these transactions.
That's what I would do in your situation.
If she says that she has a right to be living in your home, your DH has to say "No mum, you don't have a right to live in my home. You are a guest here. As such, guests like fish tend to go off after a few days and it's been X number of weeks. You have overstayed your welcome and it is now time for you to go" and repeat, repeat, repeat.

Oh and the notice period for the tenants - I have no idea what is normal or generous or not when it comes to renting, so go with your gut on this.

Berthatydfil · 09/02/2021 14:05

Why is there going to be a shortfall from the rental income from her house to a smaller single person home (smaller house or flat?) Unless you are talking huge differences in location or finishes she should be covering her costs or making a surplus.
And beware of offering to be a guarantor on this rent as she might just refuse to pay it.
If her house is too big/costly to run etc she should be looking at downsizing permanently not expecting her children to subsidise her. And if the house is suitable then once Covid allows she needs to give the tenants notice and move back.

billybagpuss · 09/02/2021 14:14

I don't understand why she says its your responsibility to look after her if she is otherwise fit and healthy. What is she afraid of, did something happen when she was living alone? Thats the end of the empathy though, she's being dreadful to you and needs to go but unless there is some huge backstory and she's always been clingy and difficult it seems a weird stance to take.

TheLaughingGenome · 09/02/2021 14:25

Who organised her renting out her house (and all the complicated logistics and financial admin of that) if she's so supposedly useless?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 09/02/2021 14:34

DH isn't planning on just throwing her out with nowhere to go. He's finding her another place nearby to rent and the rental income from her house will subsidise the rent on the new place. DH and DSIL have agreed to jointly cover any shortfall

I wouldn't expect him to "throw her out", and that sounds ideal - very generous in fact - so I don't see how you could be fairer

From what you've said it doesn't sound as if she needs to live with you, but that she wants to - but unfortunately for her, wanting isn't the same as getting

TellingBone · 09/02/2021 22:55

@TheLaughingGenome

Who organised her renting out her house (and all the complicated logistics and financial admin of that) if she's so supposedly useless?

Yes. How did this all come about and what did she say were her reasons for renting out her own place?

littlefireseverywhere · 09/02/2021 23:01

Oh goodness, you’re living my idea of hell. Thank goodness you & DH are on the same page.

Bluntness100 · 09/02/2021 23:06

Is there a cultural element to this op?

pog100 · 09/02/2021 23:09

I'm not sure how relevant it actually is here but the minimum notice to terminate tenancy is 6 months during Covid and eviction is very difficult, so returning to her house isn't possible in the short term.

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